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Did Jesus say obviously " I am a God" in Gospel?

wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
He didn't actually say “Christ” in Luke, should have removed that word...in fact he is saying any who proclaim Yeshua as God, do not go after them...so lets include all the other Eggizo references....

Joh 6:48 (48) I (EGO) am (I-Mee) that bread of life.

1Pe 4:7
(7) But the end of all things is ‘at hand’ (eggizō): be ye therefore sober, and watch unto prayer.

Rom 13:12
(12) The night is far spent, the day is ‘at hand’ (eggizō): let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.

Jas 5:8
(8) Be ye also patient; stablish your hearts: for the coming of the Lord ‘draweth nigh’ (eggizō):
So anyone following these in Yeshua own words are following the Anti-Christ’s….
 

Popeyesays

Well-Known Member
"That would seem to this haggard mystic to be a rather profound claim. The kicker is you have to know what "light" he is talking about before it really hits home. In my warped view the key action phrase is "the light of life". To my narrow understanding that is a direct reference to the "soul". It doesn't take much to realize there is only one who can quicken ones pace to see the soul for what it is... your hotline to "god".

I agree with Dawn, some things don't have to be said when they are abundantly obvious to anyone with the eyes to see -- and heck, I'm not even a Christian and I can see it plain as a daystar or sun and in this case a "Sun of God". But heck, what would I know, eh? No doubt many can trot out endless passages from esteemed authors that verify their jaundiced views."

That part of it, Paul, I agree with. The rest of it was mostly puffery, but that is right on the money.

Regards,

Scott
 

rocketman

Out there...
My question is...

Did Jesus (PBUH) say obviously " I am a God" in Gospel?


I would say absolutely, yes. The fact that he calls himself by the divine name in John 8:58 seals it for me. Anyone who understands the non-negotiable monotheism of Judaism will understand what he was saying.

Further thoughts..

The Jews of Jesus time had a very important scripture called the Shema,from Duet 6:4-9 which says: "Hear O Israel, the LORD our God is one LORD" Even in our time many Jews recite these words twice a day. It is hard to overstate how important this concept is to these people. Jesus would have known full well that any suggestion that he was even remotely of God would be interpreted as blasphemy. They didn't try to stone him for nothing.

Jesus had a chance to further explain/update or reject the shema but he did not. In Mark 12:29 when he was asked what the most important commandment is he says: "...Hear, O Isreal, the Lord our God, the Lord is one." So Jesus himself believed that there is only one God, (or at the very least that the 'parts' of God were in complete harmony.) Everything he said needs to be viewed from this perspective then.

The only 'begotten' son means the only one born of a woman, ie: the only instance of 'god in the flesh'. If the shema is right, and Jesus was bound by jewish law, then he equated himself with god, of which he believed there was only one.

In Matthew 26:64 Jesus directly admitted that he was the 'son' of god. If they were expecting the 'son' of god to be someone other than god, like, say, a carpenters son, then why did they then accuse him of blasphemy? (that instance of the term 'son of god' to those jews simply meant god-in-the-flesh; they only believed in one god remember)

In Luke 4:8 Jesus himself quotes Deut 6:13 which says 'worship the Lord your God and serve him only' - and yet later he allows Thomas to worship him. He also allows a another man to worship him in John 9:38. Remember, he is bound by the Shema.

In Luke 19:44 Jesus is quoted as saying "..they will not leave one stone on another because you did not recognise the time of God's coming to you." I don't think it gets plainer than that.

Another reason some say he had to be god is because whoever was to die in our place had to be both worth more than all of us put together and blameless, obviously - so the contract required someone from adams race, a race he entered into. Hebrews makes it clear he was not an angel in human form.

To the islamic gentleman who started this thread: sir, respectfully I say to you that many christians believe in only one god. They also believe that he was powerful enough to be able to be both fully man and fully god at the same time. Some find it insulting to god to suggest that he would allow himself to be human but we must accept that he invented humans in the first place, and that he fills heaven and earth, even the disgusting parts. Christians generally believe that god's character is such that he would do whatever it takes to save his children, even if that meant simulataneously becoming one of us.

The whole 'praying to himself' thing is not really an issue - it's 'what he would do if he were one of us'. Think about it.

In between Jesus deliberatley keeping his identity largely a secret throughout the gospels and our difficulty in comprehending how god could steer the ship and exist in a human body at the same time, no wonder this is a difficult subject.
 

Darkness

Psychoanalyst/Marxist
Comprehend said:
John 10:17-18
17 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again.
18 No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.

Paul disagrees:
Galatians 1:1
Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead;)
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
John 10:17-18
17 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again.
18 No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.

The last sentence strongly implies that this ability wasn't inherent to Jesus, and that he had it given to him by God.
 

wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
doppelgänger;957160 said:
Perhaps the real problem is that we can't save "God" without "God being one of us." :cool:
So according to Zechariah 11 we killed God for 30 pieces of silver....That doesn't really say much for us all, saying we then care about God in the same sentence; when we can believe that it was right to kill Yeshua....
 

love

tri-polar optimist
Jesus did not say "I am a God". Christ walked in the mortal, perishable flesh. But His life clearly attests to the fact that His Spirit and the Spirit of the One and only God were One and the Same.
We do not have to walk through seven heavens to reach Him. He came to us.
 

wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
He came to us.
So we killed him and made it into a religion to worship how arrogant we are??...
Don't we feel that when it says “God is a just God” and “sees the prophets precious in his sight”, why don't we see that as wrong then, and mourn for the one we pierced, rather then rejoice?
 

love

tri-polar optimist
Wizanda, you are so far off the mark you not even playing in the same field.
Did you miss the part that He freely gave up His life that we may have life more abundantly?
It would be arrogant to think we could take His life by our will.
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
Did you miss the part that He freely gave up His life that we may have life more abundantly?
It would be arrogant to think we could take His life by our will.
Speaking as devil's advocate for a moment, the Gospel doesn't describe Jesus turning himself in; the soldiers find him and arrest him. Also, a person doesn't usually have to be physically nailed in place if he was going to go and stay there voluntarily.
 

Popeyesays

Well-Known Member
Did you miss the part that He freely gave up His life that we may have life more abundantly?
It would be arrogant to think we could take His life by our will.

Jesus said in humble prayer that He would rather not die, but that as a servant of God He would face that reality if He had to.

God did not send Him to die. We killed him. He was a mortal man as He walked the earth and all mortal men die eventually, so if His death had come as an old man with the entire known world honoring Him everyday, He still would have died and His death would have been the sacrifice of which you speak.

God sends the Prophet to us and suffering is Their lot, but suffering at OUR hands, not God's. We deny Them. We ridicule Them. We beat Them. We drive Them into exile, We imprison Them. We kill Them. Very rarely one of Them comes to honor eventually. The Buddha died peacefully, so did Baha`u'llah and Zoroaster. Zoroaster died in palatial surroundings though Hehad lived there for not very long. Baha`u'llah was still an exile and a prisoner in Palestine when He ascended. Muhammed passed on the object of love and veneration by thousands, but He too had been driven into exile by enemies hot after His blood.

God decrees that mortal man will die. He does not decree that we die at the hands of our fellow human beings. Jesus died at the hand of man, not God.

Regards,

Scott
 

sandy whitelinger

Veteran Member
Christ's purpose on earth wasn't to PROVE His divinity. His purpose was to teach us how to commune with God in a parent/child relationship. And then to show us via His sacrifice that we are to sacrifice our own flesh..abandon the ways of this world, to pick up our own cross and follow Him.
That is some strange splicing of theology.
 
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