Discussion of Thunder: The Perfect Mind

[YmirGF]

It's sort of like the idea of "killing the Buddha". In which, if you think you've reached enlightenment or "Buddhahood", kill it immediatley, because you haven't reached it.

Does any of what I said make sense? :cover:

It makes a great deal of sense Becky. Those who know, will NEVER insist that they are right. It is a fundamental "calling card". You can gauge the depth of the "error" by the strength of the assertion that some claim to "have it right".

It like the person telling a lie. The more they deny they are lying, the higher the probability that indeed they are in fact lying. Truth does not need to defend itself.

 

[Buttons*]

Monday again! You know what that means

I am knowledge and ignorance.
I am shame and fearlessness.
I am shameless and ashamed.
I am strength and fear.
I am war and peace.
Hear what I say.
I am the disgraced and the grand being.

Consider my poverty and wealth.
Don't be arrogant when I am cast down on the earth,
and you will find me in those who are to come.
Don't stare at my lying on a dung heap.
Don't run off and cast me away.
In the kingdoms you will find me.
Don't stare when I am cast with the disgraced
in the most sordid places
or laugh at me.
Don't throw me out amog those violently slaughtered.
I am compassionate and cruel.

 

[Moni_Gail]

I think it depends on your definition of perfection. Typically we see perfection as being all good, or created without a flaw - like a perfect diamond.

My definition, and perhaps the one used by the writer of Thunder, is that perfection is "completeness". A perfect thing being absolutely complete, lacking nothing. In this case God would be perfect, as It lacks nothing, it contains everything - good and bad; beautiful and ugly; virginal and defiled.

In light of this last bit I'd like to quote Paul. I think this about covers it.

 

[Buttons*]

The poem talks about many of the same things. I believe the reason for stating, and restating what she's saying, and calling to the reader "hear me!" is begging you to understand and see through the words. There's so much more behind the veil

 

[Comet]

The poem talks about many of the same things. I believe the reason for stating, and restating what she's saying, and calling to the reader "hear me!" is begging you to understand and see through the words. There's so much more behind the veil

Sorry, I've been off a couple of days....

I do agree with Buttons here:

"HEAR ME!" (I refer to my previous posts and agree with Halcyon again: DIVINE WISDOM)

 

[Bishka]

Monday again! You know what that means

I am knowledge and ignorance.
I am shame and fearlessness.
I am shameless and ashamed.
I am strength and fear.
I am war and peace.
Hear what I say.
I am the disgraced and the grand being.

To me, this part illustrates, that this being, or that whatever you see this is, is everything. If it is the One, it is everything, or in everything. It is one side and the other. Without happiness, you cannot have sadness, because you don't know one from the other.

Consider my poverty and wealth.
Don't be arrogant when I am cast down on the earth,
and you will find me in those who are to come.
Don't stare at my lying on a dung heap.
Don't run off and cast me away.
In the kingdoms you will find me.
Don't stare when I am cast with the disgraced
in the most sordid places
or laugh at me.
Don't throw me out amog those violently slaughtered.
I am compassionate and cruel.

I'm not really sure what this is trying to portray, but it does strike a chord in me, it's almost something that I cannot say, or cannot figure out how to say.

 

[Halcyon]

I am knowledge and ignorance.
I am shame and fearlessness.
I am shameless and ashamed.
I am strength and fear.
I am war and peace.
Hear what I say.
I am the disgraced and the grand being.

I agree with what becky said for this first part.

Consider my poverty and wealth.
Don't be arrogant when I am cast down on the earth,
and you will find me in those who are to come.
Don't stare at my lying on a dung heap.
Don't run off and cast me away.
In the kingdoms you will find me.
Don't stare when I am cast with the disgraced
in the most sordid places
or laugh at me.
Don't throw me out amog those violently slaughtered.
I am compassionate and cruel.

With this, i'll have to go with Wisdom again. Or, perhaps, love.

 

[Comet]

1st part:

To me, this part illustrates, that this being, or that whatever you see this is, is everything. If it is the One, it is everything, or in everything. It is one side and the other. Without happiness, you cannot have sadness, because you don't know one from the other.

I agree, but I see both things as the same thing....

2nd part:

Consider my poverty and wealth.
Don't be arrogant when I am cast down on the earth,
and you will find me in those who are to come.
Don't stare at my lying on a dung heap.
Don't run off and cast me away.
In the kingdoms you will find me.
Don't stare when I am cast with the disgraced
in the most sordid places
or laugh at me.
Don't throw me out amog those violently slaughtered.
I am compassionate and cruel.

I think this speaks of a few things:

1. It speaks of Human Hubris
2. It speaks of the divine/wisdom in ALL things
3. It calls us to "hear/see" that we should not be so hubris, ignorant, or judgemental

It is "sheep" that are led blindly to the slaughter, it is those who "hear/see" that find something more in things....

 

[Buttons*]

Be careful.
Don't hate my obedience
or love my self control.
When I am weak, don't forsake me
or fear my power.
Why do you despise my fear
and curse my pride?
I am a woman existing in every fear
and in my strength when I tremble.
I am a woman, weak,
and carefree in a pleasant place.
I am senseless and wise.

*sigh* so beautiful...

 

[Buttons*]

Be careful.
Don't hate my obedience
or love my self control.
When I am weak, don't forsake me
or fear my power.
Why do you despise my fear
and curse my pride?
I am a woman existing in every fear
and in my strength when I tremble.
I am a woman, weak,
and carefree in a pleasant place.
I am senseless and wise.

*sigh* so beautiful...

no thoughts? Should I continue on?

 

[gnostic]

I think this section is quite clear in its context, and yes, it's also quite poetic.

ps. Are you now taking a rest now, Buttons*? Well, taking a break on a hammock is a good idea. Particularly after all that somersaulting and rolling around you've been doing can be a lot of fun for Giant Panda, but quite tiring.

 

[ChrisP]

Well, taking a break on a hammock is a good idea.

Especially with her new hammock.

Remember to dry clean them when you're done alright.

 

[Kay]

no thoughts? Should I continue on?

A thought popped into my brain when I first read this, but I didn't post it because I didn't want to be cheeky. Oh well, here it is:

I'm a b*tch, I'm a lover
I'm a child, I'm a mother
I'm a sinner, I'm a saint
I do not feel ashamed
I'm your hell, I'm your dream
I'm nothing in between
You know you wouldn't want it any other way

I'm a b*tch, I'm a tease
I'm a goddess on my knees
When you hurt, when you suffer
I'm your angel undercover
I've been numb, I'm revived
Can't say I'm not alive
You know I wouldn't want it any other way

 

[Buttons*]

A thought popped into my brain when I first read this, but I didn't post it because I didn't want to be cheeky. Oh well, here it is:

I'm a b*tch, I'm a lover
I'm a child, I'm a mother
I'm a sinner, I'm a saint
I do not feel ashamed
I'm your hell, I'm your dream
I'm nothing in between
You know you wouldn't want it any other way

I'm a b*tch, I'm a tease
I'm a goddess on my knees
When you hurt, when you suffer
I'm your angel undercover
I've been numb, I'm revived
Can't say I'm not alive
You know I wouldn't want it any other way

LOL i love that song, and yeah, I think of it too when I read this poem

I'll post the next one tonight

 

[Halcyon]

Be careful.
Don't hate my obedience
or love my self control.
When I am weak, don't forsake me
or fear my power.
Why do you despise my fear
and curse my pride?
I am a woman existing in every fear
and in my strength when I tremble.
I am a woman, weak,
and carefree in a pleasant place.
I am senseless and wise.

*sigh* so beautiful...

Perhaps this is more to do with the Aeon herself. It all depends on who we decide this character is, Sophia, Barbelo, Norea, they're all possibilities.
If Sophia i would say it speaks again of personal Wisdom. If Barbelo perhaps it speaks of her nature as the Father's image.

 

[Buttons*]

Perhaps this is more to do with the Aeon herself. It all depends on who we decide this character is, Sophia, Barbelo, Norea, they're all possibilities.
If Sophia i would say it speaks again of personal Wisdom. If Barbelo perhaps it speaks of her nature as the Father's image.

What do you think about it being a combination of all the female voices of Gnostic lit?

 

[Buttons*]

I think this section is quite clear in its context, and yes, it's also quite poetic.

ps. Are you now taking a rest now, Buttons*? Well, taking a break on a hammock is a good idea. Particularly after all that somersaulting and rolling around you've been doing can be a lot of fun for Giant Panda, but quite tiring.

well since the whole thing is a poem, it's only natural that it would be poetic

Yeah, hammock for the holidays

 

[Halcyon]

What do you think about it being a combination of all the female voices of Gnostic lit?

Perhaps. who can say for sure? Apart from Habakuk obviously...

 

[Buttons*]

Perhaps. who can say for sure? Apart from Habakuk obviously...

LOL, now, now Paulus let's be kind... ignorance is bliss for some they say

 

[Buttons*]

Why have you hated me in your counsels?
I will be silent among the silent
and appear and speak.
Greeks, why do you hate me?
Because I am barbarian among the barbarians?
I am the wisdom of Greeks and knowledge of barbarians.
I am the judgement of Greks and barbarians.
My image is great in Egypt, and I have no image among th barbarians.
I am hated eveywhere and loved everywhere.
I am called life and you have called me death.
I am called law and you have called me lawlessness.
I am one you pursued and siezed.
I am one you scattered and gathered together.
I am one before whom you are ashamed,
and to me you are shameless.
I am the woman who attends no festival
and whose festivals are many.
I am godless and one whose god is great.
I am one you studied and you scorn me.
I amd unlettered and you learn from me.
I am one you despise and you study me.
I am one you hid from and you appear to me.
When you hide I show.
When you appear I hide...