Do You Believe In God, Why? Don't You Believe In God, Why?

[Subduction Zone]

Evolution works in exactly the same way, in terms of a buildup of changes.

If all your ancestors of the past 10 million years would hold hands and you'ld go back looking at their appearance one by one, there would be no single individual of which you would be able to say "this one is not a human", while the one right next to it is a human. It doesn't work that way, because evolution is a gradual process.

The same goes with your age indeed.
If you'ld look at a picture of your face from every day of your life, starting as a child and ending as an adult, there would be no single picture of which you would say "in this picture I'm not an adult", while in the picture right next to it you are an adult. It just doesn't work that way.

Here's a nice analogy using color:


View attachment 46802

Sorry if you can't read it, I didn't immediately find a better quality picture.
Anyhow, the text starts out as read and ends in blue. Please, show me the "first" blue word in the paragraph, where the one immediately before it, is still red.

Evolution is the exact same. It is the nature of gradual change.

This might be bigger:

 

[Skywalker]

Can you rephrase that question so that it actually makes sense? It reads like you started one sentence and then finished another, as if you switched sentences mid-way.


In any case, when are you going to define this word "kind" you seem so fond of using?

Different species are different kinds. Lions and tigers breed outliers like ligers. Lions and tigers are not the same kind.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Something gradual doesn't just have gray areas and intermediates, but those, and the absolute definition of what constitutes it, are determined on a case by case basis.

I have no idea what you are trying to communicate here.
Reads like word salad to me.

Care to rephrase?

What exactly is your objection to evolution being a gradual process?

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Every belief takes faith. We are believers, not knowers.

Every belief that isn't supported by evidence, that is.
Like religious beliefs.

Scientific beliefs are evidence based, not faith based.

 

[Subduction Zone]

That doesn't explain the notion of gradualness is explained by evolution being on a population level. That implies that it's not possible on an individual level. It's also not possible for individuals not to be able to develop the traits needed to survive a certain environment, but the population does.

Just as languages change so does life. Do you think that the change from Latin to Spanish occurred overnight? Also one person adopting his own slang does not change language. That is why one animal with a mutation is not evolution. It is not until changes are adopted by a population that languages change. The same applies to life. It is not until changes are part of the genome of a population that even mircroevolution has occurred.

 

[janesix]

That's not an answer to the question. I asked what you think. Do you think evolution is totally random?

I don't think evolution is random at all. And I'm not even sure evolution is a thing at all. But I suspect you are asking what I believe about what the theory of evolution states, and no, it is not totally random in that sense. I think evolutionists would say there is some component of randomness, and some component of predictability( I have seen studies on this) and components such as environment which may explain things like convergent evolution.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

That doesn't explain the notion of gradualness is explained by evolution being on a population level.

This statement makes very little sense.
Mutations accumulate over generations as they spread in a population.

Gradual evolution. Population dynamics.

That implies that it's not possible on an individual level.

This statement makes even less sense.
Please, just stop.... go and inform yourself. Your level of knowledge of the scientific theory you are helbend on arguing against is disturbingly non-existing.

The only thing implied by your statements on the topic, is how little you know about it.

It's also not possible for individuals not to be able to develop the traits needed to survive a certain environment, but the population does.

You understand a population consists of individuals right?

Individual A has a beneficial mutation that gives it an advantage over its peers.
Individual A is thus more likely to survive and produce off spring, spreading its genes (including the beneficial mutation). Those without the mutation, have less chance then A to do the same. The mutation of A thus becomes more prevalent in the population after X amount of generations.
Because the off spring of A has the same advantage over their peers (= the off spring of those that do not have this mutation). Again they are more successful in surviving and spreading their genes.

After X amount of generations, this mutation achieves fixation. Which means that almost all individuals of the population now have this mutation. It has thus become part of the collective genepool. Evolution has occurred now. A trait that started in a single individual, spread across the population.

If that single individual, or its off spring, was killed (by anything), preventing them from further spreading their genes, then that mutation wouldn't have achieved fixation. And the trait will not have ended up being present in the population at large.

Get it now?

My guess is that you don't. I expect you to repeat the same mistake within 2 posts.

 

[janesix]

Make a prediction based on your theory. Make it one you don't already know the answer to. Let's see what happens.

Ok. I predict that the nearest stars to the sun will have relationships(of distances, diameters) to the sun, and to each other, in either harmonic ratios(octaves, fifths, fourths), in ratios that produce square roots of small numbers(especially 2,3, and 5).

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Different species are different kinds

So is a subspecies of a species still the same "kind"?

Lions and tigers breed outliers like ligers. Lions and tigers are not the same kind.

Aren't they both felines?

 

[Skywalker]

Uh huh. Just keep telling yourself that.

And why are you arguing against the fact of evolution? Guess what, the fact that the Bible supports a Flat Earth more than a spherical one (do you remember all of those arguments that you lost?) does not refute God. The fact that the Bible says that the Earth is fixed and at the center of the universe and everything rotates around it does not refute God. The fact that life is the product of evolution and Genesis is mythical does not refute God. Some of those facts may refute your version of God but it does not refute God himself. Instead of trying to defend the indefensible you should try to understand why you are wrong.

And guess what? If you do not take the Bible literally you do not have the problem of the incredibly evil moral character of your version of God. You can just toss the uncomfortable parts of the Bible. Heck you probably already do that to some degree. I am pretty sure I can find parts of the Bible that you will deny.

Jesus didn't literally see all the kingdoms of the world from Mount Tabor. It wouldn't even be possible from Mount Everest. It was a vision.

 

[Skywalker]

So is a subspecies of a species still the same "kind"?


Aren't they both felines?

Caspian tigers were the same kind of siberian tigers. They might not have been as alike as some people say, they were more like cousin subspecies.

Kingdom and domain organisms are not the same kind, even though to an extent lions and tigers are the same kind.

 

[janesix]

There

The universe is not based on our choice of units, so the moon being 2160 miles across is a coincidence, not anything fundamental. If we measure it in kilometers, it has a different number. The same goes with your other examples.

Pure numerology.

There are no coincidences. Every system of measurement was given to us by the Universe, or God. This includes the Imperial system, as well as the metric. And every system, no matter how obscure or the timeframe, is interconnected. Many are subsystems related to latitude on the Earth, of a monument, building, cathedral, megalithic site etc. Even modern building often relate to this measuring system or latitudinal subsystem. Some temples and cathedrals even have more than one measuring system employed in a single building. One reason is to keep whole numbers, but there are also religious reasons and geological/latitudinal.

 

[janesix]

Huh? Not following. Explain, please.

You and others have claimed that environmental factors cause organisms to evolve certain ways( like water organisms being streamlined for water) There are marsupial dogs and placental dogs. What sort of environment would cause a dog like animal to evolve?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Jesus didn't literally see all the kingdoms of the world from Mount Tabor. It wouldn't even be possible from Mount Everest. It was a vision.

So why climb a mountain? Why didn't he got to the basement of the Alamo?

 

[janesix]

Argument from personal incredulity?
Whaaaa?!

.
No wonder you're skeptical -- you don't understand evolution.
Why do you think they call natural selection "selection?" -- cause it's not random!

Google "Natural selection."

Evidence?

Everything in the universe has electromagnetic properties. I suggest you look into "electric universe" "halton arp" and "interference theory". I do not have time to explain. It has taken years of study. In fact a decade. A decade of being taught actually. The Universe did most of the work.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You and others have claimed that environmental factors cause organisms to evolve certain ways( like water organisms being streamlined for water) There are marsupial dogs and placental dogs. What sort of environment would cause a dog like animal to evolve?

No, there are no "marsupial dogs". Dogs are placental mammals descended from wolves. And why even ask such a question?

 

[Skywalker]

So why climb a mountain? Why didn't he got to the basement of the Alamo?

Satan tempted Jesus in the Judean desert. Mount of Temptation - Wikipedia

 

[Subduction Zone]

Everything in the universe has electromagnetic properties. I suggest you look into "electric universe" "halton arp" and "interference theory". I do not have time to explain. It has taken years of study. In fact a decade. A decade of being taught actually. The Universe did most of the work.

The 'electric universe' is simply woo woo by the scientifically illiterate. I have never heard of "interference theory" but I am willing to bet that it is an oxymoron at best.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Satan tempted Jesus in the Judean desert. Mount of Temptation - Wikipedia

Ooh look! Another fined product by Dodge!!

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Caspian tigers were the same kind of siberian tigers. They might not have been as alike as some people say, they were more like cousin subspecies.

Kingdom and domain organisms are not the same kind, even though to an extent lions and tigers are the same kind.

You didn't answer the questions.

Are subspecies still the same kind as the parent species they speciated from?

And aren't tigers and lions both felines?