Do you have Bible questions today?

[Audie]

I'll gladly live with being overmatched by your post if I get in the narrow gate haha. Can you live with it with your free will choice of going thru the w-i-i-i-d-d-d-e gate? I'm told many people choose that because they think it's pearly gates are beautiful and look like it has to be it, it's popular, and easy. OTOH, one may have to leave everything they have behind to get through the narrow gate.

This is probably metaphor as it discusses the prophecies.

Yeah whatevs.

 

[Audie]

No, it means to the reader whatever they think it means. If the text says "red", the readers don't think it means "blue". They think it means whatever "red" means, to them. You're deliberately being dishonest and misleading by claiming the text says whatever anyone wants it to say. The text says what it says. That has nothing to do with what anyone wants it to say. It's the interpretation of the text that is subjective, not the text itself. And it doesn't mean "whatever anyone likes", it means whatever makes sense to the reader according to their own unique knowledge and experience of life.

Speaking of being tiresome! Semantic arguments
are not worth reading.

 

[Deeje]

If jesus is perfect, he is not human. He cannot be sin and not sin at the same time.

Why do you think that Jesus had to come from heaven to be born as a human child on earth? He had to be the exact equivalent of Adam....i.e. a sinless, perfect human specimen. Being human does not make you sinful....being disobedient and breaking God's law makes you sinful. But part of the effect of Adam's disobedience was that he lost his perfection and so he passed that on as an inheritance to his children. (Romans 5:12) Jesus offered his perfect human body to atone for what Adam lost....not for Adam, but for his children who were born with this imperfection through no fault on their part.

Atonement means "at-one-ment" meaning one for one...."eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth...life for a life".

So, if humans are defined by our sins, jesus cannot be human. If humans are defined by their spirit, we are not god so jesus (unless he has a special spirit) can't be god either.

Since he did not die, how exactly did christians' sins die?

Good grief...talk about getting things all mixed up...

Jesus was 100% human but without sin. He was the son of God, not God incarnate. The scriptures prove that he could not be his own God and Father....how ridiculous! (John 20:17)
He died as a human and God raised him up as a spirit just as he said he would. (1 Peter 3:18)

How are you crucified by the cross when you only experienced pain but not the final consequence of it?

What final consequences are you talking about? God has promised everlasting life to all who obey him.
Jesus obeyed his Father to the letter...suffering an agonizing death as someone who did nothing to deserve it.
I would call that a noble and selfless act.

If jesus was tried for "our" sins, how did he get a "get free out of jail" card?

He didn't. The ransom that was demanded, was paid so why would he have to 'stay dead' if God could resurrect him? His mission was accomplished.

All humans are made the promise of a resurrection. It was never God's intention for anyone to die, so through Jesus he made the way to forgive us of our sins and for those in their graves to be given another chance at life.....one without sin and the interference of satan. (John 5:28-29)

The bible doesn't speak for itself; so, if you can explain it in your own words, that would be perfect!

The Bible does in many ways speak for itself, but that doesn't stop humans from putting their own slant of things.

There is one truth, and Jesus said he would arrange for that to be dispensed by those whom he appointed. (Matthew 24:45)
Those who genuinely search for the truth will find it, but those who want God to fit their own personal mold, will come to disappointment...he will never fit it.

 

[Deeje]

What is your view on William Millers (SDA) calculation from Daniel about the return of Christ?

THE 70 WEEK PROPHECY OF DANIEL

We calculate things a little differently.....we see 1914 as the start of the "end times".

"When did the counting of the “seven times” begin? After Zedekiah, the last king in the typical Kingdom of God, was removed from the throne in Jerusalem by the Babylonians. (Ezek. 21:25-27) Finally, by early October of 607 B.C.E. the last vestige of Jewish sovereignty was gone. By that time the Jewish governor, Gedaliah, who had been left in charge by the Babylonians, had been assassinated, and the remaining Jews had fled to Egypt. (Jeremiah, chapters 40-43) Reliable Bible chronology indicates that this took place 70 years before 537 B.C.E., the year in which the Jews returned from captivity; that is, it took place by early October of 607 B.C.E.

How, then, is the time calculated down to 1914? Counting 2,520 years from early October of 607 B.C.E. brings us to early October of 1914 C.E., as shown on the chart.

CALCULATING THE “SEVEN TIMES”

“Seven times” = 7 X 360 = 2,520 years

A Biblical “time,” or year = 12 X 30 days = 360. (Rev. 11:2, 3; 12:6, 14)

In the fulfillment of the “seven times” each day equals one year. (Ezek. 4:6; Num. 14:34)

Early October, 607 B.C.E., to December 31, 607 B.C.E.= 1/4 year

January 1, 606 B.C.E., to December 31, 1 B.C.E. = 606 years

January 1, 1 C.E., to December 31, 1913 = 1,913 years

January 1, 1914, to early October, 1914 = 3/4 year

Total: 2,520 years

What happened at that time? Jehovah entrusted rulership over mankind to his own Son, Jesus Christ, glorified in the heavens.—Dan. 7:13, 14.

Then why is there still so much wickedness on earth? After Christ was enthroned, Satan and his demons were hurled out of heaven and down to the earth. (Rev. 12:12) Christ as King did not immediately proceed to destroy all who refused to acknowledge Jehovah’s sovereignty and himself as the Messiah. Instead, as he had foretold, a global preaching work was to be done. (Matt. 24:14) As King he would direct a dividing of peoples of all nations, those proving to be righteous being granted the prospect of everlasting life, and the wicked being consigned to everlasting cutting-off in death. (Matt. 25:31-46) In the meantime, the very difficult conditions foretold for “the last days” would prevail. As shown under the heading “Last Days,” those events have been clearly in evidence since 1914. Before the last members of the generation that was alive in 1914 will have passed off the scene, all the things foretold will occur, including the “great tribulation” in which the present wicked world will end.—Matt. 24:21, 22, 34."

Dates — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Why do you think that Jesus had to come from heaven to be born as a human child on earth? He had to be the exact equivalent of Adam....i.e. a sinless, perfect human specimen. Being human does not make you sinful....being disobedient and breaking God's law makes you sinful. But part of the effect of Adam's disobedience was that he lost his perfection and so he passed that on as an inheritance to his children. (Romans 5:12) Jesus offered his perfect human body to atone for what Adam lost....not for Adam, but for his children who were born with this imperfection through no fault on their part.

Atonement means "at-one-ment" meaning one for one...."eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth...life for a life".


Good grief...talk about getting things all mixed up...

Jesus was 100% human but without sin. He was the son of God, not God incarnate. The scriptures prove that he could not be his own God and Father....how ridiculous! (John 20:17)
He died as a human and God raised him up as a spirit just as he said he would. (1 Peter 3:18)



What final consequences are you talking about? God has promised everlasting life to all who obey him.
Jesus obeyed his Father to the letter...suffering an agonizing death as someone who did nothing to deserve it.
I would call that a noble and selfless act.



He didn't. The ransom that was demanded, was paid so why would he have to 'stay dead' if God could resurrect him? His mission was accomplished.

All humans are made the promise of a resurrection. It was never God's intention for anyone to die, so through Jesus he made the way to forgive us of our sins and for those in their graves to be given another chance at life.....one without sin and the interference of satan. (John 5:28-29)



The Bible does in many ways speak for itself, but that doesn't stop humans from putting their own slant of things.

There is one truth, and Jesus said he would arrange for that to be dispensed by those whom he appointed. (Matthew 24:45)
Those who genuinely search for the truth will find it, but those who want God to fit their own personal mold, will come to disappointment...he will never fit it.

You got me there. I'll be back.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Daniel is not a prophet.. its an apocalypse..

The book was written in 167 BC to comfort and encourage the Jewish people who were suffering under the persecutions of Antiochus IV Epiphanes.. and his defilement of the Temple.. He sacrificed a pig to the god Zeus.. THAT was the Abomination of Desolation.

David Koresh and Jim Jones didn't understand Daniel either.

Luckily for me, is that I accept the Bible that was passed down and that we have been given in this age to decide upon these matters. It is so much simpler than rejecting them on our perceived ideas, instead having the ability to trust that God will not lead us down the wrong path, if that is Gods will for us.

In its current form, it was indeed an accurate record of what unfolded. Though other may not see it that way.

Regards Tony

 

[Subduction Zone]

We calculate things a little differently.....we see 1914 as the start of the "end times".

"When did the counting of the “seven times” begin? After Zedekiah, the last king in the typical Kingdom of God, was removed from the throne in Jerusalem by the Babylonians. (Ezek. 21:25-27) Finally, by early October of 607 B.C.E. the last vestige of Jewish sovereignty was gone. By that time the Jewish governor, Gedaliah, who had been left in charge by the Babylonians, had been assassinated, and the remaining Jews had fled to Egypt. (Jeremiah, chapters 40-43) Reliable Bible chronology indicates that this took place 70 years before 537 B.C.E., the year in which the Jews returned from captivity; that is, it took place by early October of 607 B.C.E.

How, then, is the time calculated down to 1914? Counting 2,520 years from early October of 607 B.C.E. brings us to early October of 1914 C.E., as shown on the chart.

CALCULATING THE “SEVEN TIMES”

“Seven times” = 7 X 360 = 2,520 years

A Biblical “time,” or year = 12 X 30 days = 360. (Rev. 11:2, 3; 12:6, 14)

In the fulfillment of the “seven times” each day equals one year. (Ezek. 4:6; Num. 14:34)

Early October, 607 B.C.E., to December 31, 607 B.C.E.= 1/4 year

January 1, 606 B.C.E., to December 31, 1 B.C.E. = 606 years

January 1, 1 C.E., to December 31, 1913 = 1,913 years

January 1, 1914, to early October, 1914 = 3/4 year

Total: 2,520 years

What happened at that time? Jehovah entrusted rulership over mankind to his own Son, Jesus Christ, glorified in the heavens.—Dan. 7:13, 14.

Then why is there still so much wickedness on earth? After Christ was enthroned, Satan and his demons were hurled out of heaven and down to the earth. (Rev. 12:12) Christ as King did not immediately proceed to destroy all who refused to acknowledge Jehovah’s sovereignty and himself as the Messiah. Instead, as he had foretold, a global preaching work was to be done. (Matt. 24:14) As King he would direct a dividing of peoples of all nations, those proving to be righteous being granted the prospect of everlasting life, and the wicked being consigned to everlasting cutting-off in death. (Matt. 25:31-46) In the meantime, the very difficult conditions foretold for “the last days” would prevail. As shown under the heading “Last Days,” those events have been clearly in evidence since 1914. Before the last members of the generation that was alive in 1914 will have passed off the scene, all the things foretold will occur, including the “great tribulation” in which the present wicked world will end.—Matt. 24:21, 22, 34."

Dates — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY

And @Deeje demonstrates why the Daniel prophecy is a failed prophecy.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

We calculate things a little differently.....we see 1914 as the start of the "end times".

i know the history after the great disappointment - I also know that the JW held to 1844 but in a spiritual way for quite some time. Conversations I was having in the late 1980's and early 1990's with my JW Friends were often on and about that date. It is amazing AD1844 is also AH1260 and oh so great that 1260 is mentioned often in Revelation and in Daniel.

Deeje, stay happy and well, we will always agree to disagree, because 40 years of JW conversations, has shown me that will be so.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

And @Deeje demonstrates why the Daniel prophecy is a failed prophecy.

Good thing it, it was not incorrect - But this is not this OP and I hope the poster will answer to how they see what unfolded.

Regards Tony

 

[Subduction Zone]

Good thing it, it was not incorrect - But this is not this OP and I hope the poster will answer to how they see what unfolded.

Regards Tony

Actually it was. The problem with such "prophecies" is that to get them to work people need to use contrived start dates, end dates, and lengths of time. People force the prophecy to meet their demands rather than the other way around. The only valid prophecies that I know of failed badly.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Actually it was. The problem with such "prophecies" is that to get them to work people need to use contrived start dates, end dates, and lengths of time. People force the prophecy to meet their demands rather than the other way around. The only valid prophecies that I know of failed badly.

Or they work because they are fulfilled in the way they are meant to and in the way they are written and only become clear after the fact to may of us.

Some do work it out before the event though.

Regards Tony

 

[Subduction Zone]

Or they work because they are fulfilled in the way they are meant to and in the way they are written and only become clear after the fact to may of us.

Some do work it out before the event though.

Regards Tony

If no matter what happens they are fulfilled then they have no value as prophecy.

Or if they are fulfilled no matter how one interprets them they have no value as prophecy.

 

[Deeje]

In Genesis 32:24-28.

Who is Jacob?
Jacob, grandson of Abraham, son of Isaac and brother of Esau.

Who did he wrestle with? A materialized angel.

Why was his name changed? To reflect his determination to receive the blessing given to him instead of his twin brother, Esau who had no real appreciation for spiritual things, selling Jacob his birthright for a bowl of stew.

"The faithful man Jacob struggled and endured because he loved Jehovah and valued his relationship with him. He had complete faith in Jehovah’s promise to bless his offspring. (Genesis 28:3, 4) When Jacob was almost 100 years old, he even wrestled with an angel to receive a blessing from God. (Read Genesis 32:24-28.) Was Jacob really strong enough to wrestle with this powerful angel on his own? Of course not! But he was very determined, and he proved that he would work very hard for a blessing! Jehovah blessed Jacob for his perseverance and gave him the name Israel, which means “Contender, or Perseverer, With God.” Jacob received the reward that we too are seeking, that is, Jehovah’s approval and blessing."

 

[Deeje]

where did Jesus live after the resurection? in his house? In heaven?

Jesus said that he was going to 'prepare a place in his Father's house' for his disciples. (John 14:2-3)

We don't know if heaven has an equivalent to a very large dwelling place, but Jesus said that his disciples would be where he is and said it was a house. So there is your answer....

 

[capumetu]

No it is a general question, though t here are specifics.

By accurate, you mean 100%, no approximations?

It is, however there are alterations in different versions which are not accurate. The original Bible does not exist, but we can be sure that as sure as God exists that we have what we need to please Him.

 

[capumetu]

Ok. How do you know what the Bible actually says if there is no existing original aside from the bits and pieces that were found? How were the gaps of information filled?

I think the Bible today is relatively modern interpretations that have little or nothing to do with its predecessor, assuming an original Bible once existed.

@Frank Goad

Yo' Frank: Here you go, ... capumetu is a Jehovah's Witness and is offering to answer all of your questions. Just what you've been looking for.
You ought to start a private Conversation with him and post your questions there when you come up with them. I suggest a private Conversation thread because that would keep the riff-raff out and allow you to focus on what capumetu says.

 

[capumetu]

@Frank Goad

Yo' Frank: Here you go, ... capumetu is a Jehovah's Witness and is offering to answer all of your questions. Just what you've been looking for.
You ought to start a private Conversation with him and post your questions there when you come up with them. I suggest a private Conversation thread because that would keep the riff-raff out and allow you to focus on what capumetu says.

Thank You Frank. I just started posting here and am quite ignorant in how to go about it. I wish I could give my email, but am not sure that is allowed.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Thank You Frank. I just started posting here and am quite ignorant in how to go about it. I wish I could give my email, but am not sure that is allowed.

Though you would probably not be lying about your e-mail if they allowed that here sooner or later someone would post an email address that that was not theirs.

 

[leroy]

Jesus said that he was going to 'prepare a place in his Father's house' for his disciples. (John 14:2-3)

We don't know if heaven has an equivalent to a very large dwelling place, but Jesus said that his disciples would be where he is and said it was a house. So there is your answer....

I mean where did he lived after the resurrection, but before he ascended to heaven.

Was he just a regular man that every once in a while we went to see his disciples to eat fish and talk, and then went back to his home..... Or did he lived in heaven and descended every once in a while to talk with his disciples?

 

[capumetu]

Ok. How do you know what the Bible actually says if there is no existing original aside from the bits and pieces that were found? How were the gaps of information filled?

I think the Bible today is relatively modern interpretations that have little or nothing to do with its predecessor, assuming an original Bible once existed.

Great question sir. Many ancient transcripts have been found that indicates His word is quite accurate. Daniel 12:4 pointed out how knowledge would increase in the last days, and we are in the last days.

If one looks at the King James Version of the Bible you can see God's protection. The translators wanted to remove God's name from their version, but could not do it. It seems obvious to me that God protected His name in 4 places in it's entirety. I seriously doubt that the translators simply made a mistake in those 4 verses.

As sure as God exists sir, He will see to it we have all we need to know. Thanks for the question