Do you KNOW God does not exist?

[outhouse]

It's foolish to say that "no one knows,"

I don't know about that.

There is no evidence the concept exist.

And a lot of evidence in support of it being another man made mythological concept. one out of thousands previously created by man.

 

[outhouse]

What do you call something with no evidence at all?

 

[Willamena]

I don't know about that.

There is no evidence the concept exist.

And a lot of evidence in support of it being another man made mythological concept. one out of thousands previously created by man.

Excellent quote mining!

 

[Willamena]

What do you call something with no evidence at all?

Nothing.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

So, now I can't choose that one anymore? Darn...

Haha. I dont know. Do you know (no room for Him to exist) or believe (room for Him exist but you dont believe it) He does not exist?

Or the opposites?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Nobody "knows" that God exists or does not exist, knowledge requires some rational basis in fact. You also cannot prove a universal negative, hence there is no way to disprove universal gods. You can only dismiss gods that are irrational or inherently contradictory in their construction as non-existent..

The thing is, God is just a word. How can one say they dont know God does not exist when it is something from their mind? That is like my saying I cant prove my character in my book exist because there is no rational evidence. Yet, I know he is a product of my mind and I know wrote that character. I know he does not exist in real life only on page.

Likewise, I know God does not exist. He is a product of peoples mind (you see it in his characteristics). People believe/create God to define life. Yet, it is a concept that does not exist in real life. No actual entity.

There is no rational evidence for something that does not exist to begin with.

 

[outhouse]

Excellent quote mining!

That would be a compliment, since it is factually 100% mine.

 

[Willamena]

Haha. I dont know. Do you know (no room for Him to exist) or believe (room for Him exist but you dont believe it) He does not exist?

Or the opposites?

I know (what he is), hence I am an atheist.

 

[Willamena]

That would be a compliment, since it is factually 100% mine.

It would... except for the nature of quote mining.

 

[outhouse]

It would... except for the nature of quote mining.

So I quote mined my own 100% personal opinion?

 

[Willamena]

So I quote mined my own 100% personal opinion?

You may very well have. But that's not what I was referring to.

 

[Cephus]

If it's a fact that you don't know, then fine, but if you've defined "god," as many people have, then it's a fact that you know. It's foolish to say that "no one knows," especially if you don't know it's a fact.

I can't know because I have no basis upon which to make that claim and neither do you.

I can't imagine what a 'universal negative' is, but the universe is positive, so it shouldn't be a problem.

A universal negative is something like "there are no unicorns anywhere in the universe". To prove that wrong, you'd have to simultaneously be everywhere in the universe and find no evidence of unicorns. Since that cannot be done, it cannot be proven.

 

[Cephus]

The thing is, God is just a word. How can one say they dont know God does not exist when it is something from their mind? That is like my saying I cant prove my character in my book exist because there is no rational evidence. Yet, I know he is a product of my mind and I know wrote that character. I know he does not exist in real life only on page.

Likewise, I know God does not exist. He is a product of peoples mind (you see it in his characteristics). People believe/create God to define life. Yet, it is a concept that does not exist in real life. No actual entity.

There is no rational evidence for something that does not exist to begin with.

You are only asserting that, you cannot demonstrate it. A little basic education in logic would probably help you.

 

[Mohammad Nur Syamsu]

The thing is, God is just a word. How can one say they dont know God does not exist when it is something from their mind? That is like my saying I cant prove my character in my book exist because there is no rational evidence. Yet, I know he is a product of my mind and I know wrote that character. I know he does not exist in real life only on page.

Likewise, I know God does not exist. He is a product of peoples mind (you see it in his characteristics). People believe/create God to define life. Yet, it is a concept that does not exist in real life. No actual entity.

There is no rational evidence for something that does not exist to begin with.

The existence of God is a subjective issue. With subjective issues there are always at least 2 valid conclusions. Like the painting is beautiful or ugly are both valid conclusions, regardless which is chosen.

When someone says the painting is beautiful, he asserts there exists a love for the way the painting looks in his heart. The existence of this love must be a matter of opinion, in order for beauty to be an opinion. If the existence of the love was a fact, then the beauty would be fact, and the alternative conclusion that the painting is ugly could not have been chosen.

The existence of God is a similar question to the existence of love. That is because like love God is referred to as agency of a decision. In expression of emotion the words the painting is beautiful are chosen. The love for the way the painting looks is doing the choosing, and the existence of the love is a matter of opinion.

So when I say I believe in God, then I look towards all what is in the category of agency of decisions, and choose in expression of my emotions, whether or not God exists in this spiritual domain. I choose from the available options that God does exist, and that God does not exist, either of which conclusion would be logically valid. I choose that God does exist, hence I believe in God.

 

[`mud]

Knows, knowledge, gnosis,
present tense of 'to know',
the aquisition of wisdom,
the acknowledgement of truth,
the confusion of uncertainty.
~
'mud

 

[Unveiled Artist]

You are only asserting that, you cannot demonstrate it. A little basic education in logic would probably help you.

Thank you for the insult. Can you give me rational evidence for something that does not exist in the first place? Can you give me rational evidence that has 1. Nothing to do with subjectiveness 2. No human characteristics (anger, needs, etc) ,3. human wants (perfection, eternal life), 4. Separate from our cultural outlook?

Likswise, can you find rational evidence that 1. That something invisible can exist to where someone can make the claim it does not, 2. Make the claim outside then mind AND personal experiences of the believer?

Can you separate the existence of God from human description?

If you have rational evidence for the existence of nothing, let me know.

I cannot give you any, since no entity exists for me to even start.

 

[Mohammad Nur Syamsu]

Thank you for the insult. Can you give me rational evidence for something that does not exist in the first place? Can you give me rational evidence that has 1. Nothing to do with subjectiveness 2. No human characteristics (anger, needs, etc) ,3. human wants (perfection, eternal life), 4. Separate from our cultural outlook?

Likswise, can you find rational evidence that 1. That something invisible can exist to where someone can make the claim it does not, 2. Make the claim outside then mind AND personal experiences of the believer?

Can you separate the existence of God from human description?

If you have rational evidence for the existence of nothing, let me know.

I cannot give you any, since no entity exists for me to even start.

We have evidence that freedom is real and relevant in the universe at large. That the universe does not exist of neccesity but is created, and that things in the univetse can turn out several different ways. Choosing is not exclusively human but is how the universe works fundamentally. And for all decisions in the universe only subjectivity can express what it is that makes the decision turn out the way it did. Including for people, there is no evidence for the existence of the soul or their emotions. We can see people can go left or right, and the weather can turn out different ways, and it is all decided. Only belief, opinion, provides the answer what it is that makes any of these decisions turn out the way they do.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

We have evidence that freedom is real and relevant in the universe at large. That the universe does not exist of neccesity but is created, and that things in the univetse can turn out several different ways. Choosing is not exclusively human but is how the universe works fundamentally. And for all decisions in the universe only subjectivity can express what it is that makes the decision turn out the way it did. Including for people, there is no evidence for the existence of the soul or their emotions. We can see people can go left or right, and the weather can turn out different ways, and it is all decided. Only belief, opinion, provides the answer what it is that makes any of these decisions turn out the way they do.

If I understand correctly, Id say the universe does not choose or decide. Something doesnt appear from nothing; it also doesnt disapear into nothing. We believe we create things but in reality we using what is already provided to create something new. It didnt come from nothing.

The universe doesnt make decisions. Life has a pattern but it is only significant or has meaning because we look for patterns in life. We like to Know how things will go when life does not work that way. We dont know.

The universe is spontaneous in and of itself. We cant accept that (uncertainty and surprises) so we attribute it to something or someone. Since that something/one has to be the "answer" we call it God.

It is not bad. I know there are things that exist we do not know about. To say otherwise, would say we know everything. I just find too much human thought in God that makes no reason for me to think God is independent of us. Thats why I cal God life. He, if you like, Is life. He is the universe. He is humans. When I see someone, I see God.

Anything supernatural, unless it has characterisrics distinct of human thought, seem to be a product of human wants , needs, culture, and customs.

I havnt heard of Any type of God that doesnt mirror humans. Many pagans accept Gods as archytypes. I dont see that in abrahamics though

 

[Willamena]

I can't know because I have no basis upon which to make that claim...

Why not?

...and neither do you.

On what fact do you base this claim?

A universal negative is something like "there are no unicorns anywhere in the universe". To prove that wrong, you'd have to simultaneously be everywhere in the universe and find no evidence of unicorns. Since that cannot be done, it cannot be proven.

The universe is positive, hence proper language is too. That " there are no unicorns" isn't unprovable so much as trivial. It's provability is not negative, but null, which is to say it has no value.

 

[Mohammad Nur Syamsu]

If I understand correctly, Id say the universe does not choose or decide. Something doesnt appear from nothing; it also doesnt disapear into nothing. We believe we create things but in reality we using what is already provided to create something new. It didnt come from nothing.

The universe doesnt make decisions. Life has a pattern but it is only significant or has meaning because we look for patterns in life. We like to Know how things will go when life does not work that way. We dont know.

The universe is spontaneous in and of itself. We cant accept that (uncertainty and surprises) so we attribute it to something or someone. Since that something/one has to be the "answer" we call it God.

It is not bad. I know there are things that exist we do not know about. To say otherwise, would say we know everything. I just find too much human thought in God that makes no reason for me to think God is independent of us. Thats why I cal God life. He, if you like, Is life. He is the universe. He is humans. When I see someone, I see God.

Anything supernatural, unless it has characterisrics distinct of human thought, seem to be a product of human wants , needs, culture, and customs.

I havnt heard of Any type of God that doesnt mirror humans. Many pagans accept Gods as archytypes. I dont see that in abrahamics though

No you don't understand how any choosing works. As a matter of logic one can only reach a conlcusion about what it is that chooses by choosing the conclusion.

Remember that if you disregard the existence of God, which is perfectly logically valid, people may also disregard your emotions, which is also perfectly logically valid. It is the point of subjective issues, that the conclusion is reached by choosing it, and that the conclusion refers to what chooses.