Does Being Born Again Make You A Better Person?

[look3467]

I suppose that means I shouldn't even try to get saved, seeing as how I'm damned anyway. Or is unforgivable flexible in the same manner infallible is to the Catholic church?

We are all condemned until Jesus liberates us from that condition.
Rather than to have favorites, and than have to boast favorites boast about it, God evens the playing field by making everybody an unbeliever.

Rom 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

So, if you find Jesus to be your liberator, liberated you shall be, but if not, by Gods account, your still in a state of unbelief.

God did not condemn us to annihilate us, but so that He would be the only one who would claim righteousness, for He alone is righteous.

Peace>>>AJ

 

[logician]

Sin is too esoteric a concept to be judged.

 

[look3467]

Jesus indicates that this death is something that takes place in the spirit. Physical manifestations are just symptoms. At death the spirit lives on with the the quality of death still present. If a person goes to Heaven the death quality is suppressed so that it has no affect but another lifetime can bring it out again until that person replaces that death with life. That is why physical life is so important. It is the only time a person can replace death with life.

I don't agree with this definition because it is not the scriptural definition.

I don't agree with this. I believe Jesus died on the cross to prove that sin is no bar to Heaven. God loves you.

In the case of Jesus, He demonstrated both deaths, the physical and the spiritual.
The spiritual by going to hell as payment for the burden of the sins of the world and because it was prophesied that He should and a must do.

Our souls after Jesus' payment no longer dies but lives on, as was not the case before Jesus' sacrifice.

In order to understand the purpose for the death of Jesus, we must see the picture as was painted from the creation of the world.
Jesus then comes and repaints the same picture, but affecting only the spiritual end pf our lives.

It is a beautiful picture painted in puzzle pieces by which we may piece them back together and finally see it in it's beauty.

Peace>>>AJ

 

[look3467]

Sin is too esoteric a concept to be judged.>>> logician

The word sin means: a transgression.
The… what of transgression: is sin?

“Knowledge” was the transgression.
When Knowledge was attained, sin was discovered.
And the discovery of sin, via knowledge, came death, for the physical and the spiritual.

Death became the name for separation from God.

Because mankind made not itself, mankind had no power to make self alive again spiritually.
Only the creator of mankind has power to undo the death penalty of our souls.

Which, He did. He disannulled the covenant with death and gifted us with life to the soul.
We still die physically, and live to choose to do good or to do evil, but are recompensed for evil deeds, and are exacted from us either in consequences or being cut off from this existence.

So, believers in God or not, we are all judged by our behavior and subject to the consequences imposed by God or mankind.

Salvation is out of our hands, but we can effect it sooner rather than later.

Peace>>>AJ

 

[Aasimar]

We are all condemned until Jesus liberates us from that condition.
Rather than to have favorites, and than have to boast favorites boast about it, God evens the playing field by making everybody an unbeliever.

Rom 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

So, if you find Jesus to be your liberator, liberated you shall be, but if not, by Gods account, your still in a state of unbelief.

God did not condemn us to annihilate us, but so that He would be the only one who would claim righteousness, for He alone is righteous.

Peace>>>AJ

It is clearly stated that blasphemy is an unforgivable sin. Is God a liar?

 

[Muffled]

]In the case of Jesus, He demonstrated both deaths, the physical and the spiritual.[/COLOR]
The spiritual by going to hell as payment for the burden of the sins of the world and because it was prophesied that He should and a must do.

Our souls after Jesus' payment no longer dies but lives on, as was not the case before Jesus' sacrifice.

In order to understand the purpose for the death of Jesus, we must see the picture as was painted from the creation of the world.
Jesus then comes and repaints the same picture, but affecting only the spiritual end pf our lives.

It is a beautiful picture painted in puzzle pieces by which we may piece them back together and finally see it in it's beauty.

Peace>>>AJ

This is impossible. Jesus is God in the flesh and perfect. He is life as he sates in John 14:6 and He can never die spiritually.

I have seen no verse that supports this concept.

I know of no verse to support this concept either.

This can not be true as well.

 

[Muffled]

It is clearly stated that blasphemy is an unforgivable sin. Is God a liar?

Have you made an issue of the immutability of this unforgiveness. A sin that is no longer committed is no longer a sin that you can be held accountable for.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

The bible says: "The wages of sin is death". Do we not all die? What happens to sin then?
If the wages for sin is death, then at death, are they paid up.

In one word, yes.

 

[logician]

The word sin means: a transgression.
The… what of transgression: is sin?

“Knowledge” was the transgression.
When Knowledge was attained, sin was discovered.
And the discovery of sin, via knowledge, came death, for the physical and the spiritual.

Death became the name for separation from God.

Because mankind made not itself, mankind had no power to make self alive again spiritually.
Only the creator of mankind has power to undo the death penalty of our souls.

Which, He did. He disannulled the covenant with death and gifted us with life to the soul.
We still die physically, and live to choose to do good or to do evil, but are recompensed for evil deeds, and are exacted from us either in consequences or being cut off from this existence.

So, believers in God or not, we are all judged by our behavior and subject to the consequences imposed by God or mankind.

Salvation is out of our hands, but we can effect it sooner rather than later.

Peace>>>AJ

Simply put, what is evil in one culture may not be evil in another.

 

[Aasimar]

Have you made an issue of the immutability of this unforgiveness. A sin that is no longer committed is no longer a sin that you can be held accountable for.

Mark 3:29
but whosoever shall blaspheme against the Holy Spirit hath never forgiveness, but is guilty of an eternal sin:

Eternal. You do understand what eternal means right? Never have forgiveness. Never. Not maybe later. Never. Not Ever. No Forgiveness. None. You're screwed. The end. Game over. Go to hell, go straight to hell, do not pass go, do not collect $200. I'm no theologian, but I do know what the word never means. This is a part of facing reality. If God were real, I would go to hell. Period. Never and eternal do not leave breathing room. The trouble with dealing with absolutes is exactly that, they're absolute.

 

[Muffled]

Mark 3:29
but whosoever shall blaspheme against the Holy Spirit hath never forgiveness, but is guilty of an eternal sin:

Eternal. You do understand what eternal means right? Never have forgiveness. Never. Not maybe later. Never. Not Ever. No Forgiveness. None. You're screwed. The end. Game over. Go to hell, go straight to hell, do not pass go, do not collect $200. I'm no theologian, but I do know what the word never means. This is a part of facing reality. If God were real, I would go to hell. Period. Never and eternal do not leave breathing room. The trouble with dealing with absolutes is exactly that, they're absolute.

Yes. However it is the sin that is never forgiven not the sinner and it never will be forgiven for all eternity. If the sinner comes out of his sin, he is no longer subject to it.

Let us say a person steals a pencil from work and that person hasn't made their mind up yet about God but has not blasphemed the Holy Spirit. The sin itself is forgiven along with the sinner. Can you see the difference?

 

[Aasimar]

Yes. However it is the sin that is never forgiven not the sinner and it never will be forgiven for all eternity. If the sinner comes out of his sin, he is no longer subject to it.

Let us say a person steals a pencil from work and that person hasn't made their mind up yet about God but has not blasphemed the Holy Spirit. The sin itself is forgiven along with the sinner. Can you see the difference?

I can see where you are going with it, but it doesn't say the sin is never to be forgiven, it refers to the person. Take it even shorter,

but whosoever shall blaspheme against the Holy Spirit hath never forgiveness

the person is never forgiven. That sentence means the person who blasphemes is never forgiven. The person is the sinner, and he doesn't get forgiven. I would undertand what you were saying better if the passage read, "The sin of blasphemy will never be forgiven." but it states that it's the sinner who won't be forgiven.

 

[ChristineES]

What if I were to change my track. What if I say-- Being born again made me a better person compared to what I was before. That statement is true.
It doesn't mean I don't sin any more, it just means that I try not to sin. It doesn't mean that it makes me a great, wonderful person, because I know better than that.

 

[Muffled]

I can see where you are going with it, but it doesn't say the sin is never to be forgiven, it refers to the person. Take it even shorter,

but whosoever shall blaspheme against the Holy Spirit hath never forgiveness

the person is never forgiven. That sentence means the person who blasphemes is never forgiven. The person is the sinner, and he doesn't get forgiven. I would undertand what you were saying better if the passage read, "The sin of blasphemy will never be forgiven." but it states that it's the sinner who won't be forgiven.

This is where you are having your problem. You think one transgression lasts forever. It does not. As ever long as the person is comitting the transgression it is not forgiven. When there is no sin there is nothing that needs to be forgiven.

 

[Muffled]

What if I were to change my track. What if I say-- Being born again made me a better person compared to what I was before. That statement is true.
It doesn't mean I don't sin any more, it just means that I try not to sin. It doesn't mean that it makes me a great, wonderful person, because I know better than that.

In the OP the person is making a judgement about what is better. That judgement is a comparison (Something Paul tells us to avoid) to themselves. The person obviously holds a belief that the improvements of being born again are contrary to what she wants.

I once worked at a place where the manager paid overtime under-the-table. I considered that to be dishonest and refused to do it that way. Everyone who had done it that way did not think honesty was an improvement. Not only that but they considered it a judgement on their dishonesty for me to want to be honest.

 

[ChristineES]

Muffled wrote:

I once worked at a place where the manager paid overtime under-the-table. I considered that to be dishonest and refused to do it that way. Everyone who had done it that way did not think honesty was an improvement. Not only that but they considered it a judgement on their dishonesty for me to want to be honest.

I hate to say this, Muffled, but nothing is considered immoral any more. I guess people just want to do whatever they want and not have to face any consequences for it. They do not even want God to judge them. I guess that is why most people don't want to follow religion any more. Religions put restrictions about doing certain things.

 

[Aasimar]

This is where you are having your problem. You think one transgression lasts forever. It does not. As ever long as the person is comitting the transgression it is not forgiven. When there is no sin there is nothing that needs to be forgiven.

So what you're saying is that I can blaspheme, and be forgiven as long as I stop blaspheming? As in I'm only unforgivable while I'm typing "I don't believe in the Holy Spirit" and now that I'm done typing and no longer blaspheming I am no longer unforgivable?

 

[w00t]

So what you're saying is that I can blaspheme, and be forgiven as long as I stop blaspheming? As in I'm only unforgivable while I'm typing "I don't believe in the Holy Spirit" and now that I'm done typing and no longer blaspheming I am no longer unforgivable?

God would have to be a complete moron if that was the case!

 

[Muffled]

So what you're saying is that I can blaspheme, and be forgiven as long as I stop blaspheming? As in I'm only unforgivable while I'm typing "I don't believe in the Holy Spirit" and now that I'm done typing and no longer blaspheming I am no longer unforgivable?

Yes. As long as you aren't trying to play some game with God. He sees through that and knows the intention of your heart.

A cessation of typing does not necessarily mean a change of heart or belief.

 

[w00t]

Yes. As long as you aren't trying to play some game with God. He sees through that and knows the intention of your heart.

A cessation of typing does not necessarily mean a change of heart or belief.

The God of the Bible is fair game imo!