Does God Punish Feeling Lust?

[thomas t]

Your question asks whether the video correctly portrays God's views. It says nothing at all about the Bible. Your OP also says nothing about the Bible, just what God's views are on lust.

in other videos, this channel clearly mentions the Bible. The characters they use stay the same in this video, that's why I inferred that they mean the Bible God.

But it's good you pointed that out. So you made me explain. After all, not every RF user has seen various videos of that channel.

 

[osgart]

Defining lust as a cheap, dishonest and deceitful desire I would say is what lust actually means.

Having honest sexual desire I don't see a problem with.

But for lust that as defined is wrongful.

 

[SalixIncendium]

Should I have formulated the question more clearly?

Yes. I knew what you were looking for, but that’s only because I participated I the last thread like this one.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I'd like to discuss

Spoiler

another prominent video

promoting atheism.

Last time, many atheists said that atheism didn't need a prophet or a leader in the way Christianity does.
Many atheists disagreed with the videos from that channel.

Nevertheless some agreed.
Taking into accoung the overwhelming success of the video, it has some 4.2 million clicks and as many as 50,000 likes, I'd like to discuss it here.
The likes can't stem from Christians, I think. *

At minute 2:30, the video says that God convicts "people for feeling [what lust feels like]".
I doubt it.
I think that lust is totally fine. Even for God. He created it, I think.

* it is the purpose of the channel to address religion "because of the people who believe in God." The author does not " want them to believe in a fantasy" as he says.

I think the video presents a valid criticism of mainstream Christianity.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

thanks, but the poll only asks if you think the video depicted the biblical stance about lust in a correct manner.
Should I have formulated the question more clearly?

I have no idea what you meant by the question, so I didn't vote.

Yes - it could have been clearer.

 

[Polymath257]

in other videos, this channel clearly mentions the Bible. The characters they use stay the same in this video, that's why I inferred that they mean the Bible God.

But it's good you pointed that out. So you made me explain. After all, not every RF user has seen various videos of that channel.

Even if the video itself only addresses the Biblical God, there is still the more general question. Also, there is a question whether the Bible is a reliable guide to what God thinks.

From what I have read in the Bible, the video presents one viewpoint presented. But the Bible is far from being consistent on this issue, so having a single, coherent, answer isn't going to happen.

 

[Revoltingest]

thanks, but the poll only asks if you think the video depicted the biblical stance about lust in a correct manner.
Should I have formulated the question more clearly?

That is my opinion of the video.
Your question was specific enuf to obviate the need to watch it.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

thanks, but the poll only asks if you think the video depicted the biblical stance about lust in a correct manner.
Should I have formulated the question more clearly?

IMO, the Bible doesn't have a consistent approach to lust, so it would be impossible to say whether any particular description is a correct representation of the Biblical stance on lust.

Pretty much any stance on lust is both condoned and condemned by the Bible at different points in the book.

 

[Windwalker]

I think that lust is totally fine. Even for God. He created it, I think.

I think the so-called "atheist" perspective in that silly video is merely to point out the logic fallacies of those who read the Bible literally. That said, here's my answer to your concern about God "punishing" you for lustfulness in your heart, regardless of what the object of that lust may be.

Imagine sitting down with a giant bowl of ice cream and candy bars in front of you, and a plate full of greens with a nice garden salad. Instead of eating the healthy food for your body, you push that off the table and instead stuff yourself to the gills with candy bars and ice cream. And then you repeat this unhealthy dietary practice every day, until your health degrades. Soon you are massively overweight, you develop diabetes and heart disease, and then you end up dying as a result of this.

Question. Did God punish you in the above scenario? The answer to that, is the same answer to your question in the OP about lustfulness. Is a diet of lust or love more healthy for you? That's your answer.

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

Let's dive into Koine Greek then: Matthew 5:28 Interlinear: but I -- I say to you, that every one who is looking on a woman to desire her, did already commit adultery with her in his heart.

So you see it says desiring her and not desiring [the sex with] her. Between the word "desiring" and "her" there are no other Greek words in between that could clarify that sex only is meant.

Furthermore, the word used for "desire" is one to indicate a wish in the broadest sense, I think:
Strong's Greek: 1937. ἐπιθυμέω (epithumeó) -- desire, lust after

This word isn't confined to a sexual meaning/ sexual lust. In Greek, you could desire anything, not just sex. (See same link)

What about the word "adultery?" What does that word mean in this context of yours? Adultery has no other meaning than a sexual one that I know of.

 

[Prim969]

I'd like to discuss

Spoiler

another prominent video

promoting atheism.

Last time, many atheists said that atheism didn't need a prophet or a leader in the way Christianity does.
Many atheists disagreed with the videos from that channel.

Nevertheless some agreed.
Taking into accoung the overwhelming success of the video, it has some 4.2 million clicks and as many as 50,000 likes, I'd like to discuss it here.
The likes can't stem from Christians, I think. *

At minute 2:30, the video says that God convicts "people for feeling [what lust feels like]".
I doubt it.
I think that lust is totally fine. Even for God. He created it, I think.

* it is the purpose of the channel to address religion "because of the people who believe in God." The author does not " want them to believe in a fantasy" as he says.

Thomas I do think lust comes in varying shades. A married couple feel lust for one another all the time and no doubt for others too. It stems from a thought..Yet there must be absolute boundaries and accountability with how one controls their lust. Or it becomes a Alister Crowlian system of do what thou will shall be the whole of the law.

 

[Fool]

I'd like to discuss

Spoiler

another prominent video

promoting atheism.

Last time, many atheists said that atheism didn't need a prophet or a leader in the way Christianity does.
Many atheists disagreed with the videos from that channel.

Nevertheless some agreed.
Taking into accoung the overwhelming success of the video, it has some 4.2 million clicks and as many as 50,000 likes, I'd like to discuss it here.
The likes can't stem from Christians, I think. *

At minute 2:30, the video says that God convicts "people for feeling [what lust feels like]".
I doubt it.
I think that lust is totally fine. Even for God. He created it, I think.

* it is the purpose of the channel to address religion "because of the people who believe in God." The author does not " want them to believe in a fantasy" as he says.

if you take into account that love is not lust, you'd understand. lust is not just sex. it's coveting anything that isn't yours

 

[thomas t]

From what I have read in the Bible, the video presents one viewpoint presented. But the Bible is far from being consistent on this issue, so having a single, coherent, answer isn't going to happen.

IMO, the Bible doesn't have a consistent approach to lust, so it would be impossible to say whether any particular description is a correct representation of the Biblical stance on lust.

Pretty much any stance on lust is both condoned and condemned by the Bible at different points in the book.

I think the so-called "atheist" perspective in that silly video is merely to point out the logic fallacies of those who read the Bible literally.

Thank you for your answers. In my opinion, the Bible is consistent, even in matters such as lust.

 

[thomas t]

What about the word "adultery?" What does that word mean in this context of yours? Adultery has no other meaning than a sexual one that I know of.

that's a very good point you're raising here. You're providing food for thought.

Adultery, in contrast to fornication, has other connotations. Adultery means break-up of a relationship, the break-up of a marriage.
Marriage started off as union between two consenting adults, as seen in Genesis 24:58.
In Matthew 5, in contrast, consent is missing.

So it's the lack of consent here that Jesus is hinting at, in my opinion.

 

[thomas t]

I have no idea what you meant by the question, so I didn't vote.

Yes - it could have been clearer.

The question asks atheists if they think the video correctly portrays God's view on lust.

And I should have added: I'm talking about the Bible-God. So yeah, I could have been clearer.

 

[Heyo]

I'd like to discuss

Spoiler

another prominent video

promoting atheism.

Last time, many atheists said that atheism didn't need a prophet or a leader in the way Christianity does.
Many atheists disagreed with the videos from that channel.

Nevertheless some agreed.
Taking into accoung the overwhelming success of the video, it has some 4.2 million clicks and as many as 50,000 likes, I'd like to discuss it here.
The likes can't stem from Christians, I think. *

At minute 2:30, the video says that God convicts "people for feeling [what lust feels like]".
I doubt it.
I think that lust is totally fine. Even for God. He created it, I think.

* it is the purpose of the channel to address religion "because of the people who believe in God." The author does not " want them to believe in a fantasy" as he says.

You seem to be a fan of DarkMatter2525. I'm also. He has a funny way to use hyperbole to point out Bible contradictions (at least in his early videos).
Now, you can take away from the videos what you want but in this case you simply missed the message. This is not about if god punishes people for feeling lust. It is about god not being omniscient when he doesn't know lust or not being omni-benevolent if it does. (And either way shouldn't punish people for it.)

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

that's a very good point you're raising here. You're providing food for thought.

Adultery, in contrast to fornication, has other connotations. Adultery means break-up of a relationship, the break-up of a marriage.
Marriage started off as union between two consenting adults, as seen in Genesis 24:58.
In Matthew 5, in contrast, consent is missing.

So it's the lack of consent here that Jesus is hinting at, in my opinion.

Well... it seems rather clear to me that they are talking about looking at another woman and having sexual thoughts, and equating that to having committed "adultery in your heart" (whatever that ridiculous qualification is supposed to mean).

Whatever else you're reading from it seems a huge stretch, requiring a lot of begging off and pretty irrational justifications. It's done a lot, by the way... you're not the first. So don't feel too bad. I mean, this kind of thing does undermine the ENTIRE CHRISTIAN FAITH in my opinion, but again... you're not the only one doing this.

 

[thomas t]

You seem to be a fan of DarkMatter2525. I'm also. He has a funny way to use hyperbole to point out Bible contradictions (at least in his early videos).
Now, you can take away from the videos what you want but in this case you simply missed the message. This is not about if god punishes people for feeling lust. It is about god not being omniscient when he doesn't know lust or not being omni-benevolent if it does. (And either way shouldn't punish people for it.)

yes the video as a whole is rather about omniscience and the potential problems that come with it.
But I think these questions are rather philosophic in nature.

However, when it comes to lust, this video is plain wrong, in my opinion. There is no Bible verse indicating that God sends people to hell solely on grounds of feeling lust, of course.

So that's why I started this thread.

Actually I'm not a fan of DarkMatter2525. I simply note that many youths are currently leaving the Christian faith. And maybe it's because they watched a vid like this and for a reason found it convincing. That's why I'm posting these threads. These 50k likes the video has speak a clear language about how many fans of that channel there really are in the world.

 

[Polymath257]

yes the video as a whole is rather about omniscience and the potential problems that come with it.
But I think these questions are rather philosophic in nature.

However, when it comes to lust, this video is plain wrong, in my opinion. There is no Bible verse indicating that God sends people to hell solely on grounds of feeling lust, of course.

So that's why I started this thread.

Actually I'm not a fan of DarkMatter2525. I simply note that many youths are currently leaving the Christian faith. And maybe it's because they watched a vid like this and for a reason found it convincing. That's why I'm posting these threads. These 50k likes the video has speak a clear language about how many fans of that channel there really are in the world.

The video is humor, pointing out the hypocrisy of many modern Christian views. I really doubt that anyone has left Christianity because of videos like this.

Much more likely is that they saw the internal contradictions and *then* found videos like this and 'liked' them. Again, the point of this video is the contradictions inherent in omniscience.

 

[thomas t]

Well... it seems rather clear to me that they are talking about looking at another woman and having sexual thoughts, and equating that to having committed "adultery in your heart" (whatever that ridiculous qualification is supposed to mean).

take the verse literally. It says desiring her is wrong. No sex mentioned. Sex included? yes it certainly is. But don't narrow it down to lust, I'd say.
Even if mainstream Christianity does... Bible is the arbiter of faith, and here we don't find the wording narrowing it down to sex (see post #10). This is at least my stance.

So I'm not begging off or resorting to irrational justifications, I don't undermine the entire Christian faith (in case you said I do).