As our understanding of genetics increases then our understanding of how best to categorize may get tweeked and our understanding of the complex spectrum of humanity will improve as a result.
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Does race exist?
- Thread starter Saint Frankenstein
- Start date
Let's turn the tables.....
So far, you've proclaimed that there are no races & asked questions.
But I've seen no argument which employs a precise definition of "race".
No. Do you think they're common within - and different between - races?
Why didn't you list hair colour? If physical characteristics define race, can we say that a red-haired Scotsman is a different race from a black-haired Italian?
I'm just describing an analogous way of seeing races.
I still go with what most people mean.
If the concept of race was really about reflecting genetic variation and diversity, there would be a dozen races for African populations and one for "other".
Those traits predominate in some races, & not in others.
There were many other traits I thought of listing, but I decided to limit it to just three.
I don't see the point of bickering over semantics.
I'd appreciate it if you answered my question:
If physical characteristics define race, can we say that a red-haired Scotsman is a different race from a black-haired Italian?
Back in the day, "Irish" and "English" were considered different races. You've insinuated that this was incorrect. Why?
Strange you'd start a thread about just that, then.
This is one of these issues where the word isn't clearly defined (scientific uses vs various common uses), the definitions are statistically based, & there are examples fitting into multiple different classes. Any contrary position can be taken & defended.
I thought I did.
That would be wrong because it ignores (my earlier point) that race is defined by more than a single trait.
I'd make another analogy, but those are going over like lead balloons today.
Because both groups are physically similar.
The existence of different races is not debunked by pointing to historical errors by some people.
Were this line of rationalization valid, then evolution would be debunked too.
Desert Snake
Veteran Member
That's very general.
I agree that there are populations differences, but ''race'' is not how I would describe anything. It probably doesn't matter, though.
Right. The point is just to show that there is biological variation between populations of humans. I've noticed that people tend to get emotionally charged over the word "race" due to its history and that's understandable but denying that biological variation exists is just illogical. Use a different term if you will, but the reality remains.
Desert Snake
Veteran Member
Population variation/differences? Yes, those exist. But you just wrote ''race''. which I assumed meant, 'white, black, etc/
those, ....are pretty vague.
or rather, they lack much meaning, besides...what, complexion? I dunno...
Certainly, there are many people who eschew the use of "race" to describe anyone.
I find it useful though.
As Africa is the longest inhabited continent, there was more time for genetic diversity to occur. In fact, I know some anthropologists that argue for multiple macro-races in Africa; San (Bushmen), Pygmies, Congoese, etc.. As I am still saying, all of this increasing understanding helps us to better understand the spectrum of human variation.
No, race is an entirely made up categorization of people based on such ephemeral things as skin colour, eye shape and other facial differences. We might as well differentiate people on the basis of eye colour, its that superficial.
"...What a wonderful vision, which makes us contemplate the human race in the unity of its origin in God...This divine law of solidarity and charity assures that all men are truly brothers, without excluding the rich variety of persons, cultures and societies. In the light of this unity of all mankind, which exists in law and in fact, individuals do not feel themselves isolated units, like grains of sand, but united by the very force of their nature and by their internal destiny, into an organic, harmonious mutual relationship which varies with the changing of times...The nations, despite a difference of development due to diverse conditions of life and of culture, are not destined to break the unity of the human race, but rather to enrich and embellish it by the sharing of their own peculiar gifts and by that reciprocal interchange of goods..."
- Venerable Pope Pius XII,Summi Pontificatus (On the Unity of the Human Race) October 12, 1939
- Venerable Pope Pius XII,Summi Pontificatus (On the Unity of the Human Race) October 12, 1939
Again: it isn't a matter of denying that biological variation exists; it's a matter of recognizing that this variation isn't divided into discrete "races".
You are not the only one who finds it useful.
Imagine the inconvenience to Al Sharpton if he had to explain what he meant every time he used the word black in a sentence.
Tom
Rev Al & I have something in common?
Excuse me.....I need a shower.