DoubleStandard Morals

[Scuba Pete]

That is an awesome distinction.

 

[James the Persian]

Can I just say that homosexuality, strictly speaking is a passion, a temptation that may lead to sin. It is only the sex act itself that is sinful in Christian belief. A celibate person who was attracted to members of their own sex would not be commiting a sin simply by virtue of that attraction.

James

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Dreamwolf, I don't think that God punishes us for sin, or it least most sins. ...

Leviticus 20:

01: And HaShem spoke unto Moses, saying: ...
13: And if a man lie with mankind, as with womankind, both of them have committed abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.​

 

[jeffrey]

Leviticus 20:

01: And HaShem spoke unto Moses, saying: ...
13: And if a man lie with mankind, as with womankind, both of them have committed abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.​

They used to stone women for adultery too. This is Old Testament. NOBODY could live by those laws. Jesus came and stated that there is only one sin that cannot be forgiven. All other sins can be forgiven.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

They used to stone women for adultery too. This is Old Testament. NOBODY could live by those laws....

Then, apparently, you believe:

• HaShem presented his chosen people with laws that "NOBODY could live by", or
• the Torah lies when it claims that these laws were mandated by HaShem.

Which of these alternatives are you claiming?

 

[Dreamwolf]

We just except his will. Am I being punished for being on my second marriage? Or for living with her before marriage? I do not believe that I am. They are forgiven. Can a mass murderer be forgiven? Of course he can. This is

But the question I want to ask is if you think that you will be punished in the same way that the mass murderer will be on "judgement day"?
I just mostly do not like that the sins are not separated by severity. Then again the whole concept does not matter in my life really, other than the fact that I do not want to be ignorant about this.
So maybe someone can answer this?
Perhaps I am just being hard-headed again

Blessings!

 

[BUDDY]

Good points, jpgallandt. Belief that homosexuality is a sin is not the same as being intolerant of homosexuals.

That is what I was trying to say earlier. I hope Jensa is reading.

 

[jeffrey]

But the question I want to ask is if you think that you will be punished in the same way that the mass murderer will be on "judgement day"?
I just mostly do not like that the sins are not separated by severity. Then again the whole concept does not matter in my life really, other than the fact that I do not want to be ignorant about this.
So maybe someone can answer this?
Perhaps I am just being hard-headed again

Blessings!

The concept of forgiveness is that you will not be punished, Jesus died for our sins. The idea being is you ask with a heart that is truly sorry, and you are forgiven, no punishment. People will debate where in heaven you will end up, but as long as I make it there, I'm a happy puppy! So, from what I believe, there is no degree of sin. Sin is sin.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Would you not agree that YHWH's claim that they committed abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them suggests an intolerance of homosexuals?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

The concept of forgiveness is ....

Please answer my question.

 

[jeffrey]

Then, apparently, you believe:

• HaShem presented his chosen people with laws that "NOBODY could live by", or
• the Torah lies when it claims that these laws were mandated by HaShem.

Which of these alternatives are you claiming?

Neither. I believe that you are confusing my beliefs with someone else's, maybe yours. My belief is the OT had It's purpose for that time. People tried to read more into it then what is there. Jesus came and, for lack of a better phrase, put things straight. We as Christians no longer sacrifice animals anymore either.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Neither. I believe that you are confusing my beliefs with someone else's, maybe yours. My belief is the OT had It's purpose for that time.

Did HaShem insist that homosexuals were committing an abomination and should be put to death?

 

[jeffrey]

Did HaShem insist that homosexuals were committing an abomination and should be put to death?

Did we also stone women to death? Did we also sacrifice animals? And if you mean God insist, don't know. I wasn't there.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

And if you mean God insist, don't know. I wasn't there.

Nor were you there for the creation events, the global flood, the exodus/conquest, the virgin birth, or the resurrection. Are you equally agnostic about those events, or do you simply pick and choose what you wish to evade?

What is your view of Leviticus 20:13?

 

[Dreamwolf]

The concept of forgiveness is that you will not be punished, Jesus died for our sins. The idea being is you ask with a heart that is truly sorry, and you are forgiven, no punishment. People will debate where in heaven you will end up, but as long as I make it there, I'm a happy puppy! So, from what I believe, there is no degree of sin. Sin is sin.

So what would be the point of the bible telling what is sin and what is not if you will not be punished for it?

 

[jeffrey]

Nor were you there for the creation events, the global flood, the exodus/conquest, the virgin birth, or the resurrection. Are you equally agnostic about those events, or do you simply pick and choose what you wish to evade?

What is your view of Leviticus 20:13?

LOL. To quote a famous movie: "What we have here is a failure to communicate." 1st NetDoc, then me. You are attempting to confuse my religion with yours. The difference here is R.E.S.P.E.C.T. Michel and James both might not agree with what I believe, they will state their views with respect towards my views. I feel I do the same with them. But you are attempting to alter my beliefs to try and justify some hidden agenda, of which I don't know or really care, to be honest. If you wish for God to have said that to Moses 4,000 years ago and still want it to be in effect, that's your choice. But please, if you are really sincere about wanting to understand other Religions, then show some respect for others.

 

[jeffrey]

So what would be the point of the bible telling what is sin and what is not if you will not be punished for it?

I'll put it this way. Your 10 years old and you hit your brother out of anger. 30 minutes later you calm down and are really sorry for doing it. You tell your father what happened and that you are really sorry. He sees that you are and tells you don't do it again. But lets say that 30 minutes later you are NOT sorry and do it again. Your father comes home, you tell him you are not sorry and you WILL do it again, do you not think then you would be punished?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

But please, if you are really sincere about wanting to understand other Religions, then show some respect for others.

I have no respect for disingenuous argument and cowardly evasion. Yet again: what is you view of Leviticus 20:13?

 

[jeffrey]

I have no respect for disingenuous argument and cowardly evasion. Yet again: what is you view of Leviticus 20:13?

And name calling is respectful? LOL! Tell you what. You start showing respect and I will then answer your question. In the mean time, talk to the hand. I refuse to stoop to your level. Edit. I misread what you said. You stated you have no respect then called me names. Do you really think that bothers me?

 

[Mr Spinkles]

While it seems clear to me that jgallant and many other Christians are not intolerant of homosexuals, I also agree with Deut that the Abrahamic religions have a dark history of homophobia, one which exceeds that of most other religions and which is rooted in both scripture and tradition. I'm pleased that people like jgallant (and many Jews and Muslims as well) reject those scriptures and traditions in favor of a more tolerant theology.

jgallant: I respect your beliefs, but I also think Deut raised a legitimate question. It would be unfortunate if this question were left unanswered, as I am curious myself to hear a response. Would you be more inclined to answer if I asked the question instead?

You said: "I wasn't there."

Nor were you there for the creation events, the global flood, the exodus/conquest, the virgin birth, or the resurrection. Are you equally agnostic about those events? Why or why not?