Epilepsy = demonic possession!

[England my lionheart]

Sure....
But Galilean peasants thought that it was demons, or even death. It's not what you or I think but what ancient peasants thought.

And Hysteria could imitate scores of serious physical conditions, and the right person could 'cure' these conditions instantly, sometimes by just attending. I've seen it happen many times.

They just didn't have the right meds,there is also psychosis which I witnessed in amsterdam but we know what triggered that.
I read somewhere that muhammad had seizures and people saw it as something magical,times change but superstition not much.

 

[Mohsen]

I didn't feel like swimming so I called 911...

funniest thing i've read all week thanks for this haha

peace

 

[oldbadger]

They just didn't have the right meds,there is also psychosis which I witnessed in amsterdam but we know what triggered that.

What? What was that? I've probaby missed out about what happened to you, there.

I read somewhere that muhammad had seizures and people saw it as something magical,times change but superstition not much.

True! Superstition reigns supreme all over, and through all races, creeds, classes and intelligences.
I have also read and heard that mystics, clairvoyants, mediums having seizures has been regarded as both an evil and a wicked 'tell' depending on the viewpoints of witnesses!

But all of these conditions, esprecially hysteria (imo) could well have added to Jesus's reputation as a healer, IF he had the charisma which can make such a difference to hysterical cases.

I was sat in a room, a vistor, at a special psychiatric research clinic nrear Guy's Hospital circa 1978, witnessing a hystetric throwing the most terrifyingly violent fit, and a young doctor walked into the room anmd just greeted the patient, and she stopped, turned, smiled, skipped up to him and kneeled at his feet, looking up adoringly into his face. To all apprearances cured! Amazing what Charismatic Stun can do.

 

[England my lionheart]

What? What was that? I've probaby missed out about what happened to you, there.


True! Superstition reigns supreme all over, and through all races, creeds, classes and intelligences.
I have also read and heard that mystics, clairvoyants, mediums having seizures has been regarded as both an evil and a wicked 'tell' depending on the viewpoints of witnesses!

But all of these conditions, esprecially hysteria (imo) could well have added to Jesus's reputation as a healer, IF he had the charisma which can make such a difference to hysterical cases.

I was sat in a room, a vistor, at a special psychiatric research clinic nrear Guy's Hospital circa 1978, witnessing a hystetric throwing the most terrifyingly violent fit, and a young doctor walked into the room anmd just greeted the patient, and she stopped, turned, smiled, skipped up to him and kneeled at his feet, looking up adoringly into his face. To all apprearances cured! Amazing what Charismatic Stun can do.

Amsterdam is a place where you can smoke or eat cannabis,the psychosis happened to the man because he over indulged.

For a tonic clonic epileptic seizure that lasts more than 5 minutes only a relaxant like diasopan for example will bring them round,they are simply unaware of anything so you could have charisma coming out of your ears but it would mean nothing to them.

 

[oldbadger]

Amsterdam is a place where you can smoke or eat cannabis,the psychosis happened to the man because he over indulged.

For a tonic clonic epileptic seizure that lasts more than 5 minutes only a relaxant like diasopan for example will bring them round,they are simply unaware of anything so you could have charisma coming out of your ears but it would mean nothing to them.

I wasn't talking about epilepsy there.......
I was talking about a patient having hysterical fits and seizures....... nothing to do with epilepsy. And the right person can stop a violent fit just by walking in the door, although this is unusual.

People can mix up hysteria with epilepsy so easily.

 

[England my lionheart]

I wasn't talking about epilepsy there.......
I was talking about a patient having hysterical fits and seizures....... nothing to do with epilepsy. And the right person can stop a violent fit just by walking in the door, although this is unusual.

People can mix up hysteria with epilepsy so easily.

Maybe so,someone who is hysterical can also be shocked out of it.

 

[oldbadger]

Maybe so,someone who is hysterical can also be shocked out of it.

You are right.
I have seen a hysteric enter the first stage of what would be a full-on violent fit and a doctor slapped her face and said,'Don't you dare do that to me!' (1978.... times have changed)
............. and she didn't. Nobody had ever stopped her fit before. Nobody ever succeeded again, including that doctor.

But with regard to the miracles of Jesus, whilst demonic casting-out and even death-to-life could be the result of epilepsy, cures for blindness, paralysis, stroke, heart-attack, any kind of panic-attack etc could all be about hysteria, and although Northern European males tend not to be so affected, Latin and Mediterranean males are very affected.... by the conditions once known as hysteria.

Ergo, I reckon many of Jesus's miracles were actually witnessed, but simply misunderstood by superstitious folks.

You won't find much on the www about hysteria, because the psychos have split its various conditions into separate names and made hysteria dissappear....... they couldn't cure it, so I guess they just made it go away.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I've seen many seizures,there are different types from absence to to tonic clonic which is life threatening,sometimes strange noises from them and odd behaviour but its not a mythological creature doing it.

I had to look up this tonic-clonic seizure. Interestingly, though I had one only a few months ago, I was finding the apparently now dated term of grand mal seizure being used to describe what I went through. I don't even remember it happening, but going from normal and functioning alright to suddenly jumping several minutes ahead (around 15 minutes by my estimation based on the position of the sun) and finding myself on the ground puking with some blood in it and very badly chomped on tongue and having a mental haze that lasted for a few days, I can very easily get how someone who doesn't know from long ago would think that involved me being possessed by an evil spirit. But, fortunately for me, some people there knew what was going on and had the smarts to roll my on my side (or on my stomach, depending on who I heard the story from), and call an ambulance to come for me.

 

[England my lionheart]

I had to look up this tonic-clonic seizure. Interestingly, though I had one only a few months ago, I was finding the apparently now dated term of grand mal seizure being used to describe what I went through. I don't even remember it happening, but going from normal and functioning alright to suddenly jumping several minutes ahead (around 15 minutes by my estimation based on the position of the sun) and finding myself on the ground puking with some blood in it and very badly chomped on tongue and having a mental haze that lasted for a few days, I can very easily get how someone who doesn't know from long ago would think that involved me being possessed by an evil spirit. But, fortunately for me, some people there knew what was going on and had the smarts to roll my on my side (or on my stomach, depending on who I heard the story from), and call an ambulance to come for me.

Have you hade any since,people should put you in the recovery position once the seizure stops,if after 5 minutes you are still unconcious you need a relaxant,it used to be diasopan here,this is because your muscles become very stiff and could be why you bit your tongue.
I get how people from the past saw it that way but we are much wiser now,wish you well.

 

[Desert Snake]

An assertion without any evidence to support it. A lot of the things in the Bible could be described as dabbling in the occult, like the exorcism hocus pocus. I see no difference in that guy, Jesus, playing that game, and what witch doctors get up to!

Then a yes or no answer to my question would have sufficed. I said 'may follow involvement in the occult', not will follow involvement in the occult.
Anyways, this conversation is over, since I don't have all the context.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Have you hade any since,people should put you in the recovery position once the seizure stops,if after 5 minutes you are still unconcious you need a relaxant,it used to be diasopan here,this is because your muscles become very stiff and could be why you bit your tongue.

Thanks. I fortunately only had the one, and started taking measures to ensure my blood sugar doesn't drop dangerously low at the larp games (where it happened).
Honestly, I'm glad I don't remember any of it. Regaining consciousness brought on enough of a panic and wave of confusion, I don't even want to think about how scary that would have been had I been trapped in my own body and convulsing like that, wondering if it will ever end as the sun set and day turned to twilight. And very fortunately there are no demons involved, meaning I can confidently maintain safe blood glucose levels (with huge gulps of orange juice and big spoons of peanut butter throughout the main game day), monitor my symptoms, and prevent another seizure from happening. No charms, chanting, rituals, or exorcisms required. Taking "spiritual measures" to protect myself are just unnecessary, and will do nothing to actually address the problem, just as it will fail to address epilepsy every time.

 

[England my lionheart]

Thanks. I fortunately only had the one, and started taking measures to ensure my blood sugar doesn't drop dangerously low at the larp games (where it happened).
Honestly, I'm glad I don't remember any of it. Regaining consciousness brought on enough of a panic and wave of confusion, I don't even want to think about how scary that would have been had I been trapped in my own body and convulsing like that, wondering if it will ever end as the sun set and day turned to twilight. And very fortunately there are no demons involved, meaning I can confidently maintain safe blood glucose levels (with huge gulps of orange juice and big spoons of peanut butter throughout the main game day), monitor my symptoms, and prevent another seizure from happening. No charms, chanting, rituals, or exorcisms required. Taking "spiritual measures" to protect myself are just unnecessary, and will do nothing to actually address the problem, just as it will fail to address epilepsy every time.

Good news,preventions' better than cure every time.

 

[viole]

According to Matthew 17 v 14-18 it would appear Jesus believed those suffering from epilepsy were possessed by demons! In those far off days, it might have been forgivable for people to believe in such nonsense as a major epileptic seizure is very scary indeed. I have witnessed several as my husband has the condition after his brain haemorrhage in 2006, fortunately his meds control the seizures. In this day and age of modern medicine we know the cause of this condition, and of course mythical demons have nothing to do with it.

I have come across some ultra extreme Biblical literalists who not only believe demons actually exist, but epileptics are possessed by them. Hopefully no one on this forum is that silly?

Looks like Jesus knew so much about medicine as His Dad about cosmology.

Ciao

- viole

 

[djhwoodwerks]

There is no evidence that anything attributed to the long dead Jesus had any basis in fact, especially the less than credible stuff like so called 'miracles'.

I have a daughter who is 30. When she was 6, I was out in our yard cutting grass. I had just finished cutting the back yard, filled the tank with gas, went to the front and started cutting, I think I made 1 pass around the yard and the mower died. I tried for a couple of minutes to get it started but it wouldn't start. My wife was on the carport, I was on the opposite side of the house, and I heard very loudly, "where's your daughter", it was an urgent cry from someone, but no one was around. I walked around the house and asked my wife if she yelled for me, she said no. So I asked where our daughter was and she said she didn't know. I got a feeling of panic and started running around looking for her, we found her in the back yard with the nozzle of the gas can in her mouth, she was breathing in the fumes, she had turned a shade of grey and her eyes were dull, but still standing there with the nozzle in her mouth. She spent a week in the hospital in an oxygen tent. I believe in miracles!

My youngest daughter is 17. When she was 6 mos or so, my 2nd wife left work, picked up our daughter from daycare and was taking a coworker home. My wife had an old 70's 2 door Cadillac, that about seen it's last days. She was driving down the highway, doing 65 in the far left lane which merged onto a different highway. This was during rush hour around 5:30 PM. As she was driving down the hwy she said she had pulled against the steering wheel to re-situate herself, as she did the steering wheel came off in her hands, she said her and her friend froze in disbelief and fear. She said she wanted to slam on the breaks but couldn't. Then the car started to move to the right, as being guided, missing every car and she said it was slowing down as the car was moving to the side of the road. When it got to the shoulder she said she put her foot on the break and stopped. She had no control of the car, during rush hour, yet the car was guided to the right shoulder, there was no shoulder on the left because it was a merge lane, missed every car and came to a stop. I believe in miracles!

 

[Skwim]

I have a daughter who is 30. When she was 6, I was out in our yard cutting grass. I had just finished cutting the back yard, filled the tank with gas, went to the front and started cutting, I think I made 1 pass around the yard and the mower died. I tried for a couple of minutes to get it started but it wouldn't start. My wife was on the carport, I was on the opposite side of the house, and I heard very loudly, "where's your daughter", it was an urgent cry from someone, but no one was around. I walked around the house and asked my wife if she yelled for me, she said no. So I asked where our daughter was and she said she didn't know. I got a feeling of panic and started running around looking for her, we found her in the back yard with the nozzle of the gas can in her mouth, she was breathing in the fumes, she had turned a shade of grey and her eyes were dull, but still standing there with the nozzle in her mouth. She spent a week in the hospital in an oxygen tent. I believe in miracles!

My youngest daughter is 17. When she was 6 mos or so, my 2nd wife left work, picked up our daughter from daycare and was taking a coworker home. My wife had an old 70's 2 door Cadillac, that about seen it's last days. She was driving down the highway, doing 65 in the far left lane which merged onto a different highway. This was during rush hour around 5:30 PM. As she was driving down the hwy she said she had pulled against the steering wheel to re-situate herself, as she did the steering wheel came off in her hands, she said her and her friend froze in disbelief and fear. She said she wanted to slam on the breaks but couldn't. Then the car started to move to the right, as being guided, missing every car and she said it was slowing down as the car was moving to the side of the road. When it got to the shoulder she said she put her foot on the break and stopped. She had no control of the car, during rush hour, yet the car was guided to the right shoulder, there was no shoulder on the left because it was a merge lane, missed every car and came to a stop. I believe in miracles!

Then there all the stories where things didn't go quite so nicely and people became seriously injured or died. Point being, in considering these to be miracles

mir·a·cle
ˈmirək(ə)l/
noun
noun: miracle; plural noun: miracles
a surprising and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore considered to be the work of a divine agency.​

do you blame this "divine agency" for those circumstance where it didn't intervene? Or do you thank it for not intervening, letting other people suffer lung damage from gasoline inhalation, and die in automobile accidents caused by equipment malfunnction?

.

 

[ChristineM]

According to Matthew 17 v 14-18 it would appear Jesus believed those suffering from epilepsy were possessed by demons! In those far off days, it might have been forgivable for people to believe in such nonsense as a major epileptic seizure is very scary indeed. I have witnessed several as my husband has the condition after his brain haemorrhage in 2006, fortunately his meds control the seizures. In this day and age of modern medicine we know the cause of this condition, and of course mythical demons have nothing to do with it.

I have come across some ultra extreme Biblical literalists who not only believe demons actually exist, but epileptics are possessed by them. Hopefully no one on this forum is that silly?

First off, there is no excuse for the "supposed and claimed" son of the omnipotent, omniscient creator to have any misunderstanding over the cause of epilepsy. Just one of the many questions that bible believers refuse to answer, or, slope their shoulders to shift the blame on to humanity +the creation of that same omnipotent, omniscient creator.

Second, yes, I've come across deliberate ignorance in biblical literalist too. Ignore them, when they or theirs are in need medical help it shows exactly how hypocritical they are.

 

[Riders]

Epilepsy and other illness has been demonized along time. Did you see the true life movie about the woman eith extreme form of epilepsy and the priest responsible for her death.


Churches have always regarded mentally ill patients with demons too. A few people from childhood Baptist church still regard me as the devils child because of my psychiatric hospital stays in my teens.

 

[djhwoodwerks]

Then there all the stories where things didn't go quite so nicely and people became seriously injured or died. Point being, in considering these to be miracles

mir·a·cle
ˈmirək(ə)l/
noun
noun: miracle; plural noun: miracles
a surprising and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore considered to be the work of a divine agency.​

do you blame this "divine agency" for those circumstance where it didn't intervene? Or do you thank it for not intervening, letting other people suffer lung damage from gasoline inhalation, and die in automobile accidents caused by equipment malfunnction?

No, I do not blame God for not intervening. There are many times in my life that I hoped for God's intervention, and He didn't, but I did not blame Him for what happened. I used to, before I knew Him, I blamed Him if a nail bent while I was hammering on it, I thought every thing that made my life hard was His fault because He allowed it, I know different now.

 

[Ubon]

Jesus did not know any better because like all other men he lacked scientific knowledge.
He was just a man as this proves, perhaps a little mentally ill himself as he believed he was the son of God.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Jesus did not know any better because like all other men he lacked scientific knowledge.
He was just a man as this proves, perhaps a little mentally ill himself as he believed he was the son of God.

That doesn't mean he was mentally ill. One way of looking at it is we're all the children of God.