Evidence That Jesus Is God

[Trailblazer]

The Scripture speaks of knowledge, understanding and wisdom to be more desired than anything else.

The only thing that would negate those things is not having love.

Thanks, I do not really know a lot of what is in the biblical Scripture because I was not raised as a Christian and I became a Baha'i during my first year of college. Even after that, I was not very interested in religion or God, owing to personal problems. Because of all that, I never read even one page of the Bible until about seven years ago, when I first stated posting on forums. I had the occasion to post to Christians and less so to Jewish people, because of the forums so I had to start reading certain parts of the Bible. Since then, I have discovered a lot, but of course I have a lot to learn.

There was a time when I posted on a forum called The Holy Trinity, which is still an active forum, but as a Baha'i, I soon got moderated so I left that forum. Then later I briefly posted on a forum called Jesus' Place, but when I would not agree with them that Jesus is God, they politely asked me to leave.

I have my own forum in that Delphi Forums called The Spiritual Horizon and the reason I started it five years ago is so I could post to Christians without getting moderated or banned. My forum was active for a while but then I ran off to another Delphi Forum that was mostly atheists, so my forum kind of died after that since I did not have time to keep it going. I came to this forum about two years ago because the atheist forum owner of the forum i was on did not like my Baha'i beliefs. So I never went back there.

Now my forum has a few posters again, mostly nonbelievers and one Christian who is a Trinitarian, and he was one of my first posters five years ago. I invited him to my forum after he got banned from a progressive Christian forum. I have been posting to him ever since off and on, mostly on, although I had a break for the last couple of years since I have been posting mostly on RF.

He came back to my forum a couple of months ago and now we are back discussing the Bible again. He insists his interpretation of the only correct one, but most of our disagreements have been over the resurrection and the return of Christ, not that Jesus is God. Anyhow, you are more than welcome to post on my forum if you have time.

 

[Desert Snake]

But how does Tetragrammaton translate to Jesus?

Why don't you provide a definition of trinitarianism, since you're calling me a trinitarian?

Not going further until you justify that

You're an obfuscator, and thusly dishonest.

 

[Trailblazer]

THAT'S AWESOME!

Glad you like it. I does make logical sense.

 

[cataway]

or are you making Jesus god ?

 

[Trailblazer]

Why don't you provide a definition of trinitarianism, since you're calling me a trinitarian?

The Christian doctrine of the Trinity (Latin: Trinitas, lit. 'triad', from Latin: trinus "threefold") holds that God is one God, but three coeternal consubstantial persons or hypostases—the Father, the Son (Jesus Christ), and the Holy Spirit—as "one God in three Divine persons".
Trinity - Wikipedia
Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia › wiki › Trinity

Not going further until you justify that.

I do not know what you mean by justify?

You're an obfuscator, and thusly dishonest.

What did I obfuscate?

 

[Trailblazer]

Wheres that definition of trinitarianism?

It's not supposed to be the Christian version of the Trinity.
It is the Baha'i version of the Trinity.

 

[Desert Snake]

The Christian doctrine of the Trinity (Latin: Trinitas, lit. 'triad', from Latin: trinus "threefold") holds that God is one God, but three coeternal consubstantial persons or hypostases—the Father, the Son (Jesus Christ), and the Holy Spirit—as "one God in three Divine persons".
Trinity - Wikipedia
Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia › wiki › Trinity

I do not know what you mean by justify?

What did I obfuscate?

I don't believe that there are three separate persons. I believe there is one God, with more than one form. And the Spirit, isn't a person.

 

[LightofTruth]

Why don't you provide a definition of trinitarianism, since you're calling me a trinitarian?

Not going further until you justify that

You're an obfuscator, and thusly dishonest.

I have discovered through discussion forums that there are many definitions of Trinitarianism. Basically, most trinitarians believe Jesus is God. That he has always been God. But after that, there are many variations in how they define a trinity God.

 

[LightofTruth]

I don't believe that there are three separate persons. I believe there is one God, with more than one form. And the Spirit, isn't a person.

"Orthodox" Trinitarianism would say you adhere to "modalism". Something they have said is "heresy"

 

[Trailblazer]

I don't believe that there are three separate persons. I believe there is one God, with more than one form. And the Spirit, isn't a person.

Okay thanks. Sorry if I misunderstood you.

So, do you believe that Jesus was a form that God took?
Do you believe that Jesus became God, that God was incarnated in the flesh?

 

[Desert Snake]

I have discovered through discussion forums that there are many definitions of Trinitarianism. Basically, most trinitarians believe Jesus is God. That he has always been God. But after that, there are many variations in how they define a trinity God.

Trinitarians sometimes hold to a strict format, some churches, and they 'disagree' with my beliefs. Hence although they might say Jeshua is god, their teachings and language, might infer otherwise. So, it can definitely be an obfuscation.

 

[LightofTruth]

It's not supposed to be the Christian version of the Trinity.
It is the Baha'i version of the Trinity.

The Scripture says that the Holy Spirit proceeds forth from the Father. I agree that the Spirit of the Father emanates from the Father. For a Spirit to emanate from something, that something must have a place from which it could emanate from. The place from which the Spirit of the Father emanates from Him is heaven.

 

[Trailblazer]

The Scripture says that the Holy Spirit proceeds forth from the Father. I agree that the Spirit of the Father emanates from the Father. For a Spirit to emanate from something, that something must have a place from which it could emanate from. The place from which the Spirit of the Father emanates from Him is heaven.

Hmmmmmm.... that opens up a whole different can of worms.
How do you define heaven? Do you think heaven is a place, a geographical location?

The Bible does not really define heaven very well, does it?
Jesus said that there were many mansions in His Father's house. I think that refers to heaven.

John 14:2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

What do you think that means? I think it means there are many different *levels* to which we will gravitate in heaven depending upon our worthiness.

But where do you think God is? I would guess that God is at the highest level, and we know from scripture that Jesus is at God's Right Hand, meaning He is as close to God as one can be.

 

[susanblange]

Talk about not making sense. Trinitarian doctrine is so far from making sense that it's a wonder to me that any reasonable person could believe it.

Christians are prisoners of Satan and Lucifer. They cannot see the light because they are blinded by their delusions and idols. II Timothy 2:26. They think the only way into Heaven is belief in Jesus. Only the righteous will enter Heaven, you have to repent of your sin. Remorse, confession, restitution, and most importantly, change.

 

[Desert Snake]

Okay thanks. Sorry if I misunderstood you.

So, do you believe that Jesus was a form that God took?
Do you believe that Jesus became God, that God was incarnated in the flesh?

Yes, although I believe there has been alot of obfuscation, from the established religious organizations.

So, everything is read or taken in that context. They also weren't careful, when they canonized the christian bible. The conquest of Canaan is clearly an 'extra biblical' writing, they should have canonized in context to Epistles and Jesus,
John 7
Epistles disagree with genesis, so forth.

 

[Spartan]

Nope. At best we have a serious contradiction. Can't just cherry-pick a solution and pretend it's thee truth, which is why I said "Looking through the Bible the closest thing I could find is that at most Jesus was the son of god."

The bible says Jesus was both god and not god. That you choose to pick those verses supporting the contention that Jesus is god while ignoring those that say he is not is, of course, up to you. To me this is not only a self serving approach but a dishonest one. But what the hey, whatever gets you from Sunday to Monday.

.

It never says Jesus was not God. That's your pick and choose folly.

 

[PruePhillip]

I find it sad that some people believe the not so good book to be literally true.

I find it sad that some people can't be specific.

 

[LightofTruth]

Hmmmmmm.... that opens up a whole different can of worms.
How do you define heaven? Do you think heaven is a place, a geographical location?

The Bible does not really define heaven very well, does it?
Jesus said that there were many mansions in His Father's house. I think that refers to heaven.

John 14:2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

What do you think that means? I think it means there are many different *levels* to which we will gravitate in heaven depending upon our worthiness.

But where do you think God is? I would guess that God is at the highest level, and we know from scripture that Jesus is at God's Right Hand, meaning He is as close to God as one can be.

Since I believe in the resurrection of the dead, the mansions refer to immortal bodies which when the dead are raised immortal, they will inhabit.

 

[Skwim]

It never says Jesus was not God. That's your pick and choose folly.

It never says Judas was not god either so he's in the running as well, as is Mary Magdalene who was also never said to be god, as were . . . .

.

 

[cataway]

It never says Jesus was not God. That's your pick and choose folly.

ah but Jesus did say which God to worship

 

[Trailblazer]

Since I believe in the resurrection of the dead, the mansions refer to immortal bodies which when the dead are raised immortal, they will inhabit.

So you think it means that in my father's house there are many immortal bodies?
Do you believe that dead bodies will rise from their graves and become immortal when Jesus returns? What is the biblical basis for this belief? In brief, I believe that when our physical body dies, it remains dead, and our soul (spirit) leaves the body and ascends to the spiritual world. The soul then takes on a new form, a spiritual body that is eternal, comprised of elements that exist in the heavenly realm.

Here is how I believe resurrection of the dead happens. It was written by a Christian but it is congruent with Baha'i beliefs.

421. When the body is no longer able to perform the bodily functions in the natural world that correspond to the spirit’s thoughts and affections, which the spirit has from the spiritual world, man is said to die. This takes place when the respiration of the lungs and the beatings of the heart cease. But the man does not die; he is merely separated from the bodily part that was of use to him in the world, while the man himself continues to live. It is said that the man himself continues to live since man is not a man because of his body but because of his spirit, for it is the spirit that thinks in man, and thought with affection is what constitutes man. Evidently, then, the death of man is merely his passing from one world into another. And this is why in the Word in its internal sense “death” signifies resurrection and continuation of life. Heaven and Hell, p. 351