Evolution My ToE

[YoursTrue]

The process of evolution created humans and all life on earth. Why would you call that wicked.

Do you think anything is wicked, by the way? (Can some actions of humans be considered as wicked?)

 

[Dan From Smithville]

If you think it's bad for God to have suffering on earth, obviously you can't blame it on evolution, since it has no feelings, or guided intelligent thinking rationale for its outcome. Only those that you would say evolved have feelings and perform wickedly, I suppose you could think.

You do realize that atheists see no reason to believe in God, so claiming they may have any feelings about God or His claimed actions is silly.

How does a belief in God relate to inanimate objects or processes having consciousness or emotion? Whether rocks were created or the result of natural processes, they have no feelings. Neither does the geology that explains the rocks. Why would a theory have feelings? It is difficult to understand what you are getting at here.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Do you think anything is wicked, by the way? (Can some actions of humans be considered as wicked?)

Sure they can. The results of a tornado can be terrible, but a tornado is not evil. A person that decides to kill or injure the same number of unrelated people as that tornado did, is evil.

 

[dad]

If one looks at these claims rationally they fall apart. Let's start with prophecies. To judge whether a prophesy is fulfilled or not one needs reliable standards. Does that not make sense to you?

Too late. Most bible prophesy is now history, regardless of how reliable you think it may be.

 

[YoursTrue]

Unsupported claim.

There is a collective reality that we all share, whether you want to admit to it, or not.

I am convinced now that humans are all products one way or another of supernatural beings.

 

[dad]

What makes these miracles? This sounds like an argument from ignorance. You do realize that both photosynthesis and how the Sun works are well understood these days, don't you? No miracles needed.

But let's focus on prophecies first.

No. They are not well understood. The plant has to be here, the earth has to be here, the sun has to be here. It is not well understood at all how they got here or why or when or how. It is not understood why the synthesis of chemicals or sugars etc occurs. They do understand how. Is it understood how the right amount of oxygen content from plants happens to be what we need to live? Is it understood why the right materials in the reaction centers in plants strip just the right number of electrons? What makes all these organized reactions work perfectly for us? What makes the forces and laws exist that govern how they work? Then there is the hydrogen produced, how is it that we get the exact materials and reactions and sequences to enable our life? Then the hydrogen that is freed results in other compounds that allow storage of energy! A natural battery system. And there are many more reactions involved, all of which are needed. To think all this is not a miracle is short sighted.

 

[dad]

Doesn't change the reality of our world that you reject.

On the contrary, I do not reject the present nature and physical at all! You just want us to ONLY accept that and reject all other parts of reality!

All of nature is a miracle of the natural world created by the natural world'

No, that is just as far as you can see. One might call it 'white cane fishbowl vision'.

you just but god in it because you are so dependent on a father figure to take care of you and wanting to feel more important. Evolution was the process that gave us everything we are. God had nothing to do with it. Time to grow out of your fantasy if you can. Its not to late.

Falling into incoherent pulpit pounding for evolution eh?

Don't need to it since is all self-evident and even you absolute need to believe in a god is predicted. Parents are nurturing and we are genetically and psychologically connected to the nurturing bond. No surprising that humans create a god so similar to a father figure. As always all explained in evolutionary theory. You cannot disprove it and you know it.

Blather. I never created God any more than Adam did. The bible was here long before I was born.

 

[dad]

Your responses certainty indicate you do. That devil deceives you from the true natural world. Hope you grow out of it.

Lots of talk about demons and the devil from you here. Tell us plainly do you believe in them?

The mental spirits in your mind which keep you from knowing the world. Not real and self created in your mind.

Maybe get back to us when you come down or sober up.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

I am convinced now that humans are all products one way or another of supernatural beings.

OK. It has nothing to do with science and you can believe as you like. It won't change the facts of nature or make your views science.

 

[Subduction Zone]

No. They are not well understood. The plant has to be here, the earth has to be here, the sun has to be here. It is not well understood at all how they got here or why or when or how. It is not understood why the synthesis of chemicals or sugars etc occurs. They do understand how. Is it understood how the right amount of oxygen content from plants happens to be what we need to live? Is it understood why the right materials in the reaction centers in plants strip just the right number of electrons? What makes all these organized reactions work perfectly for us? What makes the forces and laws exist that govern how they work? Then there is the hydrogen produced, how is it that we get the exact materials and reactions and sequences to enable our life? Then the hydrogen that is freed results in other compounds that allow storage of energy! A natural battery system. And there are many more reactions involved, all of which are needed. To think all this is not a miracle is short sighted.

Yes, all of those are understood. You are trying to base your argument on what you do not know and are constantly moving the goalposts when it is shown that others do know.

You are using a logical fallacy. So once again why are those miracles? Not understanding something does not make that event a miracle.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Too late. Most bible prophesy is now history, regardless of how reliable you think it may be.

Actually it is not. You may be confused. Some verses that appear prophetic were history written as prophecy. There is even a term for that, but I cannot remember. Christian writers also took verses out of context that were not prophecy and reinterpreted them to pretend that they were prophecy.

When viewed rationally the prophecies of the Bible fail.

Before we even discuss prophecy there must be some reasonable ground rules. Otherwise we will have to use your standards and apply them to other religions. We will find that by your current standards all religions have "fulfilled prophecy". That would make prophecy worthless.

 

[SkepticThinker]

No. Claims of supernatural aspects of life are not physical science and need no support of the kind claims science claims demand/require!

The idea that claims don't need evidential support because they're "supernatural" or whatever, is ludicrous.

Do you believe in universe farting pixies? Why not? They exist because I said so, and you can't ask for evidence because they're supernatural universe farting pixies.
See how asinine that is?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Then support it!

I just did. That's what that entire post was.

We do. Your cult does not. Most men of all ages believe in spirits and for good reasons.

You have no such evidence. If you had, you would have presented it long ago. Fairy tales don't cut it. People used to (and still do) believe in all sorts of things. Probably even some things you don't believe in! That doesn't mean they exist.

The bible is evidenced six ways from Sunday. In people's lives, fulfilled Prophesy, miracles etc.

What I said was, we have no evidence that supernatural beings exist, and we have no evidence that supernatural beings have written books.

What your response has to do with that, I don't know.

What you cannot see is the spirts influencing the books, good or bad! So do not claim there is no inspiration, it is above the paygrade of science. (they don't even realize much of the demonic doctrines they pump out are demon inspired)

Again, what this has to do with what I wrote ... I don't know. As usual, you're just piling on more unsupported claims on top of your other ones.

Would you like to try again? I mean, somehow you've made it through my entire post while entirely avoiding the point.

 

[SkepticThinker]

False. You demo that! Many do not share your beliefs or views.

That's for sure. You apparently think reality is teeming with spirits and demons which you cannot identify to anyone else. So honestly, I'm starting to think you're a tad delusional, at this point, if you see all of that.

You do acknowledge that we reside on planet Earth, right?
And that the sun "rises" in the morning and "sets" at night when the moon comes out?
You acknowledge that animals are born and animals die?
You acknowledge that babies are conceived, and born and grow up to be adults. Etc., etc., etc.

There is a shared collective reality composed of basic facts about the world we live in. Facts that science has helped us discover. You go far beyond those into LalaLand, but you do acknowledge basic facts about reality that the rest of us also acknowledge. Facts that are demonstrably true, unlike the claims you keep trying to make.


I don't know what "you demo that!" means.

 

[SkepticThinker]

I am convinced now that humans are all products one way or another of supernatural beings.

Aside from the fact that you've avoided the point yet again ....



I'm not the product of any supernatural beings. My two human parents produced me.

But aside from that, why do you believe this now?

 

[dad]

Yes, all of those are understood. You are trying to base your argument on what you do not know and are constantly moving the goalposts when it is shown that others do know.

You are using a logical fallacy. So once again why are those miracles? Not understanding something does not make that event a miracle.

Let's take one example then and see how you fare showing that you know.

What causes the fundamental forces such as the strong nuclear force to exist, and why are they the way they are exactly? Ha

 

[dad]

Actually it is not. You may be confused. Some verses that appear prophetic were history written as prophecy. There is even a term for that, but I cannot remember. Christian writers also took verses out of context that were not prophecy and reinterpreted them to pretend that they were prophecy.

When viewed rationally the prophecies of the Bible fail..

The context is not yours to set. A king was told for example that following his kingdom there would be several others, which were detailed. That is history now.

 

[dad]

The idea that claims don't need evidential support because they're "supernatural" or whatever, is ludicrous.

Are you claiming the supernatural is natural?? Are you saying that evidence of that which is supernatural is limited to what is natural!!!!? Ha. Good luck with that. I guess oranges are limited to apples too?

Do you believe in universe farting pixies? Why not? They exist because I said so, and you can't ask for evidence because they're supernatural universe farting pixies.
See how asinine that is?

Yes. Congrats, you came up with some discombobulated blather that is assinine. What, you thought that made you win?

 

[dad]

I just did. That's what that entire post was.

For Lurkers..in case anyone thought the poster was intelligently cohesive.. here is the bulk of his post we are talking about, that he says supports his case.

"..We have no evidence of any supernatural beings.
We have no evidence that any supernatural beings have written any books. Ever

We know human beings write books. We have evidence of human beings writing books.."

Not sure what evidence of spirits or the spiritual you think would be evidence science could deal with?? The rest of mankind found evidence enough to believe in spirits. All through the world and all through history.

You have no such evidence.

?? Such evidence as...what exactly?? If you deny history and the Christian record and miracles and most religions of the planet, well, you do so without evidence!

If you had, you would have presented it long ago. Fairy tales don't cut it. People used to (and still do) believe in all sorts of things. Probably even some things you don't believe in! That doesn't mean they exist.

To break it gently to you, those that seek find. Those that deny find not. Science is not equipped to find spirits. This is news?

What I said was, we have no evidence that supernatural beings exist, and we have no evidence that supernatural beings have written books.

Billions of people have found plenty of evidence. Why insult all religions and mankind?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Are you claiming the supernatural is natural?? Are you saying that evidence of that which is supernatural is limited to what is natural!!!!? Ha. Good luck with that. I guess oranges are limited to apples too?

Nope. Try responding to the words I actually said.

That was, "The idea that claims don't need evidential support because they're "supernatural" or whatever, is ludicrous."

Claims require supporting evidence in order to be accepted.

Yes. Congrats, you came up with some discombobulated blather that is assinine. What, you thought that made you win?

LOL I was trying to demonstrate my point to someone who continually misses the point.

I can't really blame you though, I suppose I'd avoid the point too, if I were putting forth such baseless, asinine assertions.