Faith in Christ is Completely Logical

[Sapiens]

As a lifelong skeptic this statement is absolutely ridiculous. Science does and has to, rely on 'faith'.

As a lifelong skeptic myself I think that unsupported claims like the one you just made are a waste of bandwidth. At best your statement is just an argument from authority and the only authority have you claim, but have yet to establish is that you are a lifelong skeptic. Talk about ridiculousness!

 

[Desert Snake]

As a lifelong skeptic myself I think that unsupported claims like the one you just made are a waste of bandwidth. At best your statement is just an argument from authority and the only authority have you claim, but have yet to establish is that you are a lifelong skeptic. Talk about ridiculousness!

Doesn't really matter if I'm a skeptic, you can't present any theory as fact. You can present verifiable data and evidence as fact, that's all.
Doesn't matter if I'm a chicken living on mars, those facts don't change, those are basic rules of discourse.

 

[Shad]

No, we can measure gravity. What we can't do is know for sure the gravitational pull that some objects have, is what I would say to that, but I don't study these things, so that's just a laymans view on my part.
Gravity isn't a 'theory', we observe it.

Gravity is a theory and law. For a supposed lifelong skeptic you play loose with the word "theory" as those that oppose a number of theories which contradict a religious ideology.

 

[Desert Snake]

Gravity is a theory and law. For a supposed lifelong skeptic you play loose with the word "theory" as those that oppose a number of theories which contradict a religious ideology.

Gravity is an observable phenomena, not a 'theory'. There might be theories as to what causes gravity, but it's as real as apple pie. It's a 'law' in that it repeats itself, but I wouldn't go too far with that label either.

 

[Robert.Evans]

Pretty simple to falsify even if you know nothing of it:

1) there is no god, thus

2) there is no plan.

No hypocrasy (sic) involved, just common sense..

Where is you're evidence that there is no God? .... Oh right, I forgot, you don't have any. So just an assumption, so your argument fails.

What is a ''matchbook'' oh wise one with glasses. Me no afford such wonders... haha

 

[Shad]

Gravity is an observable phenomena, not a 'theory'. There might be theories as to what causes gravity, but it's as real as apple pie. It's a 'law' in that it repeats itself, but I wouldn't go too far with that label either.

Yes hence why it is a law too. A law is a description of a phenomena. It is also a theory regarding the predictable effect gravity can have on a object. As I said you are playing loose with words ignoring the fact that gravity is both a theory and law by scientific standards. Theories and hypothesis are based on observation as a primary principle of the scientific method. The explaination of the observation becomes a theory if the hypothesis is verified and repeated.

 

[Sapiens]

'theory' cannot be attached to anything that is being presented as fact.

There are no "facts" in science, only probabilities.

Doesn't really matter if I'm a skeptic, you can't present any theory as fact. You can present verifiable data and evidence as fact, that's all.
Doesn't matter if I'm a chicken living on mars, those facts don't change, those are basic rules of discourse.

When have I ever presented theory as fact? I deal in probabilities and likelihoods, since there are no "facts? It is not even a "fact" that something will fall if you drop it ... only a rather high probability that it will, based on past observation.

 

[Robert.Evans]

As a lifelong skeptic myself I think that unsupported claims like the one you just made are a waste of bandwidth. At best your statement is just an argument from authority and the only authority have you claim, but have yet to establish is that you are a lifelong skeptic. Talk about ridiculousness!

There are scientists who say the same you know.... you don't ''know'' everything, so you require faith. Remember the bus. Is it there yet? What keeps you waiting for it?

 

[Sapiens]

Where is you're evidence that there is no God? .... Oh right, I forgot, you don't have any. So just an assumption, so your argument fails.

No, one does not have to prove non-existence ... since that is quite impossible to do. There are an infinite number of rocks that a god could be hiding under and no matter how many rocks you turn over, there is always one more where he/she/it could be hiding. However proof is easy, all you have to do is turn over the correct rock and he/she/it will crawl out.

What is a ''matchbook'' oh wise one with glasses. Me no afford such wonders... haha

Here you go, oh lazy one: Matchbook - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Sapiens]

There are scientists who say the same you know.... you don't ''know'' everything, so you require faith. Remember the bus. Is it there yet? What keeps you waiting for it?

Yes I remember the bus ... you lost that one rather clearly, but now (as per the usual progression) you play the Black Knight and pretend that it was only a flesh wound.

 

[Sapiens]

Gravity is an observable phenomena, not a 'theory'. There might be theories as to what causes gravity, but it's as real as apple pie. It's a 'law' in that it repeats itself, but I wouldn't go too far with that label either.

Like gravity, evolution is an observable phenomena, the theory (of both) relates not to their actual existence but rather to their precise modes of operation.

 

[Robert.Evans]

No, one does not have to prove non-existence ... since that is quite impossible to do. There are an infinite number of rocks that a god could be hiding under and no matter how many rocks you turn over, there is always one more where he/she/it could be hiding. However proof is easy, all you have to do is turn over the correct rock and he/she/it will crawl out.

But if you can't prove it, you can't say there is not one, oh wise one. Would you like to borrow my glasses?

Here you go, oh lazy one: Matchbook - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Haha... okay, yeah, I forgot I own a computer. You get so use to it being there. haha

 

[Desert Snake]

There are no "facts" in science, only probabilities.

When have I ever presented theory as fact? I deal in probabilities and likelihoods, since there are no "facts? It is not even a "fact" that something will fall if you drop it ... only a rather high probability that it will, based on past observation.

I just have to wonder when an apple becomes an orange. They're both round...come from a tree...
Look, I'm just as skeptical of you as you are of me, I don't know why that would or should surprise you.

 

[Sapiens]

I just have to wonder when an apple becomes an orange. They're both round...come from a tree...
Look, I'm just as skeptical of you as you are of me, I don't know why that would or should surprise you.

If you want to believe that an apple becomes an orange, go right ahead, that is no more ridiculous then many other of your beliefs that seem to be near and dear to your heart.

 

[Robert.Evans]

Yes I remember the bus ... you lost that one rather clearly, but now (as per the usual progression) you play the Black Knight and pretend that it was only a flesh wound.

I don't recall losing. I think that is something you hold by faith in your own arguments.

One definition from Encarta is:

''keep faith with somebody or something to be loyal or true to a person or promise ''

What about 'keep faith with a bus turning up'. You do not know until it does. Me win I think.

 

[Serenity7855]

And that's really the point. I don't care what people CLAIM God's plan is, I care if God actually, demonstrably has a plan that we can evaluate and so far, nobody has presented any evidence that God exists, much less has a plan. It's all just empty claims made without objective evidence and if talking out of one's *** is the best they can do, then there's no basis for even having a discussion. Faith without evidence can never be logical.

I have posted a link to a full description of the plan of redemption, that you have not bothered to follow it and read it is your problem. What is even more incredible is that you are here trying to demonstrate that God is a load of old hogwash yet you do not know what the plan of salvation is. That amazes me. But you are not on your own, none of the atheists here know what the plan of redemption is, yet they claim that God is a fairy tale. Now that is true bigotry.

 

[Robert.Evans]

TPart of the Farlex dic says about faith:

''Confident belief in the truth, value, or trustworthiness of a person, idea, or thing.''

Sounds like you have faith to me. You even have to have faith in your own decision making. Don't forget. If that bus is not there on time, do not wait... you have no faith remember

 

[Serenity7855]

That would entail that things like gravitation (fact) cannot have a theory that tries to explain it.

Is that so?

Ciao

- viole

Only in science does that happen.

 

[Robert.Evans]

More on faith:



“It is likely that some people use their ideas about science to make sense of the world and for emotional compensation in difficult situations in the same way that religious people use their supernatural beliefs,” Farias says. “Our findings suggest that it may be belief itself, regardless of its content, that helps people deal with adverse situations.”

Now research suggests that some people's faith in science may serve the same role.

How Science Mimics Faith - Scientific American

 

[Serenity7855]

Doesn't really matter if I'm a skeptic, you can't present any theory as fact. You can present verifiable data and evidence as fact, that's all.
Doesn't matter if I'm a chicken living on mars, those facts don't change, those are basic rules of discourse.

Sadly, science has a different meaning for the word "theory" They claim that it is as close to a fact as one can reach which gives them the right to teach our children the theory of evolution as a fact because macroevolution cannot be observed in action.