Faithless a Choice?

[Audie]

The fleshly person is more superficial. They do not seek to understand anything outside their worldview.
Which is what I refered to. They close their minds. It's a choice they make.
One who seeks to understand would listen with understanding.
The scriptures say, "All scripture, is inspired by God." That is all... not just one verse. So the spiritual person - that is, the one who first humbles themselves like a child, would use scriptures which show that there were no talking snakes, just as there was no magically educating tree.

So if I don't believe a book full of the most
obvious falsehoods its coz am superficial?

This is a serious belief on your part?

Here on RF we find nobody more dedicated to
their closed minds than the fundamentalists

 

[Revoltingest]

Not sure I foolow what you are saying, sorry. can you elaborate?

The Bible isn't exactly loaded with claims evidenced
in reality. So many believers I know cite passages
from the book as proof that the book has evidence
& truth.
While this may be a comfort to those already believing,
it fails utterly to sway non-believers who rely upon
reason & evidence.

 

[nPeace]

Faith is about acceptance not proof

It is a stand in for knowledge when proof is unavailable.

It is based on, or founded on evidence, which does not contradict what is proven.
It is sound, even where there is no proof, of which there are many things that cannot be proven.
I cannot prove that I will be breathing tomorrow, but I do have faith in the evidence that will be the case.

 

[Audie]

Okay. The Bible contains prophecy - that is there are events written in advance, or things foretold, or predicted to happen. The prophecies in the Bible have been fulfilled exactly as prophesied.
I'll get to the specifics later, but just as a starter I want to get your position on this.
Do you deny that the Bible contains prophesies? Do you consider this to be false? On what basis?

Fulfilled exactly is just b.s.

 

[nPeace]

So if I don't believe a book full of the most
obvious falsehoods its coz am superficial?

This is a serious belief on your part?

Here on RF we find nobody more dedicated to
their closed minds than the fundamentalists

"The most obvious falsehoods" is a subjective opinion, and you are entitled to that. I feel the same way about your beliefs.
I think your beliefs are of fundamentalists too.
So where did that get us?

 

[Audie]

It is based on, or founded on evidence, which does not contradict what is proven.
It is sound, even where there is no proof, of which there are many things that cannot be proven.
I cannot prove that I will be breathing tomorrow, but I do have faith in the evidence that will be the case.

Sure is easy to prove there was no flood.

 

[Revoltingest]

Fulfilled exactly is just b.s.

I haven't yet seen the evidence for claims I hear of....
- Animals on the ark
- Talking snakes
- 6k or 10k year old Earth

 

[Audie]

"The most obvious falsehoods" is a subjective opinion, and you are entitled to that. I feel the same way about your beliefs.
I think your beliefs are of fundamentalists too.
So where did that get us?

There is nothing subjective about the fact that there was no flood.
There is no way your " faith " is on equal standing with things like facts.

 

[Audie]

I haven't yet seen the evidence for claims I hear of....
- Animals on the ark
- Talking snakes
- 6k or 10k year old Earth

Or the prophecy about Tyre, which even unto today doth prosper exceedingly

 

[Revoltingest]

Or the prophecy about Tyre, which even unto today doth prosper exceedingly

Your Bible learn'n clearly exceeds mine.
I'm thinking of those round rubber thingies on Mr Van.
But surely you have something else in mind.

 

[Audie]

Your Bible learn'n clearly exceeds mine.
I'm thinking of those round rubber thingies on Mr Van.
But I'm sure you have something else in mind.

Ha! PROOF that you is a canuk.

 

[Revoltingest]

Ha! PROOF that you is a canuk.

Well, I do live near Ameristan's hat.
Some of their 'qualities' have rubbed off'n me.

 

[nPeace]

The Bible isn't exactly loaded with claims evidenced
in reality. So many believers I know cite passages
from the book as proof that the book has evidence
& truth.

That isn't true Revoltingest.
There are many things in the Bible that "evidenced in reality". Many things.

While this may be a comfort to those already believing,
it fails utterly to sway non-believers who rely upon
reason & evidence.

That's not true either.
Many non-believers have become believers, and continue to be convinced that the Bible is true, and that includes Atheists, agnostics, scientists, communists, heartless coldblooded murderers, etc.
Surely you are not going to claim that such persons don't rely on reason & evidence... are you?

 

[nPeace]

Sure is easy to prove there was no flood.

Go ahead. Prove it.

 

[Audie]

That isn't true Revoltingest.
There are many things in the Bible that "evidenced in reality". Many things.


That's not true either.
Many non-believers have become believers, and continue to be convinced that the Bible is true, and that includes Atheists, agnostics, scientists, communists, heartless coldblooded murderers, etc.
Surely you are not going to claim that such persons don't rely on reason & evidence... are you?

Egypt, dead sea, goats, and many such
are real as can be evidenced in reality.
So what.

You rather disingenuously just speak in
general terms, so that you don't have to
plain lie to speak of things evidenced in reality.

The important stuff is as evidence free as Batboy, Nessie and Mermaids.

People who believe in ANY of the supernatural
things have zero evidence and must rely on
totally unreasonable faith to maintain the
illusion.

 

[Audie]

Go ahead. Prove it.

First tell us what the flood was.
World wide? Metaphorical?

 

[Revoltingest]

That isn't true Revoltingest.
There are many things in the Bible that "evidenced in reality". Many things.

I eagerly await your list.
But I also wonder about the claims shown false, eg,
young Earth, talking snakes, making women out of ribs.

That's not true either.
Many non-believers have become believers, and continue to be convinced that the Bible is true, and that includes Atheists, agnostics, scientists, communists, heartless coldblooded murderers, etc.
Surely you are not going to claim that such persons don't rely on reason & evidence... are you?

Your argument hasn't worked on this heathen.
While I don't know everyone, I've never met IRL an atheist
who converted to a religion. But the believers (especially
ex-Catholics & ex-Jews) who became atheists...they abound.

 

[Audie]

I eagerly await your list.
But I also wonder about the claims shown false, eg,
young Earth, talking snakes, making women out of ribs.

Your argument hasn't worked on this heathen.
While I don't know everyone, I've never met IRL an atheist
who converted to a religion. But the believers (especially
ex-Catholics & ex-Jews) who became atheists...they abound.

The "atheists" always turn out to be
religionists who tried to escape but were sucked back in.

 

[Revoltingest]

The "atheists" always turn out to be
religionists who tried to escape but were sucked back in.

I wonder if the "hate God" idea arose, ie, from a believer
who suffered in life, leading to rejecting their faith.
A lifelong atheist would have no reason to had their God.
I actually have more feelings of hatred toward Voldemort.
He seems more real.

 

[Audie]

I wonder if the "hate God" idea arose, ie, from a believer
who suffered in life, leading to rejecting their faith.
A lifelong atheist would have no reason to had their God.
I actually have more feelings of hatred toward Voldemort.
He seems more real.

Its a tell.

 

[Sunstone]

I don't even understand what you are asking here.

I see. Then logically, you did not understand the implications of your own initial remark to me.

Fascinating. But not surprising.