Ferguson!

[CynthiaCypher]

Robbing and looting random stores are a great way to garner sympathy and to fight injustice.

So what do you think of those people at Bundy?

 

[freethinker44]

I can see the Republicans grasping onto the fact the police have failed to "preserve peace, order, and the safety of the good citizens of Ferguson" and a call made for further militarization of the police as a means of "protecting the public."

Yeah, that's what I'm afraid of as well. And if that happens I can see future protests and riots becoming larger and even more violent. It's a shame some people abuse opportunities like this by looting instead using it to effect positive social change. But sometimes social change happens in spite of the looting and hopefully this is one of those situations because I can't see how police using intimidation, fear, and violence could have any kind of positive effect in a free society.

 

[dyanaprajna2011]

This is a case of voting for the lesser of two evils. What's worse: a minority breaking into stores because they don't get equal protection, or the establishment killing off minorities that don't get equal protection?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I'm right next door in Indiana, ...

Huh ???

 

[dawny0826]

It appears that an investigation is still underway, which could take about two weeks. The family has been promised a full civil rights investigation.

The police officer who shot Brown has been moved with his family out of the town as there's concern for the family's safety.

I can't fathom the pain of Brown's mother right now. I can't fathom the fear and uncertainty that Wilson's family are feeling right now.

I think the best thing that the people of Ferguson can do is focus on effective solutions for change. I'm not sure that looting and robbery accomplishes that.

And it's been demonstrated that peaceful protest is possible as is a less excessive/authoritative hand by state police.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

A lot of people playing to the camera,

and a lot of cameras feeding off the people.​

 

[Alceste]

It appears that an investigation is still underway, which could take about two weeks. The family has been promised a full civil rights investigation.

The police officer who shot Brown has been moved with his family out of the town as there's concern for the family's safety.

I can't fathom the pain of Brown's mother right now. I can't fathom the fear and uncertainty that Wilson's family are feeling right now.

I think the best thing that the people of Ferguson can do is focus on effective solutions for change. I'm not sure that looting and robbery accomplishes that.

And it's been demonstrated that peaceful protest is possible as is a less excessive/authoritative hand by state police.

The protests have been peaceful for several days now, I understand. They've also turned over handling of the police response to a much less insane person, so things are quite calm.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Sometimes I find myself wishing that folks who throw around such characterizations actually had an opportunity to experience a police state. It's a wish that I'm not particularly proud of.

I knew a Russian (Since American citizen) while in Iowa for my company training who explained life during the warsaw pact era. We have issues that need addressing, but still a ways to go by way of a bonofide police state. Hopefully we will never experience it to such a degree as he had , but that's not to say there are signs today that we could be headed potentially in that particular direction if we don't alter the course of some things sooner than later.

 

[freethinker44]

This is a case of voting for the lesser of two evils. What's worse: a minority breaking into stores because they don't get equal protection, or the establishment killing off minorities that don't get equal protection?

I really don't think this is an issue of race, it's militarization of police. It's important to address the problem of inequality as well, because it is a problem that minorities are disproportionately effected by police militarization, but I don't think anything is going to be solved if we make it a race issue.

I don't think gunning down unarmed people and routinely violating basic human rights by police is because of the ethnicity of the victim, I think probably the police confront minorities more often, and that's racist for sure, but how they handle the encounters has little to do with race I think.

 

[freethinker44]

I knew a Russian (Since American citizen) while in Iowa for my company training who explained life during the warsaw pact era. We have issues that need addressing, but still a ways to go by way of a bonofide police state. Hopefully we will never experience it to such a degree as he had , but that's not to say there are signs today that we could be headed potentially in that particular direction if we don't alter the course of some things sooner than later.

Exactly. We don't have to wait for the country to turn into Russia or nazi Germany before we can act against it.

 

[Twilight Hue]

The protests have been peaceful for several days now, I understand. They've also turned over handling of the police response to a much less insane person, so things are quite calm.

It's good to hear that. The kid was a scumbag robber, but certianly did not deserve death by being gunned down like that.

Still hopefully there will be some positive dialog as well as effective policing and enforcement that knows how to handle sensitive situations. It certianly seems there was bad blood festering between the community and it's police for awhile prior to all this happening. You dont need flashpoints like this. This could easily have ended far worse than it already has I would think.

Also Im happy to see goverment action in a positive way and hope it it a bipartisan effort to stop this type of negative progression that is happening for the future.

 

[Tarheeler]

What do you make of the events in Ferguson, Missouri?

I think it's been a long time coming, and it's a culmination of many of the problems in our country: the militarization of our police, the racial tension we love to ignore, the lack of political recourse, the incompetence we see in public officials, our lack of confidence in our legal system, groupthink and "protecting your own", the lack of effective social systems.

And there's not going to be an easy solution; real progress is only going to come by addressing the multiple problems that are contributing to it.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Exactly. We don't have to wait for the country to turn into Russia or nazi Germany before we can act against it.

Right. Its the proverbial frog being slowly boiled alive in a frying pan that dosent realise it is being boiled alive until it's too late.


Thats my personal take on what is happening here presently.
Im old enough to see what has been lost already, and im sure some even older folks than I on rf who as well notices the degradation of freedoms as well as the advancements in the same vernacular. Paradox.

My life is already over half spent, so imo it's really up to the younger generations to decide what type of country they want to enjoy life in. Seems like the value of history concerning freedoms and positive progression only becomes apparent through what we experience today by which we can gauge from.

 

[freethinker44]

I think it's been a long time coming, and it's a culmination of many of the problems in our country: the militarization of our police, the racial tension we love to ignore, the lack of political recourse, the incompetence we see in public officials, our lack of confidence in our legal system, groupthink and "protecting your own", the lack of effective social systems.

And there's not going to be an easy solution; real progress is only going to come by addressing the multiple problems that are contributing to it.

Yes, this.

People keep talking about like a race issue but it's so much more than that. We need to talk about the broader scope of the issue, which includes race, but having too narrow a focus isn't going to fix anything, maybe just bring short term relief but in the long term nothing has changed.

 

[dawny0826]

The protests have been peaceful for several days now, I understand. They've also turned over handling of the police response to a much less insane person, so things are quite calm.

Edited:

Yes - It's being handled by state police now vs. local police. The Highway Patrol officer in charge is from Ferguson and been a beneficial presence.

 

[Father Heathen]

So what do you think of those people at Bundy?

I make a sarcastic remark about how ignorant thugs are vandalizing and stealing from innocent store owners who had nothing to with the the cop shooting, in retaliation for the cop shooting (of course, I'm not referring to the protesters as a whole, which should be obvious - just the ones destroying and steal the property of others. However, there are some dishonest people here who would jump at the chance to distort my comments, so I best make this clarification), and you ask me an entirely unrelated and irrelevant question.

How strange.

But to answer to your question regardless, I admittedly don't know much about the Bundy standoff, but from what little I do he seems like a kooky, oafish yokel.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

I make a sarcastic remark about how ignorant thugs are vandalizing and stealing from innocent store owners who had nothing to with the the cop shooting, in retaliation for the cop shooting, and you ask me an entirely unrelated and irrelevant question.

How strange.

But to answer to your question regardless, I admittedly don't know much about the Bundy standoff, but from what little I do he seems like a kooky, oafish yokel.

So righteously angry and ****** off black people raging at injustice = ignorant thugs, and when white people actually point guns at cops they are just being kooky?

 

[dawny0826]

So righteously angry and ****** off black people raging at injustice = ignorant thugs, and when white people actually point guns at cops they are just being kooky?

You dodge the point he's made now, twice.

He's clearly talking about those who opt out of peaceful protest to vandalize and victimize others.

He hasn't made any racial references at all.

 

[Father Heathen]

So righteously angry and ****** off black people raging at injustice = ignorant thugs, and when white people actually point guns at cops they are just being kooky?

Predictable.

What part of "of course, I'm not referring to the protesters as a whole, which should be obvious - just the ones destroying and steal the property of others. However, there are some dishonest people here who would jump at the chance to distort my comments, so I best make this clarification" did you not understand? Do you struggle with reading comprehension?

It's perfectly understandable to be enraged by injustice. However, one can do so in a civilized manner without committing acts of injustice against innocent people themselves. After all wasn't it the cops and not the shop owners who shot the guy? Two wrongs don't make a right.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

He hasn't made any racial references at all.

Well I think he did.