For Muslims: Is Muhammad the last Prophet from God?

[InvestigateTruth]

@Link

"We had already taken the covenant of the Children of Israel and had sent to them messengers. Whenever there came to them a messenger with what their souls did not desire, a party [of messengers] they denied, and another party they killed"
5:70

Because the Messengers are made manifest in a way, that is against what their soul desire, so, they may be tested.
God tests with things that are against people's desire

 

[Link]

For the same reason, Jews do not accept Jesus and Muhammad.
For the same reason, Christians do not accept Muhammad.

You see many Christians and Jews accepting Islam after time. There is tons of converts. Where are the Shia Islam converts to Bahai Faith. You guys are an old generation. No one is interested in your interpretation now because it's unrealistic, insincere, and cultish.

 

[Link]

@Link

"We had already taken the covenant of the Children of Israel and had sent to them messengers. Whenever there came to them a messenger with what their souls did not desire, a party [of messengers] they denied, and another party they killed"
5:70

Because the Messengers are made manifest in a way, that is against what their soul desire, so, they may be tested.
God tests with things that are against people's desire

What did Messengers (a) of Bani-Israel come with against people desire? It seems they called away from love of Dunya towards the light of Welayat of the Imams.

Welayat of the light in the Imams whether of Bani-Israel or others before or Ahlulbayt of Mohammad (s) in the final period, always takes patience and certainty of God's signs to be guided by.

We saw the very few had patience with Talut (a) for example.

 

[Link]

For the same reason, Jews do not accept Jesus and Muhammad.
For the same reason, Christians do not accept Muhammad.

Also, it can't be the same reason as they were both Christians. They have to have reasons to accept Mohammad (s) but not your Prophet. What are they?

You can say Shiite Muslims over all fell in same trap. Fine. But you can't say this about people converting from one religion to another. Why don't they pick yours?

 

[InvestigateTruth]

You see many Christians and Jews accepting Islam after time. There is tons of converts. Where are the Shia Islam converts to Bahai Faith. You guys are an old generation. No one is interested in your interpretation now because it's unrealistic, insincere, and cultish.

See, you don't even know that the majority of early Babi and Baha'is were Shia.
Many of the Baha'is on this forum are Christian converts.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

What did Messengers (a) of Bani-Israel come with against people desire? It seems they called away from love of Dunya towards the light of Welayat of the Imams.

Welayat of the light in the Imams whether of Bani-Israel or others before or Ahlulbayt of Mohammad (s) in the final period, always takes patience and certainty of God's signs to be guided by.

We saw the very few had patience with Talut (a) for example.

You are making things up.
Why the Jews do not accept Jesus? Do you know?

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Also, it can't be the same reason as they were both Christians. They have to have reasons to accept Mohammad (s) but not your Prophet. What are they?

You can say Shiite Muslims over all fell in same trap. Fine. But you can't say this about people converting from one religion to another. Why don't they pick yours?

How do you know, they are not converting to Bahai faith?
Even though its been 180 years, since start of Babi, and Bahai Faith, it is the second most spread religion in the world.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

@Link

Even in our time, there are many Muslims, including Mullahs believed in the Baha'i faith.
This gentleman, who is an Iranian Shia Scholar is an example. He taught Book of iqan in 152 programs and are available on YouTube:

 

[muhammad_isa]

"We had already taken the covenant of the Children of Israel and had sent to them messengers. Whenever there came to them a messenger with what their souls did not desire, a party [of messengers] they denied, and another party they killed"
5:70

..so what is it exactly, that my "soul does not desire" about Bahai faith ?

Why does G-d say in the Qur'an that eating pig is an abomination, and then change his mind?
Jesus was a Jew, and Christians claim to follow Jesus, but they also declared pork lawful.

No .. it looks the other way around to me i.e. that people follow their desires, and believe in
one of many modern prophets, who claim authority.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

..so what is it exactly, that my "soul does not desire" about Bahai faith ?

Why does G-d say in the Qur'an that eating pig is an abomination, and then change his mind?
Jesus was a Jew, and Christians claim to follow Jesus, but they also declared pork lawful.

No .. it looks the other way around to me i.e. that people follow their desires, and believe in
one of many modern prophets, who claim authority.

Exactly as you said it yourself.
Why does the Quran teach about why people of the past rejected their Messengers? Because there are lessons in them, for the Muslims.

They said, "O salih, you were among us a man of promise before this. Do you forbid us to worship what our fathers worshipped? And indeed we are, about that to which you invite us, in disquieting doubt." 11:62

Always, when a Messenger came, He established a "Modern Religion" in their time. The religion was newer and ahead of the beliefs of the people of their time. Thus, people were resistant to accept it.
It is against people's desire to abandon thier forefathers Religion, and accept the modern Religion. That happened when Jesus came, when Moses came, when Muhammad came, and now.

 

[loverofhumanity]

You see many Christians and Jews accepting Islam after time. There is tons of converts. Where are the Shia Islam converts to Bahai Faith. You guys are an old generation. No one is interested in your interpretation now because it's unrealistic, insincere, and cultish.

Numbers is really a moot point because all religions including Islam and Christianity began with a handful of followers and only after centuries did the numbers become significant. The Baha’i Faith is only some 200 years old yet it is united and speaks with one voice while previous religions are divided into multiple sects many of whom have fought numerous wars against each other with over 1 million killed in the Iran- Iraq conflict of Muslims vs Muslims. Why can’t Sunni and Shiah or Catholic and Protestant unite as they follow the same Holy Book?

Since when have numbers been the benchmark of truth? As a former Christian I rejected Muhammad but as a Baha’i I gladly embrace Him and the Quran. Baha’u’llah teaches us to accept truth and Islam is true.

 

[Link]

You are making things up.
Why the Jews do not accept Jesus? Do you know?

One hadith you might be interested in is one comparing the Messengers of Bani-Israel with the family of Mohammad (s):

31ـ أَحْمَدُ بْنُ إِدْرِيسَ عَنْ مُحَمَّدِ بْنِ حَسَّانَ عَنْ مُحَمَّدِ بْنِ عَلِيٍّ عَنْ عَمَّارِ بْنِ مَرْوَانَ عَنْ مُنَخَّلٍ عَنْ جَابِرٍ عَنْ ابي جعفر (عَلَيْهِ السَّلام) قَالَ أَ فَكُلَّما جاءَكُمْ مُحَمَّدٌ بِما لا تَهْوى‏ أَنْفُسُكُمُ بِمُوَالاةِ عَلِيٍّ فَ اسْتَكْبَرْتُمْ فَفَرِيقاً مِنْ آلِ مُحَمَّدٍ كَذَّبْتُمْ وَفَرِيقاً تَقْتُلُونَ.

31. Ahmad ibn Idris has narrated from Muhammad ibn Hassa’n from Muhammad ibn Ali from ‘Ammar ibn Marwan from Munakhkhal from Jabir from abu Ja‘far (a.s.) who said. "Every time there came to you a Mohammad by that which you souls did not desire of the Authority/Mastery/Guardianship of Ali so some of the family Mohammad you denied and some you killed".

Al-Kāfi - Volume 1, Enlightening Points Deduced from the Holy Quran about Leadership with Divine Authority), Hadith #31

The verse it's making analogy with is 2:87.

 

[muhammad_isa]

It is against people's desire to abandon thier forefathers Religion, and accept the modern Religion..

It depends what the religion is..
I am aware that many western people embrace Asian philosophies..
..particularly those that promote anarchy .. free-love .. meditation etc.

..but I would agree that human beings are tribal in nature, and don't like losing their status.
..but becoming a 'greedy pig' .. no thanks. I have discovered the truth, and have no intention
of that sort of compromise .. black pudding and bacon are off the menu.

 

[Link]

Numbers is really a moot point because all religions including Islam and Christianity began with a handful of followers and only after centuries did the numbers become significant. The Baha’i Faith is only some 200 years old yet it is united and speaks with one voice while previous religions are divided into multiple sects many of whom have fought numerous wars against each other with over 1 million killed in the Iran- Iraq conflict of Muslims vs Muslims. Why can’t Sunni and Shiah or Catholic and Protestant unite as they follow the same Holy Book?

Since when have numbers been the benchmark of truth? As a former Christian I rejected Muhammad but as a Baha’i I gladly embrace Him and the Quran. Baha’u’llah teaches us to accept truth and Islam is true.

Okay fair enough. Upon my research, I found there are people who believe there are successors to Baha'allah alive today as well as other differing views. But you guys aren't killing each other which is good.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

One hadith you might be interested in is one comparing the Messengers of Bani-Israel with the family of Mohammad (s):

31ـ أَحْمَدُ بْنُ إِدْرِيسَ عَنْ مُحَمَّدِ بْنِ حَسَّانَ عَنْ مُحَمَّدِ بْنِ عَلِيٍّ عَنْ عَمَّارِ بْنِ مَرْوَانَ عَنْ مُنَخَّلٍ عَنْ جَابِرٍ عَنْ ابي جعفر (عَلَيْهِ السَّلام) قَالَ أَ فَكُلَّما جاءَكُمْ مُحَمَّدٌ بِما لا تَهْوى‏ أَنْفُسُكُمُ بِمُوَالاةِ عَلِيٍّ فَ اسْتَكْبَرْتُمْ فَفَرِيقاً مِنْ آلِ مُحَمَّدٍ كَذَّبْتُمْ وَفَرِيقاً تَقْتُلُونَ.

31. Ahmad ibn Idris has narrated from Muhammad ibn Hassa’n from Muhammad ibn Ali from ‘Ammar ibn Marwan from Munakhkhal from Jabir from abu Ja‘far (a.s.) who said. "Every time there came to you a Mohammad by that which you souls did not desire of the Authority/Mastery/Guardianship of Ali so some of the family Mohammad you denied and some you killed".

Al-Kāfi - Volume 1, Enlightening Points Deduced from the Holy Quran about Leadership with Divine Authority), Hadith #31

The verse it's making analogy with is 2:87.

I see the Hadith in agreement with the concept of oneness of Prophets.

"Everytime a Muhammad comes" meaning all Messengers are one.
There was another Hadith that Muhammad said "I am all the Prophets" and Ali is all the Successors.

 

[Link]

I see the Hadith in agreement with the concept of oneness of Prophets.

"Everytime a Muhammad comes" meaning all Messengers are one.
There was another Hadith that Muhammad said "I am all the Prophets" and Ali is all the Successors.

That is part of it but it’s also making analogy with the family of Mohammad and Ali with the family of Musa and Haroun.

It’s also saying that what nation of Mohammad and Ali did was worse in that the ones they were rejecting and killing from his family were at the caliber of Mohammad.

There is also the Hadith “the first of us is Mohammad the middle of us is Mohammad and the last of us is Mohammad and we are all Mohammad”

Can you share the Hadith with the Arabic and source.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

It depends what the religion is..
I am aware that many western people embrace Asian philosophies..
..particularly those that promote anarchy .. free-love .. meditation etc.

..but I would agree that human beings are tribal in nature, and don't like losing their status.

Ok

..but becoming a 'greedy pig' .. no thanks.

I don't know what you mean by greedy pig.
But I see, there is no limit in reaching the Truth. We can only walk toward God, in the path of God, but never will reach it. Only getting closer a bit.

I have discovered the truth, and have no intention
of that sort of compromise .. black pudding and bacon are off the menu.

Hmmmm

You think Religion came to teach us, just not eat pork?

 

[InvestigateTruth]

That is part of it but it’s also making analogy with the family of Mohammad and Ali with the family of Musa and Haroun.

It’s also saying that what nation of Mohammad and Ali did was worse in that the ones they were rejecting and killing from his family were at the caliber of Mohammad.

There is also the Hadith “the first of us is Mohammad the middle of us is Mohammad and the last of us is Mohammad and we are all Mohammad”

Can you share the Hadith with the Arabic and source.

فقال الإمام (عليه السلام): لا تعجبوا من قدرة الله أنا محمد ومحمد أنا، وقال محمد: يا قوم لا تعجبوا من أمر الله أنا علي وعلي أنا، وكلنا واحد من نور واحد وروحنا من أمر الله، أولنا محمد وأوسطنا محمد وآخرنا محمد وكلنا محمد

بحار الأنوار - العلامة المجلسي - ج ٢٦ - الصفحة ١٦

shiaonlinelibrary.com

"The Imam (peace be upon him) said: 'Do not be amazed at the power of God. I am Muhammad and Muhammad is me.' And Muhammad said: 'O people, do not be amazed at the decree of God. I am Ali and Ali is me. We are all one from a single light, and our spirit is from the command of God. Our first is Muhammad, our middle is Muhammad, our last is Muhammad, and our all Muhammad.'"

 

[TransmutingSoul]

There is also the Hadith “the first of us is Mohammad the middle of us is Mohammad and the last of us is Mohammad and we are all Mohammad”

This reflects passages from other scriptures, all the Messengers are One, and a s such they are all the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End, the Alpha and Omega, and all that is in-between.

Thus when we embrace God via the Messengers, then we become Muslims from the beginning until the end and all that is in-between.

Passages such as Revelation 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

The next Messenger after Jesus was Muhammad who came in the AD 600's.

Regards Tony

 

[Link]

There is a place for those expressions but they are obviously hyperbola. The Quran also refers to Ali as the self of the Prophet Mohammad in the aya of Mubahila. But those expressions have a proper place and literal statements also have a proper place. Hyperbole is obvious when the literal is impossible or by context highly improbable.