mikkel_the_dane
My own religion
Well, we agree. And we then subjectively choose to call that irrational. That is my point. Not that it is irrational with evidence, rather it is an assessment.
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God can not be disproven by science
- Thread starter Starlight
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Well, we agree. And we then subjectively choose to call that irrational. That is my point. Not that it is irrational with evidence, rather it is an assessment.
anotherneil
Well-Known Member
Sorry if this was already brought up, but the flying spaghetti monster can't be disproven by science, either.
mikkel_the_dane
My own religion
Nor that we could be in a variant of a Boltzmann Brain universe or in a computer simulation.
Science is done using the axiomatic assumption that the universe is natural. There is no proof that is the case.
Peace to all,
God, can't be disproven by science, some believe.
To me God can be proven by logic.
To me God existed as The Body of God and as the Eternal Authority in spirit and life existed before creation was ever created was even created from the Person of The Word as God through the Person of Jesus, The Christ, for the Father. The infallible intelligence that manifests eternity forever through His Will is delivered through the Flesh of The person of Jesus, as God from the Holy Spirit Person, as God as The Christ, for all souls of the beings in the Body of God, all mankind to become the again in the image of the Father, God as united.
Peace always,
Stephen Andrew
God, can't be disproven by science, some believe.
To me God can be proven by logic.
To me God existed as The Body of God and as the Eternal Authority in spirit and life existed before creation was ever created was even created from the Person of The Word as God through the Person of Jesus, The Christ, for the Father. The infallible intelligence that manifests eternity forever through His Will is delivered through the Flesh of The person of Jesus, as God from the Holy Spirit Person, as God as The Christ, for all souls of the beings in the Body of God, all mankind to become the again in the image of the Father, God as united.
Peace always,
Stephen Andrew
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anotherneil
Well-Known Member
Did you ever watch the 1983 movie Scarface, with Al Pacino? While Tony Montana (main character, played by Pacino) is having an argument with Frank Lopez, the guy he worked for, Montana retorts to Lopez's statement that he's giving him orders with this:
The point is that we live in a reality of pain & pleasure, and it doesn't make any difference what you want to call this reality (a computer simulation, a brain in a box or jar, a cave allegory type of situation, the Matrix, etc.); unless a person is self-destructive (for whatever reason), they're going to strive to achieve satisfaction and maximum pleasure, and minimize pain & suffering, or try to avoid these undesirable conditions altogether. Pain & pleasure exist and affect us, regardless of what kind of universe or reality we exist in.
Science is useful for making improvements to humanity that can and do provide more satisfaction and pleasure; for example, it helps to increase our access to food, which helps with satisfaction, by making it easier to produce more food to put on our plates with less effort. Same with roofs to go over our heads (i.e. shelter), including HVAC systems, lighting & power/energy for stoves, toasters, ovens, etc. Science is what has been very effective in being able to achieve much better access to these things than what our religious & superstitious ancestors tried to rely on hundreds or thousands of years ago.
Yes, science does also make us much more effective at creating weapons of war and destruction, but either way, we know that science gets results - good or bad.
Proving or disproving the existence of deities or fictional creatures that are obviously a gag or parody to make light of some of the obvious flaws with religion doesn't put food on my plate, or a roof over my head, or a source of energy for cooking my food or keeping it cold/refrigerated.
How do you think that God can be proven by logic?
Most of what you describe strikes me as things that you could have no reliable way to know are true.
mikkel_the_dane
My own religion
Yeah, if you are in certain variants of a Boltzmann Brain universe there is no universe as you understand it and no real world/reality.
We are debating different versions of epistemology, metaphysics and so on. And not just religion.
As for science I rather go with this site than some poster on the Internet:
Peace to all,
Thanks, yes,
In order for God to be God is that He has to be preexistant, and the in logic to me the laws of the universe existed for creation before creation was created.
Peace always,
Stephen Andrew
Thanks, yes,
In order for God to be God is that He has to be preexistant, and the in logic to me the laws of the universe existed for creation before creation was created.
Peace always,
Stephen Andrew
mikkel_the_dane
My own religion
You do understand the difference between valid and sound in logic, right?
Peace to all,
Yes, valid logic is the "AI" artificial intelligence with choice and is the "Big Bang" failed logic of teh universe and sound logic is Creation in order as the fulfilled logical intelligence, the "RI" real intelligence of eternity as unfailing with no chance of failure with choice removed, in logic.
The finite disciplines of earth fail and can only be understood in logic, to me.
Peace always,
Stephen andrew
Yes, valid logic is the "AI" artificial intelligence with choice and is the "Big Bang" failed logic of teh universe and sound logic is Creation in order as the fulfilled logical intelligence, the "RI" real intelligence of eternity as unfailing with no chance of failure with choice removed, in logic.
The finite disciplines of earth fail and can only be understood in logic, to me.
Peace always,
Stephen andrew
That's just more claims, not a logical proof.
mikkel_the_dane
My own religion
So you don't know the difference between valid and sound as per logic. Okay, thank you.
firedragon
Veteran Member
Mate. Even the scientific method was a philosophical concept and philosophical axiom. Of course falsifiability is a philosophical axiom but applicable to science, not to philosophical discourse.
What assumption about what you believe did I make? I was explaining what you got wrong. You spoke of "irrational belief" and I was explaining your error.
Anyway, I don't think this conversation could go anywhere. So thanks for engaging. I withdraw.
Cheers.
firedragon
Veteran Member
That's true. But this is whataboutism.
AppieB
Active Member
So you think you can only show something is false in science? That's a weird take.
The assumptions I underscored in the reply.
That is not Whataboutism.
firedragon
Veteran Member
Google whataboutism.
firedragon
Veteran Member
Strawman mate. Weird indeed.
AppieB
Active Member
I did and that's not it.
firedragon
Veteran Member
"Whataboutism or whataboutery (as in "what about....?") is a pejorative for the strategy of responding to an accusation with a counter-accusation instead of........"
Whataboutism - Wikipedia
Cheers.
AppieB
Active Member
"God can not be disproven by science" is a statement, not an accusation."Whataboutism or whataboutery (as in "what about....?") is a pejorative for the strategy of responding to an accusation with a counter-accusation instead of........"
Whataboutism - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
Cheers.
"The flying spaghetti monster can't be disproven by science, either." is a statement (not a counter-accusation) to show that the first statement is not a valid reason to believe that therefore God exists.
So this is not an example of Whataboutism.