GOP rallies around Trump following FBI search of his estate

[Revoltingest]

Especially if they really believe that the election was stolen - against the assurance of all the election supervisors (dems and pubs) and all the courts. If they can believe that, they have no trust in democracy - and no love for it.

As I see it, they trust democracy.
But not the evil Democrats who steal elections.

I think you fail to see the perspective of cult members.
Sure, what they believe is incredible. But consider
the ramifications of such beliefs...good intentions
can lead to evil acts.
For example, US soldiers who fought in Vietnam,
Afghanistan, & Iraq...was it really their objective to
go needlessly kill & be killed? Of course not.

 

[RestlessSoul]

They are on fire. It’s awesome. Democrats’ fear of being smited is justified.

Smited?


I think the word is smitten.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

GOP rallies around Trump following FBI search of his estate

Grim news on the Trump front: ...

I always thought the term "news" implied "new and unexpected."

 

[Polymath257]

The president not knowing a raid was going to happen on another former president?

You actually believe that lie,?

Yes. That is how it is *supposed* to work.

 

[Heyo]

As I see it, they trust democracy.
But not the evil Democrats who steal elections.

I think you fail to see the perspective of cult members.
Sure, what they believe is incredible. But consider
the ramifications of such beliefs...good intentions
can lead to evil acts.
For example, US soldiers who fought in Vietnam,
Afghanistan, & Iraq...was it really their objective to
go needlessly kill & be killed? Of course not.

You know that I'm a big fan of Hanlon's Razor. But the level of stupidity required to believe in "the steal" with good intentions is inconceivable. To become a Trump cultist in the first place requires disregard for human rights and democracy. It's not that Trump has been introduced as a paragon of virtues who later turned out to be evil. The Trumpists knew what they were voting for.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Yes. That is how it is *supposed* to work.

No it isn't. Not at all. But I do think I get the 'gist' of it.

 

[Stevicus]

A democracy where more than half the people don't like democracy is toast. Burnt toast.
I also don't know if the US voters realize that the 2024 election may be the last in US history if they so wish.

A key talking point among conservatives and rightists is the idea that "America is not a democracy, but a republic." I never considered that to be entirely accurate, as we're more a "democracy in a republic" or a "democratic-republic," which is just another way of saying "representative democracy."

But in any case, not everyone views democracy as some kind of sacred cow, and there's always been a certain level of cynicism about elections and the electoral process (from both sides of the spectrum). I wouldn't interpret it as meaning "dislike" for democracy, but more a tacit acknowledgement of Churchill's opinion that "democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the other forms of government" (not sure of the exact quote, so I may have that wrong).

Also, considering how America was founded, even the original framers of the Constitution had some misgivings about democracy, which is why we have the Electoral College, and it's also why the Supreme Court and other federal judgeships are appointed and not elected.

Personally, I believe in more democracy, yet in my experience, I find that most people in America seem to resist that idea. For example, I've argued in the past that not only should the Supreme Court justices be elected, but also the Cabinet posts, as well as key posts such as CIA Director, FBI Director, Joint Chiefs of Staff, etc. These should all be elected directly by the people, but I find a great deal of resistance to that idea.

Makes me wonder if Americans ever really liked democracy in the first place, but if we're ever in a position where we might lose it, it would be because of that.

I guess the real question is whether "the people" are capable of governing themselves or not. Is the populace intelligent enough to lead instead of follow? Do they hold their government officials accountable if they can't get the job done? Are they skeptical of government statements? Are they vigilant enough to discern wrongdoing by government? Do they know that the government is supposed to work for the benefit of the people and that, in effect, they work for us?

This is where the rubber meets the road and can mean the difference between living in freedom or under tyranny. But there's always an ebb and flow, it's never 100% one or the other. In any case, regardless of what might happen, I seriously doubt that there's any possibility that the 2024 election could be our last. At the very least, the illusion of democracy will have to be maintained, as it already has been for decades.

 

[Polymath257]

No it isn't. Not at all. But I do think I get the 'gist' of it.

Yes, it actually is how it is supposed to work: the President is not supposed to dictate how investigations are done. For that reason, they should be kept in the dark about any cases currently in process until something about that case is made public.

As with many things, Trump violated that rule of conduct as well, attempting to direct the Justice Department in ways that are not supposed to be done.

 

[F1fan]

I think what matters for fair judgement is looking for motives simply because if there is no motive then there is no sane reason to engage or for anything significant to happen.

Fact is that democrats hold the power and have leverage over Trump.

Well Trump lost re-election, and he did that himself for being inept as president. I can't see any circumstance for Trump to be elected again given his past performance and the mounting legal issues against him, both criminal and civil.

Trump wants to nominate for 2024 elections and that's his motive.

The actual motives are money and being president affords him certain protection from legal jeopardy. He couldn't stop the state crimes in Georgia but he could use his power to avoid being taken into custody if he is indicted. It is all new territory for our nation.

Motive of GOP is 2024 elections thus they support Trump but also need to prevent denigration of Trump by democrats,
because if he is denigrated then he's not appropriate to become president.

Trump is arguably not fit to be president. He wasn't before but now fewer citizens are willing to vote for him. The republicans want to win seats in congress and in states so they can be in a position to deny certification of the 2024 election for president. This is being reported in many swing states. The republican governor candidates for pennsylvania and Arizona have both said they won't certify an election result unless Trump wins. That is a promise to commit fraud. These two, among others, are promising to commit election fraud for the sake of Trump. That makes them unfit.

Democrats have 2 strong motives:
1) they want to stay in power and denigrating trump is a good option for them to hold position

Well politics does include this tactic regardless of who it is.

2) if they lose elections Trump may return them favor and politically persecute them for abusing their power

But democrats aren't abusing their power. The congress is conducting an oversight investigation into Trump and other crimes against the congress and the USA. And the DOJ is investigating various crimes by Trump. Georgia is investigating Trump for election fraud and interference. There are people in many states who signed fake elector documents to replace duly elected and named electors, and they are being investigated for election crimes. Trump is being investigated in New York for tax fraud and real estate fraud. That could lead to criminal charges of tax fraud.

So the legal process does its thing and if there have been crimes committed those involved will face legal jeopardy. Trump gets no exceptions. Many folks seems to treat Trump with kid gloves, as if the crimes is just Trump being Trump, it's who he is. It's like saying "oh don't arrest the guys on the football team for rape, it's just boys being boys. You don't want to ruin their future."

Therefore what will happen is either Trump in jail or finned or democrats lose elections and face political persecution.

The republicans have vowed for paybacks against democrats. What I have yet to see is why. They want to impeach Biden, but for what? I think they are in danger of risking bad theater based on nothing, and facing less approval by moderates and independents. Republicans are acting like spoiled brats who aren't getting their way, and believe they are entitled to do whatever they want. There is a serious lack of ethics and duty. I suspect republicans will take over the House but I think they are ruining their chance the more they go into far right rhetoric, and offer nothing for the American people.

Republicans really think they are entitled to power, but they need to earn the trust first. They aren't.

 

[F1fan]

The president not knowing a raid was going to happen on another former president?

You actually believe that lie,?

The Biden administration is doing something the Trump administration didn't do: be ethical. And of course the far right won't believe ethics is applied by democrats because it only makes the right look more corrupt by contrast. And instead of demanding more ethics from republicans the far right just mocks and doubts anyone has ethics. If they really believed this they why are they complaining?

What the DOJ does as its job is their responsibility. Biden has his own set of duties keeping him busy. Just accept the fact that the law is catching up to Trump. pick a better candidate next time.

 

[wellwisher]

They were 100% all in on the FBI going after Hillary. But of course their extremely sensitive natures cannot tolerate the shoe being on the other foot.

Add to that fanatical confirmation bias and we see the result absolute fanatical devotion to Il Duce Trump

If I recall they never raided Hillary Clinton's home, nor did she ever have any legal repercussions for similar and worse things. She removed classified information into a private e-mail server and then destroy government property and evidence, after being told to preserve all the data. Her and Bill even took furniture from the White House. She was deem untouchable by Comey and the FBI. That is not even the job as the head of FBI; swamp broke more rules.

Do you think a dual justice system is fair? Do you always blame the victims of the dual justice system?
Isn't this the same philosophy used in Democrat run cities that free the criminals and ignore the plight of the victims?

This will become a rally cry that awakens the freedom fighters of America. This was all about politics and the optics for the 2024 election. The Democrats are still afraid of Trump and need him out of the way by hook or crook. This particular act went too far and will turn the tide. All the misinformation and propaganda have done, to divide the Republican party, is now erased. The poor economy will divide the Democrats; workers versus takers, while the Republicans will now have to unite.

If you read behind the scenes, this FBI operation was going on for many days before Trump made the announcement. It was overseen by his son, while Trump was in NY. Now Biden and his AG are under the microscope and have some explaining to do. Does anyone know how many FBI raids the Democrats has made on political opponents since 2016? The Republican Party is uniting to face a common threat from the enemies of Democracy; weaponized government.

 

[Shaul]

The GOP push to portray Trump as the victim of a politicized Justice Department ignored the potential criminal misconduct that justified the search in the eyes of a federal judge.

The search warrant wasn’t signed by a Federal judge. It was signed by a Federal magistrate.
Difference Between Judge and Magistrate | Compare the Difference Between Similar Terms

 

[SkepticThinker]

If I recall they never raided Hillary Clinton's home, nor did she ever have any legal repercussions for similar and worse things. She removed classified information into a private e-mail server and then destroy government property and evidence, after being told to preserve all the data. Her and Bill even took furniture from the White House. She was deem untouchable by Comey and the FBI. That is not even the job as the head of FBI; swamp broke more rules.

Do you think a dual justice system is fair? Do you always blame the victims of the dual justice system?
Isn't this the same philosophy used in Democrat run cities that free the criminals and ignore the plight of the victims?

This will become a rally cry that awakens the freedom fighters of America. This was all about politics and the optics for the 2024 election. The Democrats are still afraid of Trump and need him out of the way by hook or crook. This particular act went too far and will turn the tide. All the misinformation and propaganda have done, to divide the Republican party, is now erased. The poor economy will divide the Democrats; workers versus takers, while the Republicans will now have to unite.

If you read behind the scenes, this FBI operation was going on for many days before Trump made the announcement. It was overseen by his son, while Trump was in NY. Now Biden and his AG are under the microscope and have some explaining to do. Does anyone know how many FBI raids the Democrats has made on political opponents since 2016? The Republican Party is uniting to face a common threat from the enemies of Democracy; weaponized government.

You mean the same Comey that announced on television just a few days before the election that Hilary Clinton was under investigation? That's the Comey and the FBI that deemed her "untouchable," is it?

You know the current FBI Director was nominated by Trump and approved by Congress, right?

The rest of your post is just a bunch of typical whataboutism.

 

[F1fan]

If I recall they never raided Hillary Clinton's home, nor did she ever have any legal repercussions for similar and worse things. She removed classified information into a private e-mail server and then destroy government property and evidence, after being told to preserve all the data. Her and Bill even took furniture from the White House. She was deem untouchable by Comey and the FBI. That is not even the job as the head of FBI; swamp broke more rules.

More disinformation in your posts.

• Clinton used a private email server BEFORE there was a rule against it. So no rule break there.
• The security problem was because she had emails that included secure information.
• When asked for the server she removed personal emails only.
• Notice the emails that had secure data were still there, so if she deleted evidence why was the evidence still there?
• Comey's announcement of an new investigation into Clinton 11 days before the election was deemed improper. It was only an investigation into Clinton's aid's laptop, and nothing was found. It was considered to be a reason why Clinton lost the election to Trump.

Do you think a dual justice system is fair?

Nope, and this is why Trump get's investigated for his misconduct. He get's no more exemption than Clinton did.

Do you always blame the victims of the dual justice system?

Do you mean what republicans are saying when they take over the congress, and won't hold Trump accountable for the things he's being investigated for?

Isn't this the same philosophy used in Democrat run cities that free the criminals and ignore the plight of the victims?

Site your far right disinformation as a source.

This will become a rally cry that awakens the freedom fighters of America.

The Jan 6 rioters? I think they learned their lesson.

This was all about politics and the optics for the 2024 election. The Democrats are still afraid of Trump and need him out of the way by hook or crook. This particular act went too far and will turn the tide. All the misinformation and propaganda have done, to divide the Republican party, is now erased. The poor economy will divide the Democrats; workers versus takers, while the Republicans will now have to unite.

Republicans are divided by ethics. A few still have ethics, and the majority seem to be following Triump's corrupt and unethical approach to life and politics. America deserves better and ethical representatives, not these anti-democracy MAGAs.

If you read behind the scenes, this FBI operation was going on for many days before Trump made the announcement. It was overseen by his son, while Trump was in NY. Now Biden and his AG are under the microscope and have some explaining to do. Does anyone know how many FBI raids the Democrats has made on political opponents since 2016? The Republican Party is uniting to face a common threat from the enemies of Democracy; weaponized government.

Oh the irony.

 

[Revoltingest]

You know that I'm a big fan of Hanlon's Razor. But the level of stupidity required to believe in "the steal" with good intentions is inconceivable.

Stupidity, or rather susceptibility to illusion is more
common than you think. I know many people who
believe that government agents follow them around,
that government is trying to assassinate them, that
government created the SARS CoV-2 virus, that a
sky fairy created & judges us, that planet alignment
rules our lives, etc, etc.

To become a Trump cultist in the first place requires disregard for human rights and democracy. It's not that Trump has been introduced as a paragon of virtues who later turned out to be evil. The Trumpists knew what they were voting for.

I have friends who belong to Trump's cult.
They're fine people who are productive citizens,
but they drank the Kool-Aid. I'll agree that Trump
is evil, ie, that he knows better, but is manipulating
useful idiots.

 

[paradox]

Trump says FBI wouldn't let his attorneys watch raid (nypost.com)

This suggests FBI might have used the opportunity to plant evidence against Trump.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Yes, it actually is how it is supposed to work: the President is not supposed to dictate how investigations are done. For that reason, they should be kept in the dark about any cases currently in process until something about that case is made public.

As with many things, Trump violated that rule of conduct as well, attempting to direct the Justice Department in ways that are not supposed to be done.

Not informing the top leader about what your doing...


Sounds so... WW2 - ish involving certain powers.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Trump says FBI wouldn't let his attorneys watch raid (nypost.com)

This suggests FBI might have used the opportunity to plant evidence against Trump.

I suggest that Trump is full of ****.

 

[paradox]

I suggest that Trump is full of ****.

If you have nothing to hide then why are you hiding?
After all attorneys are legal entities not "natural" entities.

 

[SkepticThinker]

If you have nothing to hide then why are you hiding?
After all attorneys are legal entities not "natural" entities.

They didn't hide. They presented a legal search warrant and searched.