Heading to an Israeli - Lebanon Iran etc War

[InChrist]

Most of Jews came as refugees from Europe after WW2,that's why most of cities are Arabic names.
Jews are only buy lands, there are millions Palestinians refugees because, israel kicked them from their homes.
Western bank is live example of selters armed. Protected by Israeli army.

Arabs fight with Hitler!
Algeria my country, fought hitler with Allies.
Most of countries were occupied after the ww2 all gain there independent. Only Palestin.

The West "allies" won most racist regime in europe in 1945, then created most criminal racist regime in world in 1948.

From my understanding, Israel did not kick the Arab population out of their homes. On the contrary, it was the Arab leadership who told them to get out before they attacked Israel in May 1948. The Israelis asked their Arab neighbors to stay in their homes.

So, what about the hundreds of thousands of Jewish refugees who were persecuted and kicked out of their homes in Arab nations…even before the newly formed nation of Israel came into being?

“Massacres of Jews living in Arab countries, such as the Constantine pogrom, exhibiting a sadism suddenly familiar to us, are virtually unknown outside those communities which directly suffered them. Yet these events also foreshadowed the pogrom of 7 October. Over the centuries, riots in Morocco were so frequent that Jews had to be locked into a walled Jewish quarter or Mellah. One of the worst massacres of the 20th century occurred in 1945, in Tripoli, Libya, and claimed 130 Jewish lives. And then there was the Farhud, the 1941 pogrom against the Jews of Iraq in which 179 identified Jews were murdered, women raped and babies mutilated.

All these episodes predated the creation of the state of Israel. They belie the common impression that Jews and Muslims coexisted happily until the Jewish state was born, and debunk the myth that violence against Jews can be blamed on Israel. In fact Israel was not the cause, but the solution to pre-existing antisemitism. The oppressed Jews of the Muslim world finally had somewhere to go. There were 850,000 Jewish refugees. Today 50 percent of Jews in Israel have their roots in Arab and Muslim countries.”

Jews from Arab countries have seen it all before

From the blog of Lyn Julius at Jewish News

blogs.timesofisrael.com

 

[InChrist]

That supports bragging rights over hummus. For anything else, it is pitifully uninformed.

Not bragging, just historical reality. Maybe you aren’t as informed as you think….


“Palestine of today [1922], the land we know as Palestine, was peopled by the Jews from the dawn of history until the Roman era. It is the ancestral homeland of the Jewish people. They were driven from it by force by the relentless Roman military machine and for centuries prevented from returning. At different periods various alien people succeeded them but the Jewish race had left an indelible impress upon the land.

Today it is a Jewish country. Every name, every landmark, every monument and every trace of whatever civilization remaining there is still Jewish. And it has ever since remained a hope, a longing, as expressed in their prayers for these nearly 2,000 years. No other people has ever claimed Palestine as their national home. No other people has ever shown an aptitude or indicated a genuine desire to make it their homeland.

Historian James Parkes explained why it is so important to remind the world that the Jews never left Israel: “The omission [of the fact of continual Jewish presence in the land] allowed the anti-Zionist, whether Jewish, Arab or European, to paint an entirely false picture of the wickedness of Jewry in trying to re-establish a two-thousand-year-old claim the country, indifferent to everything that had happened in the intervening period.”

We Never Left: The Jews' Continuous Presence in the Land of Israel

m.jpost.com

 

[Ben Dhyan]

It seems the Palestinians are all considered Arabs, but it is worth considering that in the 7th century, the majority of Christians at the time of the Islamic takeover of 'Palestine' became Muslims. Most of these Christians would presumably be of Jewish descent genetically. The extent of Jewish conversion to Islam is not spoken of, or even acknowledged by most Jewish scholars, but there would be some. The Samaritans too would also have converted to Islam.

So I would guess that all the people in the land that once was known as Israel who converted to Islam, are not all of Arab descent, but so far as present day Palestinian culture goes, yes, definitely Arab culture.

 

[muhammad_isa]

..to suggest that the U.S. is targeting "the Palestinians" is convenient nonsense.

I am not suggesting that..
I'm saying that it is popular in the US, to consider Israel/Palestine as 'belonging to the Jews',
and Trump's leadership (and those that keep him in power), purposely ignore the
views of the rest of the world (UN).

On December 6, 2017, the United States of America officially recognized Jerusalem as the capital city of the State of Israel.
...
Trump's decision was rejected by the vast majority of world leaders; the United Nations Security Council held an emergency meeting on December 7, where 14 out of 15 members condemned it, but the motion was overturned by U.S. veto power.
United_States_recognition_of_Jerusalem_as_capital_of_Israel

 

[Godobeyer]

From my understanding, Israel did not kick the Arab population out of their homes. On the contrary, it was the Arab leadership who told them to get out before they attacked Israel in May 1948. The Israelis asked their Arab neighbors to stay in their homes.

So, what about the hundreds of thousands of Jewish refugees who were persecuted and kicked out of their homes in Arab nations…even before the newly formed nation of Israel came into being?

“Massacres of Jews living in Arab countries, such as the Constantine pogrom, exhibiting a sadism suddenly familiar to us, are virtually unknown outside those communities which directly suffered them. Yet these events also foreshadowed the pogrom of 7 October. Over the centuries, riots in Morocco were so frequent that Jews had to be locked into a walled Jewish quarter or Mellah. One of the worst massacres of the 20th century occurred in 1945, in Tripoli, Libya, and claimed 130 Jewish lives. And then there was the Farhud, the 1941 pogrom against the Jews of Iraq in which 179 identified Jews were murdered, women raped and babies mutilated.

All these episodes predated the creation of the state of Israel. They belie the common impression that Jews and Muslims coexisted happily until the Jewish state was born, and debunk the myth that violence against Jews can be blamed on Israel. In fact Israel was not the cause, but the solution to pre-existing antisemitism. The oppressed Jews of the Muslim world finally had somewhere to go. There were 850,000 Jewish refugees. Today 50 percent of Jews in Israel have their roots in Arab and Muslim countries.”

Jews from Arab countries have seen it all before

From the blog of Lyn Julius at Jewish News

blogs.timesofisrael.com

You thinking? You have to rethink made your neutral research, not based on idealogy if it ok since they are chosen people, God will return to them.

There are million of Palestinians refugees because israel kicked them, since Israel created they kick Arabs and say it's our land.

I never heard about massacres toward Jews in Arab countries after 1948.
It's probably your thinking is came from anti_arabs sources.

I am not anti-jews but I am anti israel anti idea of chosen people,which made them feel have rights to oppression the others, since they not Jews.

Btw Islam is most close religion to Judaism.(not christianity)
And Arabs are most close race to Jews.
This paradox,unsafety, is came from extreme zionist regime whom took control Israel.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Not bragging, just historical reality. Maybe you aren’t as informed as you think….

And maybe not. The fact that "Palestine of today [1922], the land we know as Palestine, was peopled by the Jews from the dawn of history until the Roman era" is neither contested nor relevant. Work on your reading comprehension.

Speaking of reading comprehension, you might wish to read A History of Israel: From the Rise of Zionism to Our Time or, perhaps, Palestine 1936: The Great Revolt and the Roots of the Middle East Conflict.

I seriously doubt that you will. (I own both and have recommended Sachar's history here on RF as far back as 2010.)

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I'm saying that it is popular in the US, to consider Israel/Palestine as 'belonging to the Jews',
and Trump's leadership (and those that keep him in power), purposely ignore the
views of the rest of the world (UN).

What does that even mean? It's popular among some and unpopular among others.

There is a marked difference between claiming the Israel-Palestine belongs to the Jews and asserting the Jews (too) have a right of self-determination. Hence we get the International positions regarding two-state solutions. Also, from the Pew Research Center report dated 21 March 2024:

One of the few opinions a solid majority of Americans can agree on when it comes to the Israel-Hamas war is that lasting peace is unlikely. Only 3% say it is either extremely or very likely, while 9% say it’s somewhat likely. Fully 68% say a lasting peace between Israelis and Palestinians is either not too or not at all likely.​

​

Opinion is somewhat more mixed when it comes to the best possible outcome of the conflict. A plurality (40%) says the best outcome would be a two-state solution – splitting the land into two countries, one with an Israeli government and one with a Palestinian government. But many Americans remain unsure of the best outcome (30%), and some prefer a model in which all the land is one country with an Israeli government (14%) or one country that is jointly governed by Israelis and Palestinians (13%). Few prefer the land to be one country with a Palestinian government (2%).​

​

Jewish Americans (46%) and Muslim Americans (41%) also tend to think a two-state solution is the best possible outcome, but about one-in-five people in each group support a one-state option. Among Jews, 22% would prefer for all the land to be one country with an Israeli government. Among Muslims, 20% would like all the land to be under a Palestinian government.​

​

Overall, Americans’ support for a two-state solution has increased modestly since 2022, from 35% to 40%. Much of the shift has come among Democrats and Democratic-leaning independents. Today, 48% of Democrats favor a two-state solution, up from 36% in 2022. Indeed, this shift has opened up a partisan gap in views of the two-state solution that was not present in 2022.​

Finally, I would (and have) argued that support for and against a two-state solution is heavily influenced by how one answers two very different questions:

1. Is it just?
2. Is it achievable?

I suspect that a great many Americans, Israelis, and Palestinians, would answer yes to the first question and no to the second.

I began this response by noting the "difference between claiming the Israel-Palestine belongs to the Jews and asserting the Jews (too) have a right of self-determination." Let me now ask you a couple of question:

• Do you assert that Jews also have a right of self-determination?
• Would you support a just two-state solution if achievable?

Shalom/salaam ...

 

[muhammad_isa]

What does that even mean? It's popular among some and unpopular among others..

True, but the political system is skewed towards the wealthy.
i.e. "the man that pays the piper calls the tune"

..and it's very clear what it means. The US ignored the rest of the world, when declaring
Jerusalem as the capital of the Zionist state of Israel. Why would that be, do you think?

One of the few opinions a solid majority of Americans can agree on when it comes to the Israel-Hamas war is that lasting peace is unlikely. Only 3% say it is either extremely or very likely, while 9% say it’s somewhat likely. Fully 68% say a lasting peace between Israelis and Palestinians is either not too or not at all likely.​

I would agree .. it is unlikely.
When one party dominates and controls, and the rest of the world have no say in it..

Do you assert that Jews also have a right of self-determination?

I would say that all parties have a right to self-determination.

• Would you support a just two-state solution if achievable?

Of course .. if that's what the parties want.
..but it's gone too far now. The declaration of Jerusalem as the capital of Israel cannot be undone.
..and a large number of people want Trump to win the next US election.

Shalom/salaam ...

..and peace be with you, brother.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

The US ignored the rest of the world, when declaring
Jerusalem as the capital of the Zionist state of Israel. Why would that be, do you think?

First, thank you for your response. As for your question, I'm assuming that you're referring to the following 12/7/2020 Statement by Former President Trump on Jerusalem:

THE PRESIDENT: Thank you. When I came into office, I promised to look at the world’s challenges with open eyes and very fresh thinking. We cannot solve our problems by making the same failed assumptions and repeating the same failed strategies of the past. Old challenges demand new approaches.​

​

My announcement today marks the beginning of a new approach to conflict between Israel and the Palestinians.​

​

In 1995, Congress adopted the Jerusalem Embassy Act, urging the federal government to relocate the American embassy to Jerusalem and to recognize that that city — and so importantly — is Israel’s capital. This act passed Congress by an overwhelming bipartisan majority and was reaffirmed by a unanimous vote of the Senate only six months ago.​

​

Yet, for over 20 years, every previous American president has exercised the law’s waiver, refusing to move the U.S. embassy to Jerusalem or to recognize Jerusalem as Israel’s capital city.​

​

[emphasis added - JS]​

So, why? The quick answer is: Trump.

Please note the parts that I've highlighted. The point should be obvious: while it's true that Trump, a President that lost the popular vote, chose to "ignore the rest od the world," America did not, and American Presidents refused "to move the U.S. embassy to Jerusalem or to recognize Jerusalem as Israel’s capital city" for over two decades.

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

From my understanding, Israel did not kick the Arab population out of their homes. On the contrary, it was the Arab leadership who told them to get out before they attacked Israel in May 1948. The Israelis asked their Arab neighbors to stay in their homes.

So, what about the hundreds of thousands of Jewish refugees who were persecuted and kicked out of their homes in Arab nations…even before the newly formed nation of Israel came into being?

“Massacres of Jews living in Arab countries, such as the Constantine pogrom, exhibiting a sadism suddenly familiar to us, are virtually unknown outside those communities which directly suffered them. Yet these events also foreshadowed the pogrom of 7 October. Over the centuries, riots in Morocco were so frequent that Jews had to be locked into a walled Jewish quarter or Mellah. One of the worst massacres of the 20th century occurred in 1945, in Tripoli, Libya, and claimed 130 Jewish lives. And then there was the Farhud, the 1941 pogrom against the Jews of Iraq in which 179 identified Jews were murdered, women raped and babies mutilated.

All these episodes predated the creation of the state of Israel. They belie the common impression that Jews and Muslims coexisted happily until the Jewish state was born, and debunk the myth that violence against Jews can be blamed on Israel. In fact Israel was not the cause, but the solution to pre-existing antisemitism. The oppressed Jews of the Muslim world finally had somewhere to go. There were 850,000 Jewish refugees. Today 50 percent of Jews in Israel have their roots in Arab and Muslim countries.”

Jews from Arab countries have seen it all before

From the blog of Lyn Julius at Jewish News

blogs.timesofisrael.com

Hi there

Just out of curiosity did you fact check everything the article is saying because some things might be incorrect ?

 

[Revoltingest]

Does Israel really want an all-out war with Iran? I suspect that the Israeli government thinks they can do whatever they want to do with only a bearable cost. That arrogance might wind up being very costly.

Israel envisions war with Iran as being waged
primarily by USA. With the cost borne by another,
Israel may easily justify expanding its wars.

 

[InChrist]

Hi there

Just out of curiosity did you fact check everything the article is saying because some things might be incorrect ?

If you point out particular things you think are incorrect, I will look further into it. I have definitely read numerous accounts of Jews being persecuted, had their homes and property stolen, and were driven out of Arab countries.

 

[InChrist]

And maybe not. The fact that "Palestine of today [1922], the land we know as Palestine, was peopled by the Jews from the dawn of history until the Roman era" is neither contested nor relevant. Work on your reading comprehension.

I think it’s relevant because it shows that the land of Israel belongs to the Jewish people.

Speaking of reading comprehension, you might wish to read A History of Israel: From the Rise of Zionism to Our Time or, perhaps, Palestine 1936: The Great Revolt and the Roots of the Middle East Conflict.

I seriously doubt that you will. (I own both and have recommended Sachar's history here on RF as far back as 2010.)

Those sound like they would be interesting books. I have read The History of the Jews, by Paul Johnson, although it’s been awhile.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I think it’s relevant because it shows that the land of Israel belongs to the Jewish people.

It shows nothing of the kind.

 

[InChrist]

It shows nothing of the kind.

You are certainly entitled to your perspective. I believe otherwise.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

You are certainly entitled to your perspective. I believe otherwise.

It's not a question of opposing beliefs. It's a question of rejecting ludicrous inferences.

 

[InChrist]

It's not a question of opposing beliefs. It's a question of rejecting ludicrous inferences.

Again, you are certainly free to reject whatever you like and/or consider my perspective ludicrous. I would not hold my beliefs if I thought they were ludicrous or anything less than reality.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I would not hold my beliefs if I thought they were ludicrous or anything less than reality.

Agreed.

 

[InChrist]

Agreed.

Anyway, have a good night.

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

If you point out particular things you think are incorrect, I will look further into it. I have definitely read numerous accounts of Jews being persecuted, had their homes and property stolen, and were driven out of Arab countries.

the riots in marocco was that not after the creation of Israel?
Also being locked in mellah is just something weird to say. In Jewish tradition they tend to live in isolated place because that was something they wanted.
A Jew with the name Rabbi Shapiro mentioned this in one of his interviews. Also what he mentioned what was interested is that a creation of Israel would make Jews unwanted in their own countries. Obviously that’s not right, but that is what happened, and in order to create a Jewish state you have to remove the indigenous people and this is really what made the Muslim community aggressive towards Jews , and again this wasn’t right

Also something to consider is that the nazis also had certain influences in Northern Africa like Algeria and marrocco.