homosexual

[Unveiled Artist]

Sorry for the interuption @Bible Student still waiting for your counter. /gets her popcorn/

@Bible Student what you said here is a contradiction:

Jesus fulfilled the law.When Jesus came he did away with Mosaic law and installed the new arrangement. <- which is it...fulfilled it or got rid of it? The Messianic law. He did not destroy it.The Mosaic law was a temporary arrangement. <- So Moses Law was temporarly put on hold?​

• • Galatians 3:24 So the Law became our guardian leading to Christ,so that we might be declared righteous through faith. But wait, I thought the Law was done away with? (Fufilled, done away with, then put on hold? Now its leading to Christ?)
    
    So Jesus did not destroy the law (He didnt destroy but did away with; arent those the same?), he fulfilled it.The Messianic law is similar to the Mosaic law.

So, Jesus fulfilled the Law, so it was done away with even though it lead people to Christ, people dont need it anymore? Yet, Christ followed the Law of Moses and summed it up in two commandments. He also didnt like the Jews puting the rituals over the Law (His Father's teachings). From those verses, thats seems kind of odd for Christ to follow a Law that He destroyed and fulfilled at the same time.

Oh. Also, Jesus didnt fulfill the Law by destroying it. He add more and revised the Law of Moses. Mathew 5:17-46. (I have read the full gospels. Just going back over my notes /blows off dust/)

Also, Id like to see answers to somereason, jostories and albeit questions. Those were good too.

 

[SomeRandom]

No offense, but isn't that a tad immature? Same Random asked you a very good question, albeit couched in terms I might not have used. Are you unable to see beyond the terms to the actual argument he presented, which I, too, asked before I saw his post. If you don't have a cogent counter argument, why not say that, or simply say its your belief. No one here can effect your beliefs, unless you let them.

I'M A SHE, ACTUALLY.

 

[JoStories]

I'M A SHE, ACTUALLY.

You know..I knew that and when I had signed off last night, I recalled that you were. So sorry M'lady.

 

[Nada]

No offense, but isn't that a tad immature? Same Random asked you a very good question, albeit couched in terms I might not have used. Are you unable to see beyond the terms to the actual argument he presented, which I, too, asked before I saw his post. If you don't have a cogent counter argument, why not say that, or simply say its your belief. No one here can effect your beliefs, unless you let them.

No offense taken.No,it is not.I already know where this is headed so I would rather not.Thanks though.

 

[Nada]

Sorry for the interuption @Bible Student still waiting for your counter. /gets her popcorn/

@Bible Student what you said here is a contradiction:

Jesus fulfilled the law.When Jesus came he did away with Mosaic law and installed the new arrangement. <- which is it...fulfilled it or got rid of it? The Messianic law. He did not destroy it.The Mosaic law was a temporary arrangement. <- So Moses Law was temporarly put on hold?​

• • Galatians 3:24 So the Law became our guardian leading to Christ,so that we might be declared righteous through faith. But wait, I thought the Law was done away with? (Fufilled, done away with, then put on hold? Now its leading to Christ?)
    
    So Jesus did not destroy the law (He didnt destroy but did away with; arent those the same?), he fulfilled it.The Messianic law is similar to the Mosaic law.

So, Jesus fulfilled the Law, so it was done away with even though it lead people to Christ, people dont need it anymore? Yet, Christ followed the Law of Moses and summed it up in two commandments. He also didnt like the Jews puting the rituals over the Law (His Father's teachings). From those verses, thats seems kind of odd for Christ to follow a Law that He destroyed and fulfilled at the same time.

Oh. Also, Jesus didnt fulfill the Law by destroying it. He add more and revised the Law of Moses. Mathew 5:17-46. (I have read the full gospels. Just going back over my notes /blows off dust/)

Also, Id like to see answers to somereason, jostories and albeit questions. Those were good too.

Popcorn? Lol...Let me go deep so you may fully understand. What I said is not a contradiction.It is a misunderstanding on your part is all.Moses led God's people out of Egypt and these people were baptized through Moses in water symbolically.

1 Corinthians 10:2 1 For I do not want you to be unaware, brethren, that our fathers were all under the cloud and all passed through the sea; 2 and all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea; 3 and all ate the same spiritual food;…

Moses was God's anointed one.Anointed means Christ.All of the Israelites were baptized and led by Moses.He showed God's people the laws and acted as their Shepherd.Moses was a foreshadow of Jesus Christ to come.The similarities are awesome.

Both were deemed for execution as infants by pagan kings.
Moses hid in Egypt as a child. Jesus hid in Egypt as a child.
Moses fasted 40 days and faced a spiritual crisis on a mountain
and Jesus fasted 40 days and faced a spiritual crisis on a mountain.
Moses told people about the need for a Passover lamb. Jesus became the Passover lamb.
Moses communicated directly with God Jesus communicated directly with God

When Jesus arrived all the Jews were strict followers of the Mosaic law.Jesus ,a Jew,followed the law.But Jesus fulfilled the law by coming and doing what he did.

1. "Jesus came to fulfill all that was written in the Law and the Prophets. All of it was pointing to him even where it is not explicitly prophetic. He accomplishes what the Law required. Matthew 5:17-18: Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.Feb 23, 2005"
   
   Google
   
   Jesus Christ was the end of the Mosaic law and the beginning of the new law, or new covenant.
   
   Romans 10:4,5 …4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes. 5 For Moses writes that the man who practices the righteousness which is based on law shall live by that righteousness.6But the righteousness based on faith speaks as follows: "DO NOT SAY IN YOUR HEART, 'WHO WILL ASCEND INTO HEAVEN?' (that is, to bring Christ down),…
   
   So the Mosaic law was not destroyed.It was complete and fulfilled when Jesus arrived as prophesied.The Messianic law is pretty much the same.That is why it is not destroyed.Certain things were no longer needed like,circumcision.This practice was part of the old covenant God had with Abraham's seed.
   
   Romans 2:29 No, a person is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a person's praise is not from other people, but from God.
   
   
   Kosher laws such as eating shellfish or pork were lifted since praying for one's food sanctifies it as explained in 1 Timothy 4:3-5.
   
   "3They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth. 4For everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving, 5because it is consecrated by the word of God and prayer."
   
   So everything else pretty much stayed in tact.There were some adjustments to the original laws.But it was not destroyed.Many of the Jews could not fathom the idea of being around Gentiles or even worshipping together.Jesus changed everything.God poured out His holy spirit among the nations.This was prophecy.So it was no longer just for the Jews but for the Gentile too.All of mankind would have a chance for salvation through Jesus Christ.

Acts 10:45 The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astonished that the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out even on Gentiles.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

So, are we supposed to be believe Jesus, who said he did not come to do away with the law, or Paul, who said he did, and who also much more OT when it came to the law and punishment?
And if Paul did away with the law (because clearly Jesus said that was not his intention), then why is it he forgot to do away with the prohibitions on homosexuality, when he allegedly all the other abominations became non-abominations?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I read this in full. Its more simple meanings.

Does fulfilling the Law that is not destroyed just mean Jesus made adjustments to it as in the verses I gave you?

I agree with the Jews about keeping the Laws or Moses while I agree that they also have faith when they practice those Laws. They are not babbling prayers like the pagans do. The Christian separation from God's Laws in the OT makes me wonder why Christians even consider the Old as God's Word. Why wouldnt the Old be a support for God's Word in the new?

How do you fulfill a Law you throw away? How do you throw a way a Law you dont destroy? How and why can anyone, Jesus included, make adjustments to God's Laws? They are summarized, true. Just because they are summarized (not NT) that does not mean they are obstalete.

Christianity is interesting in how they plave Jesus over God. Divinity excluded. Moses didnt fulfill and throw away the former covernent (cant remember how many there are) of His people. God (not Moses) made a simplified list of ways to devote themselves to God. Yet, they were still required to obey them.

I honestly believe in actions and how they show devotion. Loving God and loving thy neighbor arent abstract commands. That is why the Law was written, so Gods people would do these things to show their "faith and love" to Him and to His neighbor.

Jesus said Hr fulfilled the Law. Why would you say it was thrown away if it has not been distroyed?

I dont agree with Jesus that the laws shouldnt apply to people. Maybe He saw the Laws being abused? As they certainly are. Maybe that is why God summed it up in two commandments. That certainly does not mean they are thrown away. Nor should it mean it is not meant to be followed anymore.

I agree with the Jews in this respect. I read the full NT and up to Joshua in the Old. Id have to go throught Jesus History to understand why He thrown away laws He He fulfilled and why christians dont follow laws that arent destroyed. Its a puzzle.

Did you answer jostories, abeit, and reason yet? They have good questions (excluding the "youre not supporting yourself" comments...but, um, I see whyd they say that)

Popcorn? Lol...Let me go deep so you may fully understand. What I said is not a contradiction.It is a misunderstanding on your part is all.Moses led God's people out of Egypt and these people were baptized through Moses in water symbolically.

1 Corinthians 10:2 1 For I do not want you to be unaware, brethren, that our fathers were all under the cloud and all passed through the sea; 2 and all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea; 3 and all ate the same spiritual food;…

Moses was God's anointed one.Anointed means Christ.All of the Israelites were baptized and led by Moses.He showed God's people the laws and acted as their Shepherd.Moses was a foreshadow of Jesus Christ to come.The similarities are awesome.

Both were deemed for execution as infants by pagan kings.
Moses hid in Egypt as a child. Jesus hid in Egypt as a child.
Moses fasted 40 days and faced a spiritual crisis on a mountain
and Jesus fasted 40 days and faced a spiritual crisis on a mountain.
Moses told people about the need for a Passover lamb. Jesus became the Passover lamb.
Moses communicated directly with God Jesus communicated directly with God

When Jesus arrived all the Jews were strict followers of the Mosaic law.Jesus ,a Jew,followed the law.But Jesus fulfilled the law by coming and doing what he did.

1. "Jesus came to fulfill all that was written in the Law and the Prophets. All of it was pointing to him even where it is not explicitly prophetic. He accomplishes what the Law required. Matthew 5:17-18: Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.Feb 23, 2005"
   
   Google
   
   Jesus Christ was the end of the Mosaic law and the beginning of the new law, or new covenant.
   
   Romans 10:4,5 …4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes. 5 For Moses writes that the man who practices the righteousness which is based on law shall live by that righteousness.6But the righteousness based on faith speaks as follows: "DO NOT SAY IN YOUR HEART, 'WHO WILL ASCEND INTO HEAVEN?' (that is, to bring Christ down),…
   
   So the Mosaic law was not destroyed.It was complete and fulfilled when Jesus arrived as prophesied.The Messianic law is pretty much the same.That is why it is not destroyed.Certain things were no longer needed like,circumcision.This practice was part of the old covenant God had with Abraham's seed.
   
   Romans 2:29 No, a person is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a person's praise is not from other people, but from God.
   
   
   Kosher laws such as eating shellfish or pork were lifted since praying for one's food sanctifies it as explained in 1 Timothy 4:3-5.
   
   "3They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth. 4For everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving, 5because it is consecrated by the word of God and prayer."
   
   So everything else pretty much stayed in tact.There were some adjustments to the original laws.But it was not destroyed.Many of the Jews could not fathom the idea of being around Gentiles or even worshipping together.Jesus changed everything.God poured out His holy spirit among the nations.This was prophecy.So it was no longer just for the Jews but for the Gentile too.All of mankind would have a chance for salvation through Jesus Christ.

Acts 10:45 The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astonished that the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out even on Gentiles.

 

[Nada]

I read this in full. Its more simple meanings.

Does fulfilling the Law that is not destroyed just mean Jesus made adjustments to it as in the verses I gave you?

I agree with the Jews about keeping the Laws or Moses while I agree that they also have faith when they practice those Laws. They are not babbling prayers like the pagans do. The Christian separation from God's Laws in the OT makes me wonder why Christians even consider the Old as God's Word. Why wouldnt the Old be a support for God's Word in the new?

How do you fulfill a Law you throw away? How do you throw a way a Law you dont destroy? How and why can anyone, Jesus included, make adjustments to God's Laws? They are summarized, true. Just because they are summarized (not NT) that does not mean they are obstalete.

Christianity is interesting in how they plave Jesus over God. Divinity excluded. Moses didnt fulfill and throw away the former covernent (cant remember how many there are) of His people. God (not Moses) made a simplified list of ways to devote themselves to God. Yet, they were still required to obey them.

I honestly believe in actions and how they show devotion. Loving God and loving thy neighbor arent abstract commands. That is why the Law was written, so Gods people would do these things to show their "faith and love" to Him and to His neighbor.

Jesus said Hr fulfilled the Law. Why would you say it was thrown away if it has not been distroyed?

I dont agree with Jesus that the laws shouldnt apply to people. Maybe He saw the Laws being abused? As they certainly are. Maybe that is why God summed it up in two commandments. That certainly does not mean they are thrown away. Nor should it mean it is not meant to be followed anymore.

I agree with the Jews in this respect. I read the full NT and up to Joshua in the Old. Id have to go throught Jesus History to understand why He thrown away laws He He fulfilled and why christians dont follow laws that arent destroyed. Its a puzzle.

Did you answer jostories, abeit, and reason yet? They have good questions (excluding the "youre not supporting yourself" comments...but, um, I see whyd they say that)

I explained it as clear and lengthy as possible.everything is there.I cannot explain it anymore clearer than that.

Ps.I do not care about what jo thinks, or asks really.When people start telling me to respond,I will do the opposite.Nobody tells me when or how to respond.Im just saying in general,not to you.I do not do as people tell me or want me to do.I will respond,if I wish to do so,when I am ready,not when people are ready.I do support myself.I do not run.For what? I am either busy or of that person talks bad to me,I just simply do not respond.It has nothing to do with me not supporting myself.I don't play those games.I am here to discuss things,not be spoken to like a kid.If someone starts talking all rowdyI just cut them off and do away with them.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I read them in full. I see how He fulfilled the Law. I dont see how it makes sense when you said way earlier He threw it away. Then said He didnt distroy it. So He fulfulled the Law of Moses (as you said), did not destroyed it via the summaration of the Laws into two, then you said He threw it away.

That last part throws the your whole point, bible verses included.

Aso, even if I asked the same questions (the ones related to the topic not the ones saying why you are not answering; the topic question not their comments), it would still be valid. I have to look them up again. Ignore their comments. The topic question is something I would ask to. I was wondering if you have biblical verses and explanation for those as well.

I explained it as clear and lengthy as possible.everything is there.I cannot explain it anymore clearer than that.

Ps.I do not care about what jo thinks, or asks really.When people start telling me to respond,I will do the opposite.Nobody tells me when or how to respond.Im just saying in general,not to you.I do not do as people tell me or want me to do.I will response,if I wish to do so,when I am ready,not when people are ready.I do support myself.I do not run.DFor what? I am either busy or of that person talks bad to me,I just simply do not respond.It has nothing to do with me not supporting myself.I don't lay those games.I am here or discuss things,not be spoken to like a kid.If someone starts talking all rowdyI just cut them off and do away with them.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

@Bible Student

For example, if the old law was fulfilled and thrown away, why does the laws against fastint for God by astrainint from certain foods allnof the sudden not pleasing to God but the abolition of homosexuality in lev. does?

Why are some laws in the old testament used as a defense but not others that have nothing to do with sin?

 

[Nada]

I read them in full. I see how He fulfilled the Law. I dont see how it makes sense when you said way earlier He threw it away. Then said He didnt distroy it. So He fulfulled the Law of Moses (as you said), did not destroyed it via the summaration of the Laws into two, then you said He threw it away.

That last part throws the your whole point, bible verses included.

Aso, even if I asked the same questions (the ones related to the topic not the ones saying why you are not answering; the topic question not their comments), it would still be valid. I have to look them up again. Ignore their comments. The topic question is something I would ask to. I was wondering if you have biblical verses and explanation for those as well.

I never said,"He threw it away." I stated in post #567,Jesus fulfilled the law.When Jesus came he did away with Mosaic law and installed the new arrangement.

Also in post #565 God does not hate those who enjoy eating shellfish.That has been done away with already.

So it was never destroyed.It was revised so to speak,as I explained earlier about circumcision,shellfish,pork etc.., to name a few changes.

Ps.How can you question me about what I say, or anything I present ,when you do not even know what words I am actually saying?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I never said,"He threw it away." I stated in post #567,Jesus fulfilled the law.When Jesus came he did away with Mosaic law and installed the new arrangement.

Also in post #565 God does not hate those who enjoy eating shellfish.That has been done away with already.

So it was never destroyed.It was revised so to speak,as I explained earlier about circumcision,shellfish,pork etc.., to name a few changes.

Ps.How can you question me about what I say, or anything I present ,when you do not even know what words I am actually saying?

What did you mean by this:

Jesus fulfilled the law.When Jesus came he did away with Mosaic law and installed the new arrangement. The Messianic law. He did not destroy it.The Mosaic law was a temporary arrangement.

If He did away with it, how can He revise it? If you left that part, done away with, out the post would make more sense.

--

Ill be on a desktop soon to find that post.

 

[Nada]

@Bible Student

For example, if the old law was fulfilled and thrown away, why does the laws against fastint for God by astrainint from certain foods allnof the sudden not pleasing to God but the abolition of homosexuality in lev. does?

Why are some laws in the old testament used as a defense but not others that have nothing to do with sin?

I can see now we will never really get anywhere because you are caught up on words.I am sorry but I feel it necessary to end this convo.No need in going in circles.Thanks.

 

[Nada]

What did you mean by this:

Jesus fulfilled the law.When Jesus came he did away with Mosaic law and installed the new arrangement. The Messianic law. He did not destroy it.The Mosaic law was a temporary arrangement.

If He did away with it, how can He revise it? If you left that part, done away with, out the post would make more sense.

--

Ill be on a desktop soon to find that post.

No need.We will go nowhere.Just in circles.You are not paying attention to the scriptures.You are caught up on words.

 

[Nada]

So, are we supposed to be believe Jesus, who said he did not come to do away with the law, or Paul, who said he did, and who also much more OT when it came to the law and punishment?
And if Paul did away with the law (because clearly Jesus said that was not his intention), then why is it he forgot to do away with the prohibitions on homosexuality, when he allegedly all the other abominations became non-abominations?

It is very simple Shadow.Jesus fulfilled the law.This means the Mosaic law was done.The Mosaic law was installed to have the Israelites follow God and His laws.It led to the arrival of Jesus Christ.when Jesus arrived,as prophesied,he fulfilled the law and it was complete.Now,Jesus installed the new covenant with his disciples, and the new law was the Messianic law.This new Messianic law was just like the Mosaic law with some changes to it.Things like circumcision were done away with.It was a promise to Abraham's seed, by God, in the old covenant, God had with him.Circumcision was no longer needed when Jesus came because now all were allowed to serve God.Not just the Jews.You have to really know scripture to follow.Also eating shellfish and pork were no longer forbidden because Jesus preached that as long as you pray for your food before you eat it,it is then sanctified by God.

So these things were changed,as well as other things like sacrificing animals for atonement purposes.Jews used to have to do this to cleanse from sins with animal sacrifices.When Jesus came he was the ransom sacrifice and died one time for all of mankind.He wiped away Adamic sin by dying for all of us.So these animal sacrifices are no longer needed.High priest that took the animal sacrifices are no longer needed too, since Jesus is the last High Priest, and now we pray to God through Jesus Christ.It goes deeper.There is a lot to it.Even the Sabbath was done away with.

Now as far as homosexuality is concerned.According to the holy scriptures,this is sexual immorality.This is always forbidden by God.This will never be accepted.The Messianic law still has some of the Ten Commandments.Jesus preaches not to kill.He preached love.He preached against any form of sexual immorality.He preached there is one God and not to have other god's.Jesus made it very clear in his teachings and his disciples carried this same message.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I can see now we will never really get anywhere because you are caught up on words.I am sorry but I feel it necessary to end this convo.No need in going in circles.Thanks.

I see beyond the Bible. It isnt the source of my life. So, the only way I understand biblical conversations is to directly accompany scriptures (just as the Quran and Sutras) with direcg interpretation "and" comment.

I will always see the love that two people express both in their hearts, mind, and body. I cannot separate the heart from body expressions with they compliment each other.

Hence is why biblical explanations do not make sense because God love the sinner and hates the sin.

As long as you, no offense, see physical expression of love between two men or two women who also love each other by heart and by their God, as a sin then there will always be a honest and, to me, sad religious descrimination between these each couple who are not lusting over each other as each bible scripture you posted and i have read says.

We cannot get over the fact that homosexual acts are a son and i feel people who love each other by heart, by mind, and by body have a right to physically express that love.

I would like you to understand that not agree. I dont care to change anyones mind but understand the logistics behind their thinking.

I only had a couple of people who gave me insights without defense. The priest and my heart. The priest gave me cultural insight on why it is a sin. My heart let ms accept that to antigay christians it will always be.

Cheerios!

 

[Nada]

I see beyond the Bible. It isnt the source of my life. So, the only way I understand biblical conversations is to directly accompany scriptures (just as the Quran and Sutras) with direcg interpretation "and" comment.

I will always see the love that two people express both in their hearts, mind, and body. I cannot separate the heart from body expressions with they compliment each other.

Hence is why biblical explanations do not make sense because God love the sinner and hates the sin.

As long as you, no offense, see physical expression of love between two men or two women who also love each other by heart and by their God, as a sin then there will always be a honest and, to me, sad religious descrimination between these each couple who are not lusting over each other as each bible scripture you posted and i have read says.

We cannot get over the fact that homosexual acts are a son and i feel people who love each other by heart, by mind, and by body have a right to physically express that love.

I would like you to understand that not agree. I dont care to change anyones mind but understand the logistics behind their thinking.

I only had a couple of people who gave me insights without defense. The priest and my heart. The priest gave me cultural insight on why it is a sin. My heart let ms accept that to antigay christians it will always be.

Cheerios!

Ok.Cool.Thanks.

Ps.I am digging the Amadeus movie pic of Salieri. 80's!!!

 

[dgirl1986]

To reiterate what I have said in another thread...why are people so concerned with us and our personal lives? Aren't there more important things to concern yourself with?

 

[JoStories]

I read this in full. Its more simple meanings.

Does fulfilling the Law that is not destroyed just mean Jesus made adjustments to it as in the verses I gave you?

I agree with the Jews about keeping the Laws or Moses while I agree that they also have faith when they practice those Laws. They are not babbling prayers like the pagans do. The Christian separation from God's Laws in the OT makes me wonder why Christians even consider the Old as God's Word. Why wouldnt the Old be a support for God's Word in the new?

How do you fulfill a Law you throw away? How do you throw a way a Law you dont destroy? How and why can anyone, Jesus included, make adjustments to God's Laws? They are summarized, true. Just because they are summarized (not NT) that does not mean they are obstalete.

Christianity is interesting in how they plave Jesus over God. Divinity excluded. Moses didnt fulfill and throw away the former covernent (cant remember how many there are) of His people. God (not Moses) made a simplified list of ways to devote themselves to God. Yet, they were still required to obey them.

I honestly believe in actions and how they show devotion. Loving God and loving thy neighbor arent abstract commands. That is why the Law was written, so Gods people would do these things to show their "faith and love" to Him and to His neighbor.

Jesus said Hr fulfilled the Law. Why would you say it was thrown away if it has not been distroyed?

I dont agree with Jesus that the laws shouldnt apply to people. Maybe He saw the Laws being abused? As they certainly are. Maybe that is why God summed it up in two commandments. That certainly does not mean they are thrown away. Nor should it mean it is not meant to be followed anymore.

I agree with the Jews in this respect. I read the full NT and up to Joshua in the Old. Id have to go throught Jesus History to understand why He thrown away laws He He fulfilled and why christians dont follow laws that arent destroyed. Its a puzzle.

Did you answer jostories, abeit, and reason yet? They have good questions (excluding the "youre not supporting yourself" comments...but, um, I see whyd they say that)

Thanks Carlita but what I have found of late is that many of these so called Christians, and it's not all by any means as I have been having a nice reparte' with 1Robin of late, these others, when questioned about their beliefs, based on Biblical tenets, tend to run and hide when pressed. When someone presses me about my beliefs and presents me with a cogent counter argument, I like it because I'm forced to examine those beliefs for this other argument and defend myself. It's rather refreshing IMO.

 

[JoStories]

So, are we supposed to be believe Jesus, who said he did not come to do away with the law, or Paul, who said he did, and who also much more OT when it came to the law and punishment?
And if Paul did away with the law (because clearly Jesus said that was not his intention), then why is it he forgot to do away with the prohibitions on homosexuality, when he allegedly all the other abominations became non-abominations?

An excellent point Shadow and one that, as yet, no Christian has been able to defend with any credulity. IMO, Paul knew nothing of what Christ taught and only sought to further his own, or that of the aspiring RCC, wanted to have the followers adhere to. It's clearly, at least to me, Paulian dogma and not one iota of what Christ taught.