How can Christianity and Judaism both exist?

[Me Myself]

I am confused.

Christianity claims that Christ was the Son of God and that this is the only true path to follow.

Judaism does not recognise Jesus as being the Son yet the Jews are the chosen people.

Both religions share the same God - therefore one religion must be wrong, right?

This is like some kind of religious paradox.

How is it important if both exist?

Both realities can´t be correct, but is natural to say that persons that belief in both realities exist.

This religions would only be imposible to live both if everyone knew the truth about this God (given it is this one that exists) and that would render atheism useless too

 

[Me Myself]

I tried that. It doesn't work.

You probably did it wrong. It´s working for me

 

[Villager]

The Jews can say, since they know the prophecies.

True Jews being Christians; yes, indeed.

God gave them to them, after all.

:yes:

 

[Heathen Hammer]

True Jews being Christians; yes, indeed.

Wow

Stepping away from the crater you'll soon be standing in :run:

 

[Flankerl]

I love your posts Villager. Really iam always looking forward to your answers. :hug:

 

[Rakhel]

True Jews being Christians; yes, indeed.

:yes:

"True Jews"? I declare a no truer Scotsman has been uttered

 

[Tarheeler]

I am confused.

Christianity claims that Christ was the Son of God and that this is the only true path to follow.

Judaism does not recognise Jesus as being the Son yet the Jews are the chosen people.

Both religions share the same God - therefore one religion must be wrong, right?

This is like some kind of religious paradox.

It's not difficult. Religion isn't like science, where one theory replaces another as more information is found. Religion is subjectiveand relies on faith.

Remember that Judaism holds that there is a sacred covenant between God and the Jews, and that, no matter happens, that covenant remains. But it also does not exclude the possibility of God making covenants with other peoples. So, while Christianity might profess that there is only way to God, Judaism does not.

 

[Villager]

"True Jews"? I declare a no truer Scotsman has been uttered

Most unwise, Rakhel. True Scotsmen really do put sugar on their porridge. Like those of other nations, one proves one's Scottish inheritance by recourse to legal documents. Jews have not had that resource since the Romans utterly trashed what G-d had set up, save a few stones. So something's up, somewhere.

Now Judah was a man of strong will, sometimes heroic, but of mixed motives, and not all that honest. Israel, aka Jacob, was not perfect, but he had his heart in the right place, particularly at the end. Like his grandad, old Abe, who believed God, and God loved him to bits for it.

And that's what true Jews, Israelites, Abrahamites do; and are loved to bits, too.

 

[Rakhel]

and, prey tell, what is a "true" Jew?

 

[Villager]

and, prey tell, what is a "true" Jew?

'When Jesus saw Nathanael approaching, he said of him, "Here is a true Israelite, in whom there is nothing false."' Jn 1:47 NIV


'I am an Israelite myself, a descendant of Abraham, from the tribe of Benjamin.' Ro 11:1 NIV

'It is we who are the circumcision, we who worship by the Spirit of God, who glory in Messiah Jesus.' Php 3:3


'James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus, Messiah, To the twelve tribes scattered among the nations: Shalom.' Jas 1:1

'The scripture was fulfilled that says, "Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness," and he was called God's friend.' Jas 2:23 NIV


'Peter stood up with the Eleven, raised his voice and addressed the crowd: "Fellow Jews and all of you who live in Jerusalem, let me explain this to you; listen carefully to what I say.... This is what was spoken by the prophet Joel: "'In the last days, God says, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy, your young men will see visions, your old men will dream dreams. Even on my servants, both men and women, I will pour out my Spirit in those days, and they will prophesy."' Ac 2:14-18 NIV

'In Scripture it says: "See, I lay a stone in Zion, a chosen and precious cornerstone, and the one who trusts in him will never be put to shame."' 1 Pe 2:6 NIV


'Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.' Jude 7 NIV


'Do not be like Cain, who belonged to the evil one and murdered his brother. And why did he murder him? Because his own actions were evil and his brother's were righteous.' 1 Jn 3:12 NIV

'Those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars.' Rv 3:9 NIV

 

[gnostic]

If, indeed, the New Testament record was uncontested at the time of its writing, it was only because most Jews had not read it or heard of it. There are no records of any Perushim, much less any priests, joining the church. The idea that they would do so is ridiculous. Christianity was a tiny fringe movement, and remained so until it gathered strength of numbers by recruiting non-Jews.

You have to also considered that the gospels were mostly written later than Paul's epistles. More likely after the destruction of Jerusalem, in 70 CE.

Also the gospels weren't written at the same time...and most likely not written by the authors. The original gospels contained no names, and the names were only attributed to those evangelists in the 2nd century CE.

The gospels were also written outside of Judaea. This would also make it difficult for non-Christian Jews to read it, let alone "contest" it. It's.not likely the gospels, or even the epistles for that matter, were widely circulated outside the Christian inner circles.

I think that's what most Christians tend to forget.

So I don't buy Villager's baseless statement that the writings were "uncontested" by the Jews like the Pharisees in the 1st century CE.

The New Testament record, that was uncontested at the time of writing, is that Pharisees and priests joined the church.

And you're right. Most Jews would not have access to the writings or even knew about them. Especially when you considered my earlier statements that Judaea was in a great deal of turmoils before the earliest gospel, which was Mark, was written.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

I am confused.

Christianity claims that Christ was the Son of God and that this is the only true path to follow.

Judaism does not recognise Jesus as being the Son yet the Jews are the chosen people.

Both religions share the same God - therefore one religion must be wrong, right?

This is like some kind of religious paradox.

Don't forget that Islam shares the same God with Judaism and Christianity. They believe that Jesus was a prophet, same as Mohammad.

The mistake you are making is in thinking that the religions are wrong, it is the people who are wrong. And where they are wrong is in saying they are right and everyone else is wrong. Each religion is right for its own people.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

No paradox - Yankee fans are not real people.

I'm a sports atheist, I think they are all silly. Except surfing of course, now that's a real religion, err, I mean sport.

 

[Shermana]

Some Christians are known to accept that Judism works too. Those of Jewish faith just have chosen the hard way to God. While Chirtians have taken the short cut the Jesus offered.

The "hard way" is the "right way", and the "Short cut" is a heretical interpretation that Jesus warned about, Jesus said you must strive hard to enter the Kingdom and be more righteous (law-obedient) than the Pharisees, who he was claiming had corrupted the Law with their own artificial doctrines.

Ya see God setup a covenant with the Hebrews. Show your faith by obaying My (God's) laws and you get salvation. Then Jesus came along and offered new terms, show your faith by repenting your sins and asking for forgivness, then because of your Faith in Me (Jesus), I'll (Jesus) grant you salvation.

Jesus still said you had to obey the Laws to be saved. What do you think "repenting from sin" means? (HInt: Definition of Sin is in 1 John 3:4 and it is lawlessness, and I notice that every "Christian" I talk too ignores 1 John). This is where the Lawless heresies that Jesus warned about come in which say you don't have to obey the Law, which is a huge reason why Jews want nothing to do with him (due to the heretical beliefs that came after him which represent him). Jesus specifically said that the Lawless would have no place in HEaven, and that you are judged by your works. This hasn't stuck with most so-called "Christians" however. 1 John clearly calls anyone who claims to know Christ but does not walk as he did nor obey the commandments a "liar". By John's own words, any non-Messianic Jew who claims to be a Christian is a liar. And then there's the issue of the Lukewarm.

Note: I'm not saying I believe this, just pointing out some theories out there.

Personally I sugggest that the works assiciated with the OT people were not the true path to salvation but rather those actions were evidence of the same Faith we Christians are called to.

So the times it says in the NT that if you don't follow the commandments you're a liar if you claim to know Christ, it's suddenly different?

Maybe, just maybe, the heresies of Paulinism and Post-Lutheranism which snip out 99% of the things Jesus actually said are the problem? Jesus' religion is nothing short of "Judaism", except without the Talmudic doctrines, with perhaps a few practices like the breaking of bread in remembrance of him. As for the things like divorce, he was re-instituting the priesthood which Melchezdiek had, so thus his followers had to be pure-in-marriage like the Levites.

Perhaps the whole part of the Melchezdiek priesthood is what's lost on these Lawless "Christians".

 

[Kilgore Trout]

No paradox - Yankee fans are not real people.

Ha! Trick response - neither are Red Sox fans.

 

[Poisonshady313]

When that happens how will he prove his lineage? Isn't the genealogy far to muddled now to ever fulfill prophesy?

He won't have to prove his lineage. The proof will be in the fulfillment of prophecy.

Remember the story of the sword in the stone? Only the true king could pull the sword from the stone. No need to see anyone's paperwork.

It's the same sort of thing with the messiah.

 

[Poisonshady313]

As for the things like divorce, he was re-instituting the priesthood which Melchezdiek had, so thus his followers had to be pure-in-marriage like the Levites.

That makes absolutely no sense. Why would he re-institute the priesthood which Melchizedek had? And why would he claim that it was Moses who permitted divorce rather than God?

 

[Shermana]

That makes absolutely no sense. Why would he re-institute the priesthood which Melchizedek had? And why would he claim that it was Moses who permitted divorce rather than God?

I have struggled with the Moses-granting-divorce question myself and have wondered if it is a later addition (Matthew is based on Gospel to the Hebrews), I will have to look into the reasons why the Malchezdiek Priesthood would be reinstated in a scriptural context. Also cryptic is why Malchezdiek was a priest to begin with. These are both issues that I am unprepared to defend at this time and have been troubled with for awhile, and I completely understand why it would make no sense, and fully admit that things like this are legitimate reasons why one would hold the very idea in suspect.

 

[Averroes]

and, prey tell, what is a "true" Jew?

That rhymed... you should be a rapper

 

[Averroes]

I'm a sports atheist, I think they are all silly. Except surfing of course, now that's a real religion, err, I mean sport.

yeah a guy balancing himself on a piece of wood in the ocean...yes it is lol