Twig pentagram
High Priest
The wisest of all people know that they don't know much.
-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
How do you "KNOW" your religion is true?
- Thread starter Rainbow Mage
- Start date
waitasec
Veteran Member
but how does he know he knows? it is unwise to be certain of anything, really.
Dan4reason
Facts not Faith
Do you mean true faith to be the kind of faith you have (e.g. a "true" car is not a ford) or do you mean true faith to mean faith in something that also happens to be true?
So the faith given by your invisible spirit man is the one that you can definitely tell is true? So how do you know your holy spirit exist? Faith? If it is, you are using a faith based-concept, to try to validate faith. Circular reasoning.
You might as well say that you are believing in mythology because of no truth-based reason at all just because you want to be sure of something without going through all the effort of analysing the evidence and research to find the real truth.
PolyHedral
Superabacus Mystic
Oh, didn't see this. How do you know it's the Holy Spirit doing the giving?
Yes.
For starters, I am the only one who has to be convinced of what I believe. And it's not a reasoning process, anymore than
liking chocolate, instead of vanilla ice cream is a reasoning process.
The reality of redemption through Jesus Christ the Savior, was not worked in me by imparting new information, but by enlightening my previously darkened mind to discern divinity through sensing its unique impact--the impact of the Jesus of the gospel.
"The Spirit shines in our hearts to give us the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ (2Co 4:6).
The result of this operation of the Holy Spirit is a state of mind in which both the Savior and the Scriptures evidence themselves to us as divine--Jesus a divine person and Scripture a divine product--in a way as direct. . .immediate. . .and arresting as that in which tastes and colors evidence themselves by forcing themselves on our senses. As a consequence, I no longer find it possible to doubt the divinity of either Christ or the Bible, any more than I find it possible to doubt the reality of color or taste.
That is how God authenticates the reality of Jesus and the truth of Scripture as his Word--not by some mystical experience, or secret information whispered into my inner ear, or by human argument (reason) alone. God does it rather by means of the searching light and transforming power whereby Jesus and the Scriptures evidence themselves to be divine. The impact of this light and power is itself the operation of the Holy Spirit. And the imparting of it, like the imparting of faith in Christ's divine Saviorhood, is the prerogative of the sovereign Holy Spirit alone.
This is universal Christian experience.
P.S. My "yes" above is to the former, rather than the latter.
Last edited:
So you know not, and know that you know not. . .you are simple and, therefore, need to be taught.
And that is knowing that you know not much. . .
So some things are certain. . .and it's probably safe to say that you don't know what all of them are. . .so that someone else could know something certain
that you don't know. . .
waitasec
Veteran Member
not in the ways of the unwise...
Ben Masada
Well-Known Member
How do I know my religion is true? Because it was organized by the following People whom Mark Twain wrote about in the following manner:
The Essay of Mark Twain About the Jews.
[SIZE=+1]"If the statistics are right, the Jews constitute but one percent of the human race. It suggests a nebulous dim puff of star dust lost in the blaze of the Milky Way. Properly the Jew ought hardly to be heard of, but he is heard of, has always been heard of. He is as prominent on the planet as any other people, and his commercial importance is extravagantly out of proportion to the smallness of his bulk. His contributions to the world's list of great names in literature, science, art, music, finance, medicine, and abstruse learning are also away out of proportion to the weakness of his numbers. He has made a marvellous fight in the world, in all the ages; and has done it with his hands tied behind him. He could be vain of himself, and be excused for it. The Egyptian, the Babylonian, and the Persian rose, filled the planet with sound and splendor, then faded to dream-stuff and passed away; the Greek and the Roman followed, and made a vast noise, and they are gone; other peoples have sprung up and held their torch high for a time, but it burned out, and they sit in twilight now, or have vanished. The Jew saw them all, beat them all, and is now what he always was, exhibiting no decadence, no infirmities of age, no weakening of his parts, no slowing of his energies, no dulling of his alert and aggressive mind. All things are mortal but the Jew; all other forces pass, but he remains. What is the secret of his immortality?[/SIZE]
Mark Twain
The Essay of Mark Twain About the Jews.
[SIZE=+1]"If the statistics are right, the Jews constitute but one percent of the human race. It suggests a nebulous dim puff of star dust lost in the blaze of the Milky Way. Properly the Jew ought hardly to be heard of, but he is heard of, has always been heard of. He is as prominent on the planet as any other people, and his commercial importance is extravagantly out of proportion to the smallness of his bulk. His contributions to the world's list of great names in literature, science, art, music, finance, medicine, and abstruse learning are also away out of proportion to the weakness of his numbers. He has made a marvellous fight in the world, in all the ages; and has done it with his hands tied behind him. He could be vain of himself, and be excused for it. The Egyptian, the Babylonian, and the Persian rose, filled the planet with sound and splendor, then faded to dream-stuff and passed away; the Greek and the Roman followed, and made a vast noise, and they are gone; other peoples have sprung up and held their torch high for a time, but it burned out, and they sit in twilight now, or have vanished. The Jew saw them all, beat them all, and is now what he always was, exhibiting no decadence, no infirmities of age, no weakening of his parts, no slowing of his energies, no dulling of his alert and aggressive mind. All things are mortal but the Jew; all other forces pass, but he remains. What is the secret of his immortality?[/SIZE]
Mark Twain
waitasec
Veteran Member
i would highlight "He is as prominent on the planet as any other people"
Twain defended Jews, African-Americans and Indians against prejudice. While a majority of his contemporaries negatively stereotyped the Jewish people, Twain defended Jewry in word and deed. Ironically, his major published protest against anti-Semitism alienated some of the American Jews he tried to defend.
Mark Twain and the Jews
BruceDLimber
Well-Known Member
What I already described: either trying to topple or overturn the administrative system of the Faith from within--this system having been explicitly established in our scxriptures--, or setting oneself up as the souce of doctrine which others are then expected to obey.
No, nor did I say or imply that. This has nothing to do with anyone's view of a deity.
They can, and frequently do. Indeed, we participate in this very endeavor frequently!
And while you're welcome to your opinions, meaning no offense your portrayal of religion strikes me as overly prejudiced and at best only a partial picture.
Peace,
Bruce
Last edited:
waitasec
Veteran Member
why would you say that?
PolyHedral
Superabacus Mystic
The only certainty is mathematics. Everything else falls under the simulation hypothesis, so it is far more wise to be doubting than certain.
BruceDLimber
Well-Known Member
Because you're stressing the negative while quietly ignoring positive events such as interfaith get-togethers that contradict the unattractive picture you're attempting to paint. In addition, there are scriptural statements in the Baha'i Faith, for example, that explicitly endorse the goodness and valididty of other faiths!
IOW, I find this a question of balance.
Peace,
Bruce
The existence of gravity isn't certain? . .or the explanation of gravity isn't certain?
PolyHedral
Superabacus Mystic
Both, in an absolute sense. It could all be faked.
waitasec
Veteran Member
Dan4reason
Facts not Faith
I can tell that your belief is not a reasoning process and that is exactly why I think faith gives surety but not truth. Faith is subjective, but truth is objective.
I am sorry to say but this argument is simply ludicrous. It doesn't prove anything at all and only proves how sure you are without a scrap of evidence. The fact that you feel "searching light" or "transforming power" emotionally just means that you feel differently, act differently, and think differently because of your beliefs. This says nothing at all about the truth of the talking snake, or the bearded man in the sky.
Scientologists also feel transformed because of their religion. They are still wrong.
I've had experiences with God.