How does one choose?

[Muffled]

To an extent. More we choose morality because of how and where we were raised, past experiences and sometimes through reason and debate.

I don't believe I had a previous life

I know it's not the bible because my morality differs from it.

Is this a really good criteria for morality? I know someone whose father sold drugs and saw it as a good thing and his son evidently believed him because he sold drugs also. That way a child is only as moral as the parents and more often than not kids imitate what they see being done rather that what they hear.

I discussed this previously. Experience might be a good teacher after the person has made a mistake and realizes that they have made a mistake. This doesn't seem as effective as knowing not to make the mistake in the first place. Also my experience eating clams is a good one, however there is a possibiity that I could eat a clam tainted with red tide and all my previous experince is worthless. Not only that but there may be a number of bad things that result of which I am not aware.

I have discussed these also. Reason has its limits. Something can be quite reasonable but also immoral.

 

[9Westy9]

Is this a really good criteria for morality? I know someone whose father sold drugs and saw it as a good thing and his son evidently believed him because he sold drugs also. That way a child is only as moral as the parents and more often than not kids imitate what they see being done rather that what they hear.

I discussed this previously. Experience might be a good teacher after the person has made a mistake and realizes that they have made a mistake. This doesn't seem as effective as knowing not to make the mistake in the first place. Also my experience eating clams is a good one, however there is a possibiity that I could eat a clam tainted with red tide and all my previous experince is worthless. Not only that but there may be a number of bad things that result of which I am not aware.

I have discussed these also. Reason has its limits. Something can be quite reasonable but also immoral.

Not a good or bad criteria. You can have very altruistic parents just like you can have parents who steal, for example.

Experience is the best teacher. You learn more from your mistakes.

If you can reason that something is good, surely that would make it moral? Especially when morality is subjective to the individual

 

[Muffled]

Not a good or bad criteria. You can have very altruistic parents just like you can have parents who steal, for example.

Experience is the best teacher. You learn more from your mistakes.

If you can reason that something is good, surely that would make it moral? Especially when morality is subjective to the individual

However a standard must be the same for everyone or else it isn't a standard. Would you want jerry Falwell (a parent) to be the standard bearer for everyone because he is a parent and thinks he is good? Who gets to judge parents to determine if they are altruistic? Is altruism the only measure of morality and how does one justify saying so?

Experience taught my daughter that she should have been a better mother but that is water over the dam since we raised her kids and she didn't get to participate very much. Knowledge of how troublesome it is to have a relationship with several wives comes from Solomon and David in the Bible and taught me to be faithful to my wife. (Along with God's law not to commit adultery)

I will say it again. Rape makes sense because I can satisfy my sexual desires and dominate a woman. It is quite reasonable but definitely immoral.

 

[waitasec]

I believe that God and only God has the right to end a life and do not consider it murder when He does so.

]However a standard must be the same for everyone or else it isn't a standard. Would you want jerry Falwell (a parent) to be the standard bearer for everyone

 

[sandandfoam]

Morality is a word corrupted by those who would beat others around the head with it. A blunt, mindless instrument of oppression.

 

[Muffled]

It doesn't take a genius to understand how murder and rape and even bestiality is morally wrong! Its called logic

What does Ahab and Jezebel have to do with laws and traditions?

No, what holiday is "selebrated on a convenient monday"?

When was stores completely closed on Sundays? And what exactly is immoral about them not being closed on Sundays?

I would like to see you attempt logic. What is your rationale?

Ahab was Jewish and therfore believed in Jewish law. He had compunctions about stealing a mans land and wouldn't have killed a man to do it but Jezebel was a worshipper of Baal and had no such laws or compuctions.

In the 50's. There is nothing immoral about stores being open on Sundays. The law was based on a Christian majority making Sunday a Sabbath day of rest. The Jewish law actually makes the day Saturday. The principle is that a person should rest from his labors on a regular basis for his own good. Technically today government is taking a larger role in demanding good healthy practices from its citizens and considers it immoral for a person to destroy himself with bad health practices.

 

[Muffled]

Morality is a word corrupted by those who would beat others around the head with it. A blunt, mindless instrument of oppression.

If there is no morality then it is ok to beat a person around the head and it is ok to oppress whomsoever I wish.

 

[9Westy9]

However a standard must be the same for everyone or else it isn't a standard. Would you want jerry Falwell (a parent) to be the standard bearer for everyone because he is a parent and thinks he is good? Who gets to judge parents to determine if they are altruistic? Is altruism the only measure of morality and how does one justify saying so?

Experience taught my daughter that she should have been a better mother but that is water over the dam since we raised her kids and she didn't get to participate very much. Knowledge of how troublesome it is to have a relationship with several wives comes from Solomon and David in the Bible and taught me to be faithful to my wife. (Along with God's law not to commit adultery)

I will say it again. Rape makes sense because I can satisfy my sexual desires and dominate a woman. It is quite reasonable but definitely immoral.

No it just means that the standard only applies to certain people. Altruism is self sacrificial, so altruistic parents would put the life of their child before their own.

So you agree that experience is a good teacher?

True, but I can reason you out of that frame of my mind by the sheer fact that you're infringing on others rights. It then comes down to if you feel superior to everyone or not as to whether you change your mind.

 

[waitasec]

If there is no morality then it is ok to beat a person around the head and it is ok to oppress whomsoever I wish.

fail..

 

[Gjallarhorn]

If there is no morality then it is ok to beat a person around the head and it is ok to oppress whomsoever I wish.

How can it be okay if there are no moral codes saying it's okay?

Morality =/= moral code either.

 

[Koldo]

I hear people say that they don't need God to be moral.

My question then is how is a person to choose?

Using the golden rule is a good start.

 

[Muffled]

Using the golden rule is a good start.

The golden rule came from God so the person is not actually being moral without God.

 

[9Westy9]

The golden rule came from God so the person is not actually being moral without God.

 

[Muffled]

How can it be okay if there are no moral codes saying it's okay?

Morality =/= moral code either.

A person does not need a moral code to do as he wishes. I don't need permission to go a month without bathing if I wish.

However scociety can develop its own code of behavior. Other people may not like my body odor and demand that I bathe. However I may decide that I am right and they are wrong and who is to say which is which?

 

[Tbone]

I hear people say that they don't need God to be moral.

Funny, that's the same thing Adam and Eve thought.
By the way how did that work out for them and all of mankind since?

 

[sandandfoam]

If there is no morality then it is ok to beat a person around the head and it is ok to oppress whomsoever I wish.

Did I say there is no morality?

 

[waitasec]

The golden rule came from God so the person is not actually being moral without God.

no it didn't.

 

[waitasec]

How can it be okay if there are no moral codes saying it's okay?

Morality =/= moral code either.

great point.
apparently muff didn't think this through...

 

[PolyHedral]

The golden rule came from God so the person is not actually being moral without God.

The golden rule comes from Game Theory, and the complicated version produces most of modern morality when applied properly.

 

[waitasec]

A person does not need a moral code to do as he wishes. I don't need permission to go a month without bathing if I wish.

However scociety can develop its own code of behavior. Other people may not like my body odor and demand that I bathe. However I may decide that I am right and they are wrong and who is to say which is which?

smelling bad =/= morality
anything else?