How in the world can ANYBODY think the Jews and Christians have the same god, that Jesus is messiah?

[Domenic]

Harmonious, you said:
"Wow, are you confused. Tanach is an acronym for Torah (the Pentateuch), Nevi'im (the Prophets), and Ketuvim (the Hagiographa). The Masora refers to which version of the text is the true one."



I think what may have you confused is the Hebrew alphabet you are using. The original Hebrew alphabet had vowels, and consonants, and not pointed as todays Hebrew. All the letters are in Psalms 119 of the Masoretec text. Why are they not the same in the present day Tanach which was written latter? It is very hard for me to explain what the scrolls say if you are trying to use text that does not match the original.

 

[Harmonious]

Harmonious, you said:
"Wow, are you confused. Tanach is an acronym for Torah (the Pentateuch), Nevi'im (the Prophets), and Ketuvim (the Hagiographa). The Masora refers to which version of the text is the true one."

I did, indeed.

I think what may have you confused is the Hebrew alphabet you are using. The original Hebrew alphabet had vowels, and consonants, and not pointed as todays Hebrew.

I know that it's not the same. Once upon a time, Jews used K'tav Ivri, and now we use K'tav Ashuri. However, they are two appearances of the same Alef-Bet. There were 22 letters, with different vowelation, then as now.

All the letters are in Psalms 119 of the Masoretec text. Why are they not the same in the present day Tanach which was written latter?

You must have missed the fact that each of the 22 letters have 8 verses that start with it.

There are 8 verses that begin with Alef, 8 verses that begin with Bet, 8 verses that begin with Gimmel, etc.

I'm not sure what you are referring to.

It is very hard for me to explain what the scrolls say if you are trying to use text that does not match the original.

I have nothing to say to that.

 

[Domenic]

You have nothing to say as to why they have been changed?

 

[Harmonious]

You have nothing to say as to why they have been changed?

I don't use the DDS as a reference, so I'm not arguing what was changed and what wasn't.

So... I'll take the texts as they are, and as they have been. You take what was recorded by a sect that may or may not have been mainstream at the time.

If it means something to you, great.

 

[Domenic]

I don't use the DDS as a reference, so I'm not arguing what was changed and what wasn't.

So... I'll take the texts as they are, and as they have been. You take what was recorded by a sect that may or may not have been mainstream at the time.

If it means something to you, great.

Anything you have today should match the original scrolls. if what you are using do not...then they have been changed.
If you suggest the scrolls were written buy a sect, and are not Gods word...where did the text you use come from?

 

[Harmonious]

Anything you have today should match the original scrolls. if what you are using do not...then they have been changed.
If you suggest the scrolls were written buy a sect, and are not Gods word...where did the text you use come from?

Traditionally handed down, as it was to as it is.

 

[Domenic]

Traditionally handed down, as it was to as it is.

Things handed down seem to give comfort. I understand if people learn things in scripture have been changed, everything they believe comes into question...and that is not a good feeling. it's like starting all over again. One can also lose friends, and family members. It is not easy. But we each have to follow our own heart about God..

 

[Harmonious]

Things handed down seem to give comfort. I understand if people learn things in scripture have been changed, everything they believe comes into question...and that is not a good feeling. it's like starting all over again. One can also lose friends, and family members. It is not easy. But we each have to follow our own heart about God..

You are assuming that scripture has changed. I'm not.

 

[rosends]

Anything you have today should match the original scrolls. if what you are using do not...then they have been changed.
If you suggest the scrolls were written buy a sect, and are not Gods word...where did the text you use come from?

But this gets back to the problem that you don't have any of the "original scrolls" to support your claim that the text was ever different. You say it is "your belief" and that's just skippy, but it is also meaningless. I could say that it is my belief that humanity used to have 12 arms and that there were photos made but they were all destroyed during the great arms purge of 1899.

 

[Domenic]

You are assuming that scripture has changed. I'm not.

I have the proof.. How deep do you want to go?

 

[Harmonious]

I have the proof.. How deep do you want to go?

You don't have proof. You have what you THINK is proof.

 

[Eliab ben Benjamin]

I have the proof.. How deep do you want to go?

I believe you have been asked to show this Proof you claim, your response seems to be you have employment and a family to support and therefore no time to show us that proof ....
That therefore implies that it remains your opinion until you are able to acquire it ....

And the odd sect previously mentioned do still exist, though like my Tribe are few in number ...
that is the Essenes in modern parlance who studied Torah, and the nature of Hashem and wrote
those scrolls found in the caves .. currently referred to as the Dead Sea Scrolls ...
some of that strange and somewhat separate sect who isolated themselves for their study,
still follow in their ancestors path and study such mystery ... I am one such ...
We have no authority, just opinion ... Both Pharisees and Sanhedrin often disagreed with our
perspective or opinion ... so i would suggest those scrolls should be read in that light.

I still believe Simon bar Kokhba , had more to recommend him as Messiach than Yeshua !!
sadly he failed ....

 

[Domenic]

You don't have proof. You have what you THINK is proof.

Again I ask. "How deep do you want to go?" Please, do not take any proof I post as an attack on you, or any Jew, be they real, or fake.

 

[Domenic]

I believe you have been asked to show this Proof you claim, your response seems to be you have employment and a family to support and therefore no time to show us that proof ....
That therefore implies that it remains your opinion until you are able to acquire it ....

And the odd sect previously mentioned do still exist, though like my Tribe are few in number ...
that is the Essenes in modern parlance who studied Torah, and the nature of Hashem and wrote
those scrolls found in the caves .. currently referred to as the Dead Sea Scrolls ...
some of that strange and somewhat separate sect who isolated themselves for their study,
still follow in their ancestors path and study such mystery ... I am one such ...
We have no authority, just opinion ... Both Pharisees and Sanhedrin often disagreed with our
perspective or opinion ... so i would suggest those scrolls should be read in that light.

I still believe Simon bar Kokhba , had more to recommend him as Messiach than Yeshua !!
sadly he failed ....

I see you may understand there are two tribes of Jews, One real, the other fake. God has his own way of bringing truth into the sunlight. The Fake Jews have the dead Sea Scrolls, and fear letting the world read them...but there are other scrolls, and these also are real...and just as old.

 

[Eliab ben Benjamin]

Gosh that seems to be three of us now you consider to be fake ..
and just to support your assertions ... astounding

 

[Domenic]

Gosh that seems to be three of us now you consider to be fake ..and just to support your assertions ... astounding

I have not said any member of this forum is a real, or fake Jew. I am talking about two tribes who claim to be Jews. One real, the other fake.

 

[Eliab ben Benjamin]

I have not said any member of this forum is a real, or fake Jew. I am talking about two tribes who claim to be Jews. One real, the other fake.

Ok, Perhaps you can explain this fake tribe stuff, who are they ?
or perhaps it could be we are not all Judah ?

 

[Domenic]

I will explain. It is 11:30 PM here. I will post again tomorrow.

 

[Flankerl]

I am still not sure what to think about the so called fact that we wrote some words of the TaNaKh in Greek and not Hebrew or Aramaic over 2500 years ago.

 

[Domenic]

Part one True Jews, False Jews.
I am putting this up in parts as I write it from my old notes.
This is not an attack on any member of this forum, or their religion. it is posted only as facts of history.

I want to first start with symbols.
The symbol of ancient Israel was the Menorah, the seven branched candlestick. The hexagram was never the symbol of the true Jews.

The symbol for the Old Covenant and the New Covenant Israel is the Menorah or seven branched candlestick. The Khazaria, which many call the Star of David, was originally the hexagram, an Egyptian good luck charm. It was believed to give protection from evil, and also used to put curses on enemies. This hexagram dates back to the Pharaohs.
King David never had a star.(hexagram.) David’s son Solomon had this star which he got from Bath-Sheba. God commanded Moses to make a seven branched golden candlestick and put it in the Holy of Holies.

With the defeat of the Crusaders in 1187 by Saladin made him a hero to the Muslims. He was a hero to the Khazars, thus they adopted the six pointed star as their national Symbol
The Star with six points is an ancient Sun Worship Symbol. It is an adaptation of the pagan rosette or wheel symbol. The Samaritans brought that symbol from their homes in Babylon and it is found in many of the Samaritan synagogues. These can be viewed in, “Jewish Symbols in the Greco-Roman Period, volume 7.”


End of part one.