I have another question for YOU to ignore

[savagewind]

I think that there is a greater judgment because of the influence and the capacity to lead someone in the wrong direction.

And, what if what you say was what was actually written?

It says to be careful you are not misled.

Can anyone consider that what was actually said and written down was that we are not to mislead?

Instead of, "Take heed that no one may lead you astray," it was said, "take heed lest anyone you mislead."

He is saying that it is possible, even for a disciple, to actually lead someone AWAY from him.
Matthew 24:4

 

[savagewind]

Also, can't anyone imagine that it is in the power of evil to make disciples for Jesus?

Anyone can cause a person to be a disciple the way YOU (anyone trusting in what we have) say it was written.

YOU say, "having gone, therefore, make disciples of nations".

First of all, to believe NATIONS should and will become disciples of Jesus is down right crazy!
A disciple is a person and NOT a nation.

Then, to add "people of" there is ADDING meaning to The Word and is actually evil.
It is evil to change what is believed to be God's words.

I know, I know......people think it is what I am doing. It is funny, so, thank you, but no thank you.

 

[djhwoodwerks]

Can anyone consider that what was actually said and written down was that we are not to mislead?

Instead of, "Take heed that no one may lead you astray," it was said, "take heed lest anyone you mislead."

He is saying that it is possible, even for a disciple, to actually lead someone AWAY from him.
Matthew 24:4

I believe you try so hard to find fault with the Bible that you come up with nonsense like that!

What you think it should say makes no sense, in no way. You just seem to want the Bible to be wrong.

 

[savagewind]

I believe you try so hard to find fault with the Bible that you come up with nonsense like that!

What you think it should say makes no sense, in no way. You just seem to want the Bible to be wrong.

How does it make no sense that Jesus would warn his disciples not to mislead anyone?

Matthew 18:6 And whoever shall cause to stumble one of these of the little ones believing in Me, it is better for him that a heavy millstone should be hung around his neck, and he be sunk in the depth of the sea.

1 Corinthians 8:12 By sinning against your brothers in this way and wounding their weak conscience, you sin against Christ.

Luke 17:1 Jesus said to his disciples: "Things that cause people to stumble are bound to come, but woe to anyone through whom they come".

Matthew 18:7 Jesus said to his disciples: "Things that cause people to stumble are bound to come, but woe to anyone through whom they come"

1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit expressly states that in later times some will abandon the faith to follow deceitful spirits and the teachings of demons

Jeremiah 23:26 How long? Is there anything in the hearts of the prophets who prophesy falsehood, even these prophets of the deception of their own heart

 

[savagewind]

I believe you try so hard to find fault with the Bible that you come up with nonsense like that!

What you think it should say makes no sense, in no way. You just seem to want the Bible to be wrong.

Are you saying that you believe it is not possible for someone to be led away from The Christ?

 

[savagewind]

It is believed that by doing good, a disciple is able to make more disciples.

So? By doing bad, is the opposite possible? Of course, it is! Matthew 24:4

 

[savagewind]

Haha Then they would have to take a hard look at their selves and wouldn't that be interesting?

 

[Kenny]

And, what if what you say was what was actually written?

It says to be careful you are not misled.

Can anyone consider that what was actually said and written down was that we are not to mislead?

Instead of, "Take heed that no one may lead you astray," it was said, "take heed lest anyone you mislead."

He is saying that it is possible, even for a disciple, to actually lead someone AWAY from him.
Matthew 24:4

I think this is close to a danger zone of operating out of fear. As it is written, "perfect love casts out fear", and again, "Through fear of death, Satan held men captive" (paraphrased).

Those who are born-again have the Holy Spirit that is there to lead us into all truth and He is definitely able to teach us what is from God and what isn't... (if we listen)

 

[savagewind]

I think this is close to a danger zone of operating out of fear. As it is written, "perfect love casts out fear", and again, "Through fear of death, Satan held men captive" (paraphrased).

Those who are born-again have the Holy Spirit that is there to lead us into all truth and He is definitely able to teach us what is from God and what isn't... (if we listen)

This? What is this? To say that what is written isn't what God said?

 

[savagewind]

Those who are born-again have the Holy Spirit that is there to lead us into all truth and He is definitely able to teach us what is from God and what isn't... (if we listen)

I believe this. THEY seem unable to hear anything than what they believe was written.

 

[Kenny]

Also, can't anyone imagine that it is in the power of evil to make disciples for Jesus?

Anyone can cause a person to be a disciple the way YOU (anyone trusting in what we have) say it was written.

YOU say, "having gone, therefore, make disciples of nations".

First of all, to believe NATIONS should and will become disciples of Jesus is down right crazy!
A disciple is a person and NOT a nation.

Then, to add "people of" there is ADDING meaning to The Word and is actually evil.
It is evil to change what is believed to be God's words.

I know, I know......people think it is what I am doing. It is funny, so, thank you, but no thank you.

I think you gave NATIONS to big of a connotation. The United States is comprised of people from all nations but it doesn't translate into all NATIONS being in the US and no one outside of the US

Nations = Ethnos which is where we get the word ethnicity. Indeed all ethnicities have become disciples.

So I wouldn't add to what was said

And again, we shouldn't be operating under the banner of fear... "Also, can't anyone imagine that it is in the power of evil to make disciples for Jesus?" For me, that is too much of a fear based. I'd rather imagine "WOW, it is in the power of people to do good!"

 

[savagewind]

I don't believe that a disiplce of Jesus Christ can be led away from him like it is written Matthew 24:4.

Jesus is leading us. For me to be led away from him I must first choose not to be led by him. So then, leaving him is the sin imo.

 

[Kenny]

How does it make no sense that Jesus would warn his disciples not to mislead anyone?

Matthew 18:6 And whoever shall cause to stumble one of these of the little ones believing in Me, it is better for him that a heavy millstone should be hung around his neck, and he be sunk in the depth of the sea.

1 Corinthians 8:12 By sinning against your brothers in this way and wounding their weak conscience, you sin against Christ.

Luke 17:1 Jesus said to his disciples: "Things that cause people to stumble are bound to come, but woe to anyone through whom they come".

Matthew 18:7 Jesus said to his disciples: "Things that cause people to stumble are bound to come, but woe to anyone through whom they come"

1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit expressly states that in later times some will abandon the faith to follow deceitful spirits and the teachings of demons

Jeremiah 23:26 How long? Is there anything in the hearts of the prophets who prophesy falsehood, even these prophets of the deception of their own heart

But notice they are warnings... but there is no statement to live in fear. As a matter of fact, every time Jesus met with fear his response was "PEACE"! After all, He is the Prince of Peace.

 

[savagewind]

I think you gave NATIONS to big of a connotation. The United States is comprised of people from all nations but it doesn't translate into all NATIONS being in the US and no one outside of the US

Nations = Ethnos which is where we get the word ethnicity. Indeed all ethnicities have become disciples.

So I wouldn't add to what was said

And again, we shouldn't be operating under the banner of fear... "Also, can't anyone imagine that it is in the power of evil to make disciples for Jesus?" For me, that is too much of a fear based. I'd rather imagine "WOW, it is in the power of people to do good!"

I have added to it?

Young's Literal Translation
having gone, then, disciple all the nations, (baptizing them -- to the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit,

 

[savagewind]

But notice they are warnings... but there is no statement to live in fear. As a matter of fact, every time Jesus met with fear his response was "PEACE"! After all, He is the Prince of Peace.

There is more fear in the belief that a person can be led astray than there is in the fear that a person might lead someone else astray. Isn't it?

 

[Kenny]

I believe this. THEY seem unable to hear anything than what they believe was written.

Savage wind... to be honest... I'm just not getting what your point is in all of this.

We shouldn't add to the word... check
We can be misled in the last days... OK
We shouldn't mislead children... copy that

OK... we got the point... but why are we making so much emphasis on this? And how many posts must be logged if it is already stated? And for what reason?

 

[savagewind]

Savage wind... to be honest... I'm just not getting what your point is in all of this.

We shouldn't add to the word... check
We can be misled in the last days... OK
We shouldn't mislead children... copy that

OK... we got the point... but why are we making so much emphasis on this? And how many posts must be logged if it is already stated? And for what reason?

I am not saying we can be misled. I think we can't. How can Jesus mislead anyone? He can't. It is not possible. The Bible says that we can be misled. It is wrong. Not important? Why not?

 

[Kenny]

I have added to it?

Young's Literal Translation
having gone, then, disciple all the nations, (baptizing them -- to the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit,

Definition - Ethnos - New Testament Greek Lexicon - King James Version

1. a multitude (whether of men or of beasts) associated or living together
   1. a company, troop, swarm
2. a multitude of individuals of the same nature or genus
   1. the human family
3. a tribe, nation, people group
4. in the OT, foreign nations not worshipping the true God, pagans, Gentiles
5. Paul uses the term for Gentile Christians

It doesn't have to mean WHOLE NATIONS... just a multitude of individuals of the same nature or nation but not necessarily the whole of the nation

 

[Kenny]

I am not saying we can be misled. I think we can't. How can Jesus mislead anyone? He can't. It is not possible. The Bible says that we can be misled. It is wrong. Not important? Why not?

Yes, misled but not by Jesus (as it is written)

So, what is the point you are trying to establish?

 

[savagewind]

Why is it not important that The Bible is copied wrong?

How could it have happened? I have some theories. One is that the church at the time our Bible was produced wanted the people's trust. If anyone read that the ones with Jesus might mislead him, he would trust them. They wanted, no, needed, them to trust them. OMG. They had to make them believe per order of Jesus Christ. < sarcasm It is written.