It may be my concepts of Love are better informed than a nineteenth century preacher too Tony, the possibility goes both ways in my view.
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If a person claiming to be Christ comes today, how do you know it is really *not* him?
- Thread starter danieldemol
- Start date
If only people could grasp the consequences of such a statement Daniel, actually, we have the current world conflicts and disunity as an example.
Regards Tony
Lol, so now I'm responsible for the Ukraine and middle East conflicts the later of which is heavily influenced by religious division in actuality.
Shows how unhinged certain Baha'i are that they pin responsibility for all world conflict on those who reject their non-authentic so-called message of love in my view
2 Peter 3 has some thoughts to consider. It is foretold that many will scoff at such advice, happy to continue with the status quo
Verse 9 is all about long suffering paitence "The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance."
It all about our choices and I see they do have wider ramifications on a global scale, maybe even wider.
Regards Tony
It all lays fairly on the shoulders of all that can, but do not choose to implement the given guidance for peace, Baha'i included. As it is our responsibility.
Many, who due to circumstances beyond their control, are unable to practice the required principles, will not be held responsible.
Regards Tony
Religious bigotry toward non-believers has wide-reaching ramifications Tony, imagine a hypothetical Baha'i world where ignorant Baha'i mobs - indoctrinated to believe non believers where the source of global conflicts - roamed. Mistreatment of non-Bahi is likely to follow in my view.
Ultimately whether your slander for rejectors of your faith comes from yourself or your scripture a lie is still a lie whether it be said by men or god/(s) in my view
You like making up stories on comments made, that in no way shape or form indicate a future inclusive of your vision.
All the best, Regards Tony
Ha ha, you are making up stories about rejectors of the Baha'i faith being the source of all the world's conflicts Tony.
Imagine this scenario Tony;
Imagine hypothetically I said to you, "Tony, you are the source of all the world's pedophilia, kind regards" would you see that "kind regards" tacked on at the end as anything more than a vain outward pretense of sincerity?
It is you that equated what I offered to your train of thinking, without clarification.
It is an accumulate effect, like a cancer growing in the body, one cell at a time.
We are all of the same human spirit, our mind is connected, just as all the Messengers are of the One same Holy Spirit.
So each time our mind turns away from God, I see we help feed the growth of the cancer, every violent piece of entertainment people pursue, every immoral act, every act of hate and predudice all feed the growth of the cancer.
Abdul'baha gave a simple but very profound piece of advice. (Note that we must acheive thus by changing our own mind)
".....There is nothing so heartbreaking and terrible as an outburst of human savagery!
I charge you all that each one of you concentrate all the thoughts of your heart on love and unity. When a thought of war comes, oppose it by a stronger thought of peace. A thought of hatred must be destroyed by a more powerful thought of love. Thoughts of war bring destruction to all harmony, well-being, restfulness and content.
Thoughts of love are constructive of brotherhood, peace, friendship, and happiness.
When soldiers of the world draw their swords to kill, soldiers of God clasp each other’s hands! So may all the savagery of man disappear by the Mercy of God, working through the pure in heart and the sincere of soul. Do not think the peace of the world an ideal impossible to attain!
Nothing is impossible to the Divine Benevolence of God.
If you desire with all your heart, friendship with every race on earth, your thought, spiritual and positive, will spread; it will become the desire of others, growing stronger and stronger, until it reaches the minds of all men.
Do not despair! Work steadily. Sincerity and love will conquer hate. How many seemingly impossible events are coming to pass in these days! Set your faces steadily towards the Light of the World. Show love to all; “Love is the breath of the Holy Spirit in the heart of Man.” Take courage! God never forsakes His children who strive and work and pray! Let your hearts be filled with the strenuous desire that tranquillity and harmony may encircle all this warring world. So will success crown your efforts, and with the universal brotherhood will come the Kingdom of God in peace and goodwill..."
Paris Talks | Bahá’í Reference Library
A compilation of talks given by ‘Abdu’l‑Bahá during His first stay in Paris, from October to December 1911. Also included are three talks delivered during visits to England in 1912–13 and a Tablet revealed in 1913.
So instead of looking to tear comments apart, one could explore the reason why they are made.
Regards Tony
I would suggest you are speaking out of both sides of your mouth Tony.It is you that equated what I offered to your train of thinking, without clarification.
It is an accumulate effect, like a cancer growing in the body, one cell at a time.
We are all of the same human spirit, our mind is connected, just as all the Messengers are of the One same Holy Spirit.
So each time our mind turns away from God, I see we help feed the growth of the cancer, every violent piece of entertainment people pursue, every immoral act, every act of hate and predudice all feed the growth of the cancer.
Abdul'baha gave a simple but very profound piece of advice. (Note that we must acheive thus by changing our own mind)
".....There is nothing so heartbreaking and terrible as an outburst of human savagery!
I charge you all that each one of you concentrate all the thoughts of your heart on love and unity. When a thought of war comes, oppose it by a stronger thought of peace. A thought of hatred must be destroyed by a more powerful thought of love. Thoughts of war bring destruction to all harmony, well-being, restfulness and content.
Thoughts of love are constructive of brotherhood, peace, friendship, and happiness.
When soldiers of the world draw their swords to kill, soldiers of God clasp each other’s hands! So may all the savagery of man disappear by the Mercy of God, working through the pure in heart and the sincere of soul. Do not think the peace of the world an ideal impossible to attain!
Nothing is impossible to the Divine Benevolence of God.
If you desire with all your heart, friendship with every race on earth, your thought, spiritual and positive, will spread; it will become the desire of others, growing stronger and stronger, until it reaches the minds of all men.
Do not despair! Work steadily. Sincerity and love will conquer hate. How many seemingly impossible events are coming to pass in these days! Set your faces steadily towards the Light of the World. Show love to all; “Love is the breath of the Holy Spirit in the heart of Man.” Take courage! God never forsakes His children who strive and work and pray! Let your hearts be filled with the strenuous desire that tranquillity and harmony may encircle all this warring world. So will success crown your efforts, and with the universal brotherhood will come the Kingdom of God in peace and goodwill..."
Paris Talks | Bahá’í Reference Library
A compilation of talks given by ‘Abdu’l‑Bahá during His first stay in Paris, from October to December 1911. Also included are three talks delivered during visits to England in 1912–13 and a Tablet revealed in 1913.www.bahai.org
So instead of looking to tear comments apart, one could explore the reason why they are made.
Regards Tony
In my view describing your debate opponent as a contributor to cancer and every sort of immorality and war is a gratuitous ad-hominem and not at all a loving or peaceful thought.
As for why you said it - I'm afraid in my view that's very clear - you don't know how my actions in showing kindness to gay folk by not fining them into poverty, alleged covenant breakers and non-believers in Baha'u'llah by not smearing them is less loving than the actions of some nineteenth century preacher. So instead of addressing the debate point you have little choice but to assume I'm a contributor to all the immorality and wars of the world so you can distract from your inability to answer the point.
Oh well. Ad-hominem will be recieved as a subconscious admission of your defeat.
Sorry, I was unaware there was perfect humans walking this earth, with the reply offered, it would be inferring that the comments I made, have no realisation in your own self.
I am not looking for faults in any person, but I am wise enough to know they exist in all of us to varing degrees of neglect. They one and all feed the cancer currently eating away at the body of humanity.
I am not exempt from my own statement.
Regards Tony
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
Love is a great deceiver. Love what? One's own self? One's position in the society? Luxuries that one gets in the name of love?
There is no evidence even of existence of any God, what to talk of messengers!
Ah well, that much I can agree too. No one is perfect, not me, not you, not some 19th century preacher in my view.
By this: If therefore they tell you, 'Behold, he is in the wilderness,' don't go out; 'Behold, he is in the inner chambers,' don't believe it. For as the lightning comes forth from the east, and is seen even to the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man.
Matt. 24:26-27
stvdv
Veteran Member
And until they are on that level, they won't know for sure, hence the terms Faith and Belief
All those who believe don't know
All those who know, don't believe
stvdv
Veteran Member
I interpret Shoghi Effendi's words implying:
"Truth is God" (the Wise have taught this for ages)
Hence, he who doesn't believe in Truth (God)
is neither trustworthy nor truthful
Which is a valid claim
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Jedster
Well-Known Member
Oh, I just noticed that this is a debate forum, which I promised myself not to participate in.
I'll leave this thread with just one rhetorical question, for anyone to answer, and that is
do you think/believe that Jesus Christs disciples(and other that followed him) were on the same level as him?
I believe there are plenty of people who believe in truth but not in god