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If God Wanted Us to Believe...

Evangelicalhumanist

"Truth" isn't a thing...
Premium Member
Not sure, maybe he left evidence because he wanted to 'test' our faith. Our interpretation of the evidence is what counts.

Isn't god all about faith, he 'tests' us all the time, and believing he created the universe is another test?

Or maybe he didn't know humans would find this evidence, because when he put his son on Earth we didn't even have DNA kits or test tubes. :)
Yeah! Just like parents. They don't "teach" their children, do they? No, they rather set up puzzles for them to solve, and if they get them wrong, they punish them. Sheesh!
 

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
If God Wanted Us to Believe...

Yes, G-d does want every of humans being to believe in Him, G-d welcomes it, right, please?
He has afforded innumerable reasonable argument , signs, and taught us prayers to this effect in the truthful Word Revealed/Exhortation for the benefit of the humanity, please, right?
It starts right from the very first Chapter short but concise, which is the summary of the whole, right?:

1:2 All praise belongs to Allah, Lord of all the worlds,
1:3 The Gracious, the Merciful,
1:5 Thee alone do we worship and Thee alone do we implore for help.
1:6 Guide us in the right pathHoly Quran: Read, Listen and Search
Right?

Regards
________________
Original Arabic narration/text since Muhammad's time is below:-
اَلۡحَمۡدُ لِلّٰہِ رَبِّ الۡعٰلَمِیۡنَ ۙ﴿۲
الرَّحۡمٰنِ الرَّحِیۡمِ ۙ﴿۳
اِیَّاکَ نَعۡبُدُ وَاِیَّاکَ نَسۡتَعِیۡنُ ؕ﴿۵
اِہۡدِنَا الصِّرَاطَ الۡمُسۡتَقِیۡمَ ۙ﴿۶
 

Jimmy

I have always existed
Imo God couldn’t reveal the real savior to the world because someone would want to hurt him. The real saviors death means the end of all of existence so we can’t have someone hurting him. So withholding that truth from us opened up all kinds of tall tales. Evolution being one of them. It’s beautiful though and fits perfectly with the laws of nature and would be a perfect truth if God actually allowed that time in history to actually exist.
 

Balthazzar

N. Germanic Descent
Imo God couldn’t reveal the real savior to the world because someone would want to hurt him. The real saviors death means the end of all of existence so we can’t have someone hurting him. So withholding that truth from us opened up all kinds of tall tales. Evolution being one of them. It’s beautiful though and fits perfectly with the laws of nature and would be a perfect truth if God actually allowed that time in history to actually exist.
It's possible, at least I viewed it this way at the onset, when Jesus born. I think they did aim to kill him, along with many others. I don't think there's only one "savior". There's a name given to us that we honor for that saving principle. When I hear the term Jesus, my auto kicks in and it conveys savior, truth, life, death, rebirth, peace, healer, physician, service, friend, among other attributes - But I don't think the man Jesus is the only savior. It would be dangerous if there were only one and he were to come back with aim to claim the throne on earth over every government and entity upon it. He would, I presume, be safer as an unknown identity in this case, but like I stated, I don't think there is only one savior. I think if we're to be saved at all, that it'll be by grace as blind as we are sometimes, and ignorant. We're pretty stupid sometimes too and daft and careless, but I think we're learning the ropes, albeit a very slow and tedious thing to endure. Hopefully we'll make it through.
 

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
If God Wanted Us to Believe...

when Jesus born. I think they* did aim to kill him
Yes, the Judaic people aka Jews , but they failed.

4:158
And their saying, ‘We did kill the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah;’ whereas they slew him not, nor crucified him, but he was made to appear to them like one crucified; and those who differ therein are certainly in a state of doubt about it; they have no definite knowledge thereof, but only follow a conjecture; and they did not convert this conjecture into a certainty; Holy Quran: Read, Listen and Search
Right?

Regards
________________
The original Arabic narration/text from Muhammad's time is below:-
4:158
وَّقَوۡلِہِمۡ اِنَّا قَتَلۡنَا الۡمَسِیۡحَ عِیۡسَی ابۡنَ مَرۡیَمَ رَسُوۡلَ اللّٰہِ ۚ وَمَا قَتَلُوۡہُ وَمَا صَلَبُوۡہُ وَلٰکِنۡ شُبِّہَ لَہُمۡ ؕ وَاِنَّ الَّذِیۡنَ اخۡتَلَفُوۡا فِیۡہِ لَفِیۡ شَکٍّ مِّنۡہُ ؕ مَا لَہُمۡ بِہٖ مِنۡ عِلۡمٍ اِلَّا اتِّبَاعَ الظَّنِّ ۚ وَمَا قَتَلُوۡہُ یَقِیۡنًۢا ﴿۱۵۸
 

bobhikes

Nondetermined
Premium Member
Why did God leave evidence of evolution?
From a few moments after the "Big Bang" we have an explanation of how the universe formed into its current state without the need of any intelligence behind it.
We have evidence of several types of humanoids that lived prior to and even along side of homo sapiens.

If God created everything then we ought not be able to come up with an alternate explanation. There should be no evidence of evolution. There should exist only one possible explanation of our existence. That God created us.

Why create us and then leave this evidence laying around that the universe after the Big Bang could have formed on its own?

Why leave evidence of the evolution of life?
If you want people to choose to believe in you, they need to have an alternative. If you want to eliminate choice, then you eliminate the alternatives. In my reading of the scriptures God favors choice.
 

wellwisher

Well-Known Member
Why did God leave evidence of evolution?
From a few moments after the "Big Bang" we have an explanation of how the universe formed into its current state without the need of any intelligence behind it.
We have evidence of several types of humanoids that lived prior to and even along side of homo sapiens.

If God created everything then we ought not be able to come up with an alternate explanation. There should be no evidence of evolution. There should exist only one possible explanation of our existence. That God created us.

Why create us and then leave this evidence laying around that the universe after the Big Bang could have formed on its own?

Why leave evidence of the evolution of life?
The way I resolve this paradox is by assuming the days in Genesis, are not earth days, but God days. God days were more time dilated, to account for the different time spans between Genesis and Cosmology/Evolution. The earth reference sees everything happens slower, while in the God reference it happens, faster.

To help orientate your mind, if God was moving at the speed of light, according to Special Relativity, he would see the universe look like a point, due to distance contraction. The entire life of the universe would appear to come and go in an instant of time; time dilation. If God was to slow his reference from the speed of light, the universe would appear to expand and more time would seem to be added to life of the universe. If he keeps slowing, eventually the universe would appear like we see it from the earth in terms of size and time; symbolized by God becomes man.

The effect is also similar to watching someone fall into a theoretical black hole, from the vantage point of the earth. It will appear like they never reach the center due to the extreme time dilation and distance contraction. But to them, their fall happens in a snap. From earth we have the slow view of evolution, but from God's POV, he as the fast view of creation.

We need the science concept of relativity to make a bridge between the two. However, relativity also has an interesting impact on cosmology. If the BB universe started from a singularity; primordial atom, and all the mass/energy of the universe, is in this point, this would curve space-time so much it would created a huge time dilation.

According to inflation theory, during the inflationary epoch about 10−32 of a second after the Big Bang, the universe suddenly expanded, and its volume increased by a factor of at least 1078 (an expansion of distance by a factor of at least 1026 in each of the three dimensions).

These numbers are based on the slow boat earth reference. The Primordial Atom reference, would be highly time dilated, so the physics would need to do this even faster in that reference, so the slow boat earth reference can see 10-32 second at the earth reference. The known laws of physics do not work that fast. God physics would be needed of it to happen. He would need to break space-time into separated space and separated time and then way more physics options appear.
 

Nakosis

Non-Binary Physicalist
Premium Member
If you want people to choose to believe in you, they need to have an alternative. If you want to eliminate choice, then you eliminate the alternatives. In my reading of the scriptures God favors choice.
Well, then can't blame me for choosing the alternate since there seems to be more support for the scientific position.
 
After God created the world, God needed man to till the ground for him to keep it reproducing. So God created man from the dust of the earth and breathed into his nostrol the breath of life. Then man became a living being. When we die we go back to dust from where we came. Genesis chapter 1
 
Without God life does not exist. Without God man has no chance of a new life when the old one is destroyed. Only them that seek God in true Faith and obey God will be rewarded for their love to God. Only a very few will be saved. Only a very few truly believe in God.
 
Why don't you just read the Bible that tells you exactly how God created man and then you will know the whole truth while everyone else is other there searching for answers. Genesis 2:7 And God proceeded to form man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul. All the answers of God and life are in the Bible only them that want to know the truth of God will have patience and faith to learn about God.
 
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