If you take away religion, what arguments are there against homosexuality?

[Autodidact]

In my opinion what makes a parent, is love. I'd rather see a child raised by two men/ women knowing they were loved and cared for, than by two biological parents who haven't a clue in how to look after a child.

I am temporarily prevented from fruballing our caring new friend, Nerthus, so here's some flowers: :foryou:

 

[Midnight Pete]

If you take away religion, what arguments are there against homosexuality?

Sodomy does not appeal to heterosexuals. (The most obvious yet most overlooked.)

 

[jarofthoughts]

Sodomy does not appeal to heterosexuals. (The most obvious yet most overlooked.)

You need to get out more.

There is no lack of heterosexuals who practice sodomy, or, as some would call it, anal sex.

 

[Nerthus]

I am temporarily prevented from fruballing our caring new friend, Nerthus, so here's some flowers: :foryou:

Thank you!

 

[EverChanging]

I can see things from many people's point of view. From the Islamic point of view, a secular reason against homosexuality is that it lowers the birth rate and this hurts their cause. I have explained earlier why this is bad for their cause. I do not argue all the time from the standpoint of what i want. I can also understand and state what the other side wants and their reasons for it. If I do this, it doesn’t mean that I am on their side.

Yes there is no Allah. But you said that you know about Islam. I was just testing to see if you know the basics of Islam. The Quran is the main operating manual for Muslims. You said that you are studying the Quran. If so, then you will agree with me that in the Quran, Allah commands Muslims to fight until the only religion left in the world is Islam. No matter how diverse the religion is, or how varying the interpretations, still their main operating manual is the Quran.

True, Muslims are a diverse group of people. True, there are extremists. The extremists are the moderate Muslims. I love these Muslims, they are the ones that surrounds me. They are my friends and colleagues. The Muslim terrorists are the true Muslims who really follow the Quran; just like their prophet Mohammad who caused terror and conquered everywhere he went.

Moderate Muslims are not dangerous now. If there are signs that they are going to be, I would have migrated long ago. But they do have the potential to be dangerous. From time to time, some of them do wake up to their true responsibility and work towards making the country they are in, an Islamic one. One of the ways is to breed prolifically.

A few grasshoppers are not dangerous; they are even cute. But in under certain conditions and when their numbers are big enough, they transform into the dreaded destructive locust swarm. Muslims are like that. When they are few, they are humble and seems to be able to integrate. But when their population grows big enough, they will start to agitate for more rights. The right to sound the Azan- the Muslim call to prayer. The goal is for the sound of the Azan to be heard in a continuous manner everywhere in the world, so that at the time of prayers, there is no where, where the Azan cannot be not heard. This requires for the world to be entirely Islam. If they cannot conquer the world by force, they will conquer it by breeding. They thank you for your social security. It helps.

Many are only Muslim in name. They are closet non-Muslim. These do and are able to integrate. Do you think I want to write a long thesis to explain all this in my posts. No, I would rather generalize. I write about the majority, not the minority.

Do I not have basis for my claims?

Okay, for one thing, a religion is not its holy book, and a holy book is not its religion. It is not separate from how it is intepreted. The Bible is full of stories of rape, genocide, infanticide, and more, but that does not mean every Jew interprets the Torah as meaning they should stone their children on Saturday if they pick up sticks. This does not make them any less of a part of the Jewish culture that has evolved. Muslims define their own culture, not you.

You would rather generalize because you are stereotyping an entire cultural group of people and labeling them all as not able to integrate or not true Muslims.

Certainly a growing Muslim population can end up with a movement to restrict others' rights, just as growing numbers of conservative Christians in the states seek to restrict others' rights and get rid of the separation of church and state. Doesn't mean they're all like that or that a person isn't a true Christian if they don't interpret the text literally.

Your "secular" argument is still not a secular argument. Arguing against homosexuality on the grounds that it hurts the Islamic cause is not secular, it is religious because it is directly related to and pertains to religion.

 

[MW0082]

Sodomy does not appeal to heterosexuals. (The most obvious yet most overlooked.)

Sure it does, heterosexuals have anal sex all the time....

 

[EverChanging]

Sodomy does not appeal to heterosexuals. (The most obvious yet most overlooked.)

Wrong, and even if it didn't, it does appeal to homosexuals. And just because something doesn't appeal to one group of people sexually doesn't mean another group shouldn't have the pleasure of enjoying it. Try again.

 

[Midnight Pete]

You need to get out more.

There is no lack of heterosexuals who practice sodomy, or, as some would call it, anal sex.

Anal sex is wildly appealling until you consider the medical and anatomical implications.

Like rectal prolapse.

And anal warts.

 

[gnomon]

Sodomy does not appeal to heterosexuals. (The most obvious yet most overlooked.)

Fellatio and cunilingus are sodomy. Both common and legal definitions of sodomy include those acts.

Now I don't get out much these days but last I heard such genital manipulation is fairly common and considered an art form by many.

Is anyone actually going to put forth an argument against homosexuality, which is not an act but a way of being, or are the religious believers just going to keep stating in many different ways there personal disgust with a **** going in an ***.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Sodomy does not appeal to heterosexuals. (The most obvious yet most overlooked.)

Heteros do a lot......no matter the religion, the color, the age, the height.....oh yeah...a lot....:drool:

 

[Midnight Pete]

Is anyone actually going to put forth an argument against homosexuality, which is not an act but a way of being, or are the religious believers just going to keep stating in many different ways there personal disgust with a **** going in an ***.

My personal disgust with a **** going in an *** is not really about my religious beliefs. And it does not constitute an argument against homosexuality which not an act but a way of being. I do not care enough about other people's sex-lives to give them grief about it. And I do not care about the church's official stance on homosexuality.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Anal sex is wildly appealling until you consider the medical and anatomical implications.

Like rectal prolapse.

Can occur due to a myriad of reasons but anal sex wasn't on the list. Did I miss it?

And anal warts.

" You do not have to have anal intercourse to develop anal condyloma."

NEXT....!!!!!!

 

[jarofthoughts]

Wrong, and even if it didn't, it does appeal to homosexuals. And just because something doesn't appeal to one group of people sexually doesn't mean another group shouldn't have the pleasure of enjoying it. Try again.

I think you meant to reply to someone else.
We are, as far as I can see, in total agreement about this.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Fellatio and cunilingus are sodomy. Both common and legal definitions of sodomy include those acts.

Now I don't get out much these days but last I heard such genital manipulation is fairly common and considered an art form by many.

Is anyone actually going to put forth an argument against homosexuality, which is not an act but a way of being, or are the religious believers just going to keep stating in many different ways there personal disgust with a **** going in an ***.

The use of scripture has been deemed off limits here so there really isn't an argument one can put forth....:cover:

 

[Scott C.]

I appreciate your honesty. Bolded for emphasis.

Right. God is the author of moral law in my view. If one does not believe in God or absolute law, as established by God, then any moral argument based on such a belief is nonsense to that non-believer. But, to those who believe in God and his moral law, there is no more reliable, authoratative, or correct place to turn for moral direction. Hence, the chasm between our points of view.

 

[EverChanging]

Anal sex is wildly appealling until you consider the medical and anatomical implications.

Like rectal prolapse.

And anal warts.

And these diseases can come from heterosexual sex as well....Nothing exclusive to gay sex.

 

[EverChanging]

I think you meant to reply to someone else.
We are, as far as I can see, in total agreement about this.

Sorry about that -- pasted the wrong quote. I fixed it.

 

[naikaidiver]

The only factual and testable arguments for against Homosexuality is that it does not contribute to the propogation of our species since same-sex couples cannot reproduce.

(to clarify, until human cloning is allowed, we cannot combine the DNA of two, same sex partners to create an offspring)

Other than that there is nothing unnatural about it. There are other mamalian species that have taken a homosexual partner.

Now as far as cultural implications... well its common knowledge that some parts of the world are more "accepting" than others.

Personally, I've always said,

"Let homosexual people be. They are just as entitled to be as miserable as the rest of us!"

 

[linwood]

Sodomy does not appeal to heterosexuals. (The most obvious yet most overlooked.)

Speak for yourself.

 

[Faithfreedom]

Your "secular" argument is still not a secular argument. Arguing against homosexuality on the grounds that it hurts the Islamic cause is not secular, it is religious because it is directly related to and pertains to religion.

A religious argument would be like, "Don't do that because Allah says not to".
To conquer the world by breeding prolifically to overwhelm and push out other groups is tactical warfare. Therefore i say that this strategy is secular and not religious.