Is feminism still needed in the U.S.

[Curious George]

No. It should stay, because it's a Christian country. Just look at all the crime in the country. That's what happena whwn you take out God. And no ammount of equal rights movements, or politics, or money can ever stop that. Only beleif in God can.

If the above list did work, then we wouldn't be in this mess.

That is a whole different issue and thread, my question to you is do you understand why the feminist movement is still both necessary and valuable. And while you might say that with God it would not be.necessary, but that is not what I want to know. In the state in which the u.s. Is in now, do you see the reasoning behind the movement. I hope I gave enough videos that people from everywhere could find a feminist issue important to them, so as to at least acknowledge some current value of feminism. But if I failed I will gladly post more videos of yet more issues of which feminism confronts.

 

[Pagan_Patriot]

What I was saying is if we had God in our lives, we wouldn't need these movements. At this point though, I don't think it matters. They can have their movement, and the equal pay and whatnot aounds good, but the whole abortion and contraception, not so much, unless they're one of those poor mothers, or teenagers.

 

[Curious George]

What I was saying is if we had God in our lives, we wouldn't need these movements. At this point though, I don't think it matters. They can have their movement, and the equal pay and whatnot aounds good, but the whole abortion and contraception, not so much, unless they're one of those poor mothers, or teenagers.

It might surprise you to know that feminists come in all different forms. There are even pro life feminists. We all have a tendency to group people into partisian roles, but this is a.characteristic of ourselves which we must be aware.

 

[Alceste]

What I was saying is if we had God in our lives, we wouldn't need these movements. At this point though, I don't think it matters. They can have their movement, and the equal pay and whatnot aounds good, but the whole abortion and contraception, not so much, unless they're one of those poor mothers, or teenagers.

Luckily for women, you don't get to decide what we can and can't have. We decide what we want and we take it, eventually.

 

[Curious George]

What I was saying is if we had God in our lives, we wouldn't need these movements. At this point though, I don't think it matters. They can have their movement, and the equal pay and whatnot aounds good, but the whole abortion and contraception, not so much, unless they're one of those poor mothers, or teenagers.

It saddens me to see that answer. I feel "they can have their movement" demonstrates apathy toward issues which feminism addresses. Would you say the same if a group at your church was addressing those issues such as the sex trade in America? I often hear on these boards people lament about evils and atrocities of which churches are guilty. I have on occasion pointed out the good that religious groups do. In RL, I am the same way. Issues are not so simple, not so black and white. Whether you agree or disagree with some of the changes which feminism has affected in the U.S. They have achieved a lot. I would assume if for any other reason than patriotism, you would applaud the women and men of the feminist movement for fighting for that which they believe.

 

[Aquitaine]

This has come up in a few threads I've been spying on so I thought I'd give it its own thread. So basically do you feel that feminism as a movement is still needed in the united states? Why or why not?

Any movement(s) which aim to bring about equality, fairness and more understanding between people should be encouraged. :yes:

 

[ignition]

This has come up in a few threads I've been spying on so I thought I'd give it its own thread. So basically do you feel that feminism as a movement is still needed in the united states? Why or why not?

Nope. They're not needed at all. Some of their goals are unwinnable and unrealistic. They have also put themselves in an indefensible position by making it appear as if all women share their goals, which is just not true.

 

[Pagan_Patriot]

It might surprise you to know that feminists come in all different forms. There are even pro life feminists. We all have a tendency to group people into partisian roles, but this is a.characteristic of ourselves which we must be aware.

That's what I've been trying to tell people all along. That not everyone who is grouped thinks one way.

 

[Pagan_Patriot]

Michigan Woman Claims Doctor Forced Abortion After She Said Stop - ABC News

 

[Curious George]

Nope. They're not needed at all. Some of their goals are unwinnable and unrealistic. They have also put themselves in an indefensible position by making it appear as if all women share their goals, which is just not true.

How have feminists put themselves in an indefensible position making it appear as though all women share the same goals?

Did you watch the videos I posted?

 

[Curious George]

Michigan Woman Claims Doctor Forced Abortion After She Said Stop - ABC News

I already pointed out that there are feminists who are pro life. More extremely pro life than most of the posters who are pro life on these boards. So I fail to see how this applies to whether feminism is needed in the u.s. Today.

 

[Apex]

That being the case...as long as thre is inequality there is still a need for feminism movements.

This is the problem. Where do we draw the line? Do we need to take every single issue and measure them exactly, and if women come out one mm behind then more progress is still needed? What if they come out one mm ahead of men? Is "maleism" then needed?

Bottom line, there will always be people who will never be satisfied and will continue to say women are not equal. That is why we should switch over to something that supports equality for everyone, not just one half of everyone. But, that may be too much of a progressive idea to catch on right now.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

I have a question for all opponents and critics of feminism:

Which feminist works have you read? Any Second Wave works like Betty Frieden? Simone de Beauvoir? Steinem? Pre-First Wave like Wollstonecraft? Any contemporary works? Naomi Wolf? Susie Bright? Mackinnon?

Because every critique of what you think feminism is or is not has been addressed for the last few hundred years. What it has begun to include with Third Wave are the gender inequality concerns globally, women of color, and GLBTQs.

So. What feminist works have you actually picked up and read?

And please, don't insult people's intelligences by haphazardly throwing in anything that clearly is the result of a google search that you typed "former feminists" in the search window. Please list actual works of feminist writers that helped define the mainstream (I asked the question before and was given a hopeless ridiculous answer that the SCUM Manifesto represented the mainstream, which is as intellectually dishonest as it gets).

I read "The Feminine Mystique" and "The Second Sex" in my women's studies class in college roughly 20 years ago, which are great for beginners wanting to start studying feminism to actually see what is being stated. Anybody read these works?

 

[Revoltingest]

I have a question for all opponents and critics of feminism:
Which feminist works have you read? Any Second Wave works like Betty Frieden? Simone de Beauvoir? Steinem? Pre-First Wave like Wollstonecraft? Any contemporary works? Naomi Wolf? Susie Bright? Mackinnon?
Because every critique of what you think feminism is or is not has been addressed for the last few hundred years. What it has begun to include with Third Wave are the gender inequality concerns globally, women of color, and GLBTQs.
So. What feminist works have you actually picked up and read?
And please, don't insult people's intelligences by haphazardly throwing in anything that clearly is the result of a google search that you typed "former feminists" in the search window. Please list actual works of feminist writers that helped define the mainstream (I asked the question before and was given a hopeless ridiculous answer that the SCUM Manifesto represented the mainstream, which is as intellectually dishonest as it gets).
I read "The Feminine Mystique" and "The Second Sex" in my women's studies class in college roughly 20 years ago, which are great for beginners wanting to start studying feminism to actually see what is being stated. Anybody read these works?

I don't know which authors I read would call themselves "feminist". But feminism is more than just works by luminaries in the field....it is also what is said by the millions of ordinary folk who identify as feminists. What I see here is a mix of views & values, generally advancing women's rights & situations. Many, perhaps a minority of them display anti-male bias or gender myopia. I understand that you're personally inclined to see what we would both consider the most positive view of feminism. But I'm more struck by the dark underbelly.

 

[crossfire]

As long as there is human trafficking, there's a need for feminism. :yes:

 

[MysticSang'ha]

I don't know which authors I read would call themselves "feminist". But feminism is more than just works by luminaries in the field....it is also what is said by the millions of ordinary folk who identify as feminists.

Academically, it's a start. Otherwise, we wind up with an unfortunate phenomenon you ought to be aware of in science. It's called confirmation bias.

What I see here is a mix of views & values, generally advancing women's rights & situations. Many, perhaps a minority of them display anti-male bias or gender myopia. I understand that you're personally inclined to see what we would both consider the most positive view of feminism. But I'm more struck by the dark underbelly.

This is where I appreciate your honesty. But, I also know you feel that way about everything, so I'm not suspicious about your intentions concerning women and feminism.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

As long as there is human trafficking, there's a need for feminism. :yes:

But, but, but....there's boys that are trafficked too. Why are you ignoring the plight of boys? That just shows you only care about women and you secretly hate men. And I don't need to look at any studies to show rates, I just care that you didn't mention that you care about men and boys.

[/sarcasm]

 

[Revoltingest]

Academically, it's a start. Otherwise, we wind up with an unfortunate phenomenon you ought to be aware of in science. It's called confirmation bias.

But isn't confirmation bias possible when defining feminism by the literature of luminaries,
rather than by what the common adherent believes & says?
I see the literature as merely one window into feminist thought (one I plan not to pursue).

This is where I appreciate your honesty. But, I also know you feel that way about everything, so I'm not suspicious about your intentions concerning women and feminism.

I don't really have any intentions towards feminism.....it's like weather....something I observe
& comment on. Some of it I like, & some I don't. As for women, my intentions are pretty benign,
even boring.

 

[crossfire]

But, but, but....there's boys that are trafficked too. Why are you ignoring the plight of boys? That just shows you only care about women and you secretly hate men. And I don't need to look at any studies to show rates, I just care that you didn't mention that you care about men and boys.

[/sarcasm]

Indeed. I also didn't mention that women are also involved in trafficking individuals, male and female. Human trafficking is a handy indicator of problems with poverty and the societal marginalization of the humans who are trafficked. Where there is trafficking, there is still much work to be done.

 

[Revoltingest]

But, but, but....there's boys that are trafficked too. Why are you ignoring the plight of boys? That just shows you only care about women and you secretly hate men. And I don't need to look at any studies to show rates, I just care that you didn't mention that you care about men and boys.
[/sarcasm]

Oh, you wag!
If feminism is the name given to what motivates some to oppose human trafficking then I approve of feminism (because I approve of the effect). Of course, your brand of feminism is broader than just benefiting females, & rises to the level of "peoplism". OK, "humanism" is a better term.