Is Global Warming happening?

[Shadow Wolf]

While there is scientific reasonings for the position that humans are causing global warming, there is no scientific proof. Anyone who thinks that this is a black and white issue, scientifically, simply hasn't done their research.

What about the big hole in the O-zone layer? That hole (I think I read thier is a new one forming over Australia) has let in more of the suns rays than should be.
While it is also true the earth has it's cycles of heating and cooling, Global Warming is an unnatural, man-made heating of the planet.

 

[michel]

Global Warming is happening, but we aren't causing it and we can't stop it. We will have a global cooling trend in the future too. The weather is always getting warmer or cooler in cycles. All we are doing is making the effects of Global Warming worse by depleating the Ozone. But these effects are going to end mostly in skin cancer and sun related problems. It won't cause the earth to get any hotter than it would naturally.

I disagree - (is that allowed?)http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/special_report/1998/10/98/global_warming/202408.stm

Global warming: The facts

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Scientists say global warming causes rising sea levels: The map shows the effect a rise of 1.5m would have on the Nile delta[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Every time severe weather strikes, global warming seems to be blamed. But what is it and should we be worried?

Is it real?
Records show that the average temperature of the planet is climbing quite rapidly.
The global average surface air temperature has risen by between 0.3 and 0.6 degrees C in the last century. For Britain, 1998 has proved the hottest year in the last thousand years.

• Although the global weather system is extremely complex and not wholly understood, experts say that such a rapid change in temperature is bound to have severe implications for future weather and climate patterns.
• Climate researchers are predicting that the Earth's average temperature will continue to increase in the next 100 years.
• If greenhouse gas emissions drop slightly, the average world temperature in 2100 could be 1 degree C warmer than in 1990.
• But if they increase a lot and the climate proves very sensitive, the rise could be 3.5 degrees C.
• Scientists think they have uncovered evidence of just such sensitivity. They believe that rainforests damaged by the results of climate change will themselves start emitting carbon, making the problem worse still.
• The global sea level has risen by between 10 and 25 cms over the last century, as glaciers melt and warming sea water expands.
• Levels could rise by between 15 and 95 cms by 2100, and they will inevitably go on rising for 500 years, because the oceans have only just begun to warm up.
• If the researchers' predictions are correct, the rate of change over the last two to three centuries will have been greater than at any other time in the last 10,000 years.

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1101040517-634699,00.html
For all the worries over global warming, there's one quick, though impractical, way to turn down the heat: ground all the jets. That's one conclusion to be drawn from a new NASA study linking the world's rising temperatures to the proliferation of wispy cirrus clouds that can form as a result of trails of condensation left by airliners. A team headed by Patrick Minnis, a senior scientist at NASA's Langley Research Center in Hampton, Va., analyzed 25 years of cirrus-cloud counts and 20 years of temperature records and found that cloud cover increased most where jet traffic was heaviest, including flight corridors over the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans.
Clouds, which reflect sunlight, ought to cool the earth. But they can also hold in warmth. That second effect swamps the first. According to Minnis' calculations, increased cloud cover since the 1970s ought to have led to a warming of .36� to .54�F per decade. The actual warming during this period falls within that range, at just under .5�. That may not sound like much, but when only 9�F separate our current temperature from the last Ice Age, it's clear that a little warming makes a big difference. "This study," says Minnis, "demonstrates that contrails should be included in climate-change scenarios."
The only way to prove the point is to keep the jets on the tarmac and see what happens. That's exactly what occurred in 2001, between Sept. 11 and 14, when U.S. air travel was shut down following the terrorist attacks. During that period, the swing between daytime highs and nighttime lows sometimes measured more than twice as much as usual, perhaps owing to a reduction in cirrus clouds that allowed collected solar heat to radiate away. New and larger passenger planes might exacerbate the problem, but it is the frequency of flights that matters most. One way to tackle warming would be to have planes fly roughly 25% lower — altitudes less conducive to cirrus-cloud formation. But there's a catch: gas consumption would go up if planes were forced to plow through thicker air.

and the following is on informative sure:- http://www.ecobridge.org/content/g_cse.htm

I heard a couple of days ago how much carbon dioxide is released by jet flights, but This article oputs it into perspective:-


Prince Charles is to fly to New York, booking the entire first-class and business class section of a jumbo jet for his 20-strong entourage - to pick up an award for his work on the environment.
During the trip he plans to emphasise the importance which the British Government places on climate change as a key international priority.
Also see
CO2 offset schemes to be given 'gold standard' rating
To underline his commitment to reducing his 'carbon footprint' - the amount of carbon dioxide pumped into the atmosphere during the flight - he is to travel by scheduled flight instead of a chartered or private jet.
But he and his 20-strong party will travel exclusively in the first and club class sections where there are a total of 62 seats.
This means their effective 'carbon footprint' is three times what it would be if every seat was used and the short return trip to New York will result in the emission of 24 tonnes of carbon dioxide.
To 'offset' this, the prince would need to pay £177.60 to plant trees.
Charles and Camilla will visit Philadelphia and New York on a two-day visit to America on 27 and 28 January.
The Prince is to receive the Global Environmental Citizen Award from Harvard Medical School's Centre for Health and the Global Environment, from last year's recipient, former Vice President and Presidential candidate Al Gore and actress Meryl Streep.
He is to be praised for highlighting the importance of the environment.
The Prince, who has described climate change as the 'biggest threat to mankind', is also planning to publish details of his own carbon footprint - a measure of how his activities have had an impact on the environment in terms of the amount of green house gases produced - as part of his 2007 accounts.
In November it was revealed that he planned a green revolution at his office.
The radical shake-up included getting staff to use bicycles to help the fight against global warming. He said he was even prepared to travel to London by commuter train from a station near Highgrove.
Charles told aides he also wanted to stop using gas-guzzling royal helicopters and private jets on official engagements whenever possible and intended to make more use of the royal train and to find a more environmentally-friendly fuel for his fleet of cars.
In December Charles officially announced his plans saying he may cut down on official engagements to live a greener lifestyle.
Senior courtiers said changing his travel programme may result in the prince carrying out fewer official duties each year.
His spokesman Paddy Harverson said at the time: "One of our main targets will be to reduce the number of flights the prince uses in the UK each year."
The cost of Charles and Camilla's weekend visit to New York will be significantly less than the £280,186 to taxpayers for his last official trip to America in November 2005.
With a hefty discount negotiated with British Airways the cost is still expected to be around £100,000. If he had paid full fare for the 14 first class seats and 48 business class seats the return flight would have cost £281,530.
Last year Charles spent £1.1 million on private planes and helicopters, including £304,000 on a private jet for his official tour of Egypt, India and Saudi Arabia.

Don't fool yourselves; for every bit of fossil fuel burned here, on Earth, man is responsible for making Global warming much worse.

Hey, I am one of the lucky ones; I live about 200 feet above sea level, and the British climate is fast becomming warmer.............I'm O.K Jack; but that isn't the answer...









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[des]

BTW, it isnt' true (I think someone stated) that all "government" scientists have been quiet on the issue. In fact, someone from NASA was officially "silenced" by the Bush admin. for discussing global warming. People funded by NOAA and NASA have been studying this-- but if the Bush admin. disagrees they cut off the funds or tell them to be quiet about it.

--des

 

[FFH]

So our massive increase in size with 300 million people alone living in the USA most of them driving trucks and SUV's aren't doing anything at all to the environment? How's that?

Becky your assessment is absolutely correct.

Carbon monoxide has eaten two holes in two different places, last I checked, in the earth's ozone layer, one hole hovers over Australia and has caused sheep to go blind and schools to require kids to wear hats when outside and the report I read concerning this came out 10 years ago.

This is nothingknew and eventually most if not all of the ozone layer will be all but gone, if we continue on polluting the atmosphere at the current rate, and there is no way to reverse deterioration of the ozone layer...in other words when it's gone it's gone...

I don't drive a car now, just a motorcycle to work, at 60 miles per gallon....

I'm holding out for a fully electric car, which should be coming down in price, but if they don't I will continue to drive a motorcycle to work and will refuse to by another gas car or hybrid...besides they are too expensive to operate and maintain.

See www.ACpropulsion.com

80,000 for the tzero (electric sports car)
55,000 for the Ebox (converted electric Scion xB)

 

[FFH]

See www.ACpropulsion.com

80,000 for the tzero (electric sports car)
55,000 for the Ebox (electric Scion SUV)

The president of this company drives a converted fully electric 1990 Honda Civic he did himself...

This is the future of cars...gas cars will eventually be phased out I think...

 

[BUDDY]

Ah yes, all that CO2 we add to the usual normal earthly sources couldn't possibly be having any effect.

Methinks it's you who've been reading too much pseudo science.

The weight of the scientific community is not on your side on this one, Buddy.

I've been watching this one since the original work on CO2 levels was being published in the 70s and we were discussing it in a Physics seminar.

The difference was, in the 70s, while even the early research made it glaringly obvious that the rise in levels were due to humanity's influence (gee, funny how it goes hand in hand with the Industrial Revolution ), and that it was very *unusual*, no one then would've predicted such an acceleration in CO2 levels in a few short decades thereafter, or the obvious melting of ice that's been around for thousands upon thousands of years, or the receding permafrost, or other effects we've observed.

35 years later, there's no debate on whether humans have a hand in this greenhouse gas rise, but apparently politicos think they know better.

Well, I don't look to a physicist for lessons on politics, nor do I think it wise to look to politicos for lessons in science.

But hey, anyone who wants to imitate an ostrich, it's a free country. Knock yourself out.

Despite your somewhat funny and quite silly retorts, you have yet to sight or refence andy real daa that can prove that man's existence has created causation towards global warming. If you really want to know the science, try doing the math that shows how much energy is required to raise the average temperature of the earth 1/10 of one degree Celcius. then calculate how much energy is created by man in one year. Then you tell me whether or not it is plausible, let a lone possible for the activities of man to have an effect on our global temperature. Now if yo were arguing that man has had an adverse effect on the cleanliness of air and water, I would totally agree with you, especially when you consider the ecological disaster areas that are third world countries. However, when it comes to global climate change, the data just does not support the claims. This is fact. Whether it is popular to say so or not.

 

[BUDDY]

Post proof or retract.

Hint: Pseudoscience from Michael Chrichton does not constitute proof.

No. It is up to the sciencetist to most proof that man causes global warming. There has not been any given. I already gave some if you go back and look. But, here is somemore for you. Not that it matters. People rarely change their minds regardless of how much "proof" you throw at them.

http://www.junkscience.com/Greenhouse/

 

[BUDDY]

You know Buddy, I'd given you credit for more intelligence than to fall into the camp of 'If I Find The Science Unpalatable, It's Bollocks'.I was obviously labouring under a misapprehension in thinking that was solely the province of rabid creationists and drug users with a vested interest in convincing themselves there couldn't possibly be any detrimental effects of their poison of choice because they don't want there to be.
It's sad when otherwise bright people need a bucket of sand to keep their head in.

Well...that was unfriendly and entirely unconstructive. I do not doubt that global warming exists. There simply is no proof that humans cause it. I stick to my statement and use previous posts to prove it.

 

[BUDDY]

The truth about global warming - it's the Sun that's to blame

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2004/07/18/wsun18.xml&sSheet=/news/2004/07/18/ixnewstop.html

 

[Ozzie]

I'm steaming up here in Oz. I heard predictions are that average summer temperatures will increase in Sydney by up to 7 degrees over the next 30 years. Can't wait. On the other hand, I am happy I live on the top of a hill.

 

[Ozzie]

Well...that was unfriendly and entirely unconstructive. I do not doubt that global warming exists. There simply is no proof that humans cause it. I stick to my statement and use previous posts to prove it.

Ostriches have long legs so will not mind a rise in sea levels of up to a meter or so. I always wanted a bird with long legs. The next time I see one I will ask if she believes in global warming.

 

[Quoth The Raven]

Well...that was unfriendly and entirely unconstructive. I do not doubt that global warming exists. There simply is no proof that humans cause it. I stick to my statement and use previous posts to prove it.

No, what is entirely unconstructive is to look at two sides of an argument, say 'I like this one because it means we can maintain the status quo and I don't have to do anything' and then stand about saying,'Prove we're doing anything.'
You know what, I've been slightly skeptical myself in the past, but I frankly think it's better to err on the side of caution and act as if we do make a difference, than stick my head up my arse in a blind refusal to accept that we might.
If your team is right and we act as if it isn't, the worst case scenario is that nothing changes despite our best efforts. If the other team is right and we act as if it isn't, we screw ourselves.

 

[darkpenguin]

You were right, too. I was shocked at my very own carbon footprint...I was shocked it was over 4,000kg a year less than the average UK resident. What are you lot doing over there?

Lol I don't have a clue, oh wait parents driving their kids to school in 4x4s and thinking that their being clever and protecting their kids. Sad thing is that their going to grow up to be just like their parents!

 

[darkpenguin]

The truth about global warming - it's the Sun that's to blame

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2004/07/18/wsun18.xml&sSheet=/news/2004/07/18/ixnewstop.html

Thats great logic, if all else fails then blame a big flaming ball of gas thats been there since day one and actually helped give us life! Maybe we should just nuke it out of existence and see just how well we get along without it!

 

[Green Gaia]

When you compare the rising temperatures to the rising amount of CO2 in the atmosphere since the Industrial Revolution, the correlation is undeniable.

 

[Green Gaia]

There is no question that we are harming the Earth with all the poisionous gases we release into the air every second of every day with our industry, vehicles, energy usage, etc. Not to mention what we do to water sources and the land. Do we really have to get into a situation where we're all about to die before we do something about it?

 

[spacemonkey]

When you compare the rising temperatures to the rising amount of CO2 in the atmosphere since the Industrial Revolution, the correlation is undeniable.

Couldn't this be a coincidence, have we even been recording temperatures since before the industrial revolution? The timeline of your graph isn't even .01% of the Earth's umm..."lifespan" (for lack of a better term). How do you explain the ice age? Who caused that?

 

[Green Gaia]

Couldn't this be a coincidence, have we even been recording temperatures since before the industrial revolution? The timeline of your graph isn't even .01% of the Earth's umm..."lifespan" (for lack of a better term). How do you explain the ice age? Who caused that?

There are better, longer graphs which answer your questions. I didn't want to post a huge image on here. But the info is there if you want to look for it. The Earth does goes through a cycle of heating and cooling, but nothing this severe naturally.

 

[wizanda]

Anyone noticed the wind speeds in the stratosphere have tripled in the last year, double year before, so if they keep increasing at this rate, we will soon have more hurricanes globally, as UK is now starting to see....like written the queen sitting on her throne has a wind stored up for her....UK as a picture is the queen sitting on her throne.

 

[FFH]

Couldn't this be a coincidence, have we even been recording temperatures since before the industrial revolution? The timeline of your graph isn't even .01% of the Earth's umm..."lifespan" (for lack of a better term). How do you explain the ice age? Who caused that?

Amazing...

Why is the carbon dioxide correlation not obvious to most people....

Even Pat Robertson said something to the effect that Al Gore is doing a good job in trying to educate the general public of the dangers and devastations of Co2 in our atmosphere...