Is God able to provide additional evidence that would convince more people to accept him?

[Beta]

You mean to tell me that God has promise to save everybody?

Mat 10:22
And you will be hated by all for My name's sake. But he who endures to the end will be saved.​

What happens to those that do not endure to the end?

Mar 13:13
And you will be hated by all for My name's sake. But he who endures to the end shall be saved.
Mar 16:16
He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.
Luk 13:24
"Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able.​

I am Christian and I like the idea of universal Salvation but I don’t see it in scripture.

Jhn 3:16

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.​

Excuse my ignorance but could you explain what you mean by universal salvation ? If you mean that all will be saved regardless I don't see that in the Bible neither. I agree with the scriptures quoted above.
As I understand ' CAN be saved' applies to all people IF they repent of their wrong ways but ' WILL be saved' applies only to those who have repented and accepted Jesus' sacrifice as their Saviour.

 

[Beta]

So, then, Beta, how do you know that the Christian interpretation of God is more valid than, say, the Hindu or Sikh or Muslim interpretation, if you don't use reasoning?

A true Christian believes GOD whatever he says - We don't believe because it makes sense to us - that would be applying our own wisdom and not faith and trust in God.
The Bible tells us there are true and false christians so obviously they believe different things. As regards other religions people make up their own mind. I just mention true and false christians because they affect Christianity in a positive and negative way.

 

[DeitySlayer]

A true Christian believes GOD whatever he says - We don't believe because it makes sense to us - that would be applying our own wisdom and not faith and trust in God.
The Bible tells us there are true and false christians so obviously they believe different things. As regards other religions people make up their own mind. I just mention true and false christians because they affect Christianity in a positive and negative way.

Yes, so how do you know the Bible is God's true book, and not, say, the Qu'ran or the Guru Granth Sahib? You must have gone through some sort of judging process to pick the Bible rather than just randomly choosing it.

 

[Beta]

So, God simply didn't like greek people born a couple of hundred years before Christ?

God will deal with OT people at a different time from us. God loves all people equally and will give all the same chance to repent and turn. God saves in stages - not all at once. :yes:

 

[nrg]

So let me give you again the example of a small child - could you put into his mind all it needs to know how to be a doctor, a surgeon, an accountant, a preacher, a banker, a scientist ?

No, I can't, since I'm not omnipotent. God is, I'm not. What's your point?

And even if you could know it , all it would give you is an educated human life that ends with death. That is not what God has planned for us.

I never said giving us the knowledge to become a banker, doctor and what not was what God should do, just make us better at understanding his word so there's zero interpretation and zero confusion of what choice to make. That's all.

ALSO BESIDES knowledge we need to have love, mercy, compassion, patience and a host of other Godly qualities that come only with experience.

Yeah, getting all that knowledge without experience would take a miracle. So, what's your point?

Non of us chose anything when we were infants but we get to make choices when we grow up which is what is expected of mankind now we have been around a few millennia. NOW you get to choose God and learn HIS ways or reject him. That is man's initial step now as adults.

Why did he make it work this particular way? Why not simply make us all able bodied decision makers so we can make the decision right away? If I die when I just entered adulthood in India, and my parents never told me anything about christianity, do I have to suffer the consequences then?

We learn by personal experience, not by being pre-programmed
with head-knowledge. It alone does not complete our creation.
(will answer other points as we go along)

Why do we have to learn through experience? It's extremely unfair against alot of people who die very, very young and almost get no experience at all about anything, let alone about Jesus and God. Doesn't God and Jesus love everyone?

God will deal with OT people at a different time from us. God loves all people equally and will give all the same chance to repent and turn. God saves in stages - not all at once. :yes:

If both systems work just as well, why have two systems in the first place? Why crucify his own son when he simply could do the same thing he does to the OT people to us?

 

[Beta]

Yes, so how do you know the Bible is God's true book, and not, say, the Qu'ran or the Guru Granth Sahib? You must have gone through some sort of judging process to pick the Bible rather than just randomly choosing it.

There is no point going into my religious history because it is different for everybody. All are free to try any they wish, you don't have to take my word for it. We are after all in the time of man when each can choose to do his own thing.
The reason for discussion is to give our own viewpoints and if nothing comes of it so be it ! I have no problem with people finding their own pew or whatever !

 

[DavyCrocket2003]

A true Christian believes GOD whatever he says - We don't believe because it makes sense to us - that would be applying our own wisdom and not faith and trust in God.
The Bible tells us there are true and false christians so obviously they believe different things. As regards other religions people make up their own mind. I just mention true and false christians because they affect Christianity in a positive and negative way.

Hey Beta. Nice to meet you. I don't really agree with the idea that it doesn't matter if God's word makes sense to us. If it doesn't make sense, why do we believe it? I mean, what is it about God that makes you believe and follow him? You do need faith. But faith has to be based on something doesn't it? For example, I can't just start believing anything I want because I have faith. What is the foundation of your belief in God if you can't use your own judgement? I would love to hear more about this.

 

[Beta]

No, I can't, since I'm not omnipotent. God is, I'm not. What's your point? I never said giving us the knowledge to become a banker, doctor and what not was what God should do, just make us better at understanding his word so there's zero interpretation and zero confusion of what choice to make. That's all. Yeah, getting all that knowledge without experience would take a miracle. So, what's your point?
Why did he make it work this particular way? Why not simply make us all able bodied decision makers so we can make the decision right away? If I die when I just entered adulthood in India, and my parents never told me anything about christianity, do I have to suffer the consequences then?
Why do we have to learn through experience? It's extremely unfair against alot of people who die very, very young and almost get no experience at all about anything, let alone about Jesus and God. Doesn't God and Jesus love everyone?
If both systems work just as well, why have two systems in the first place? Why crucify his own son when he simply could do the same thing he does to the OT people to us?

You are throwing up questions that are way down the line of creation and one would have to write a book to answer them.

That is why God wants us to start at the beginning with repentance of erronious past ways and a sincere longing to learn afresh the truth which will set us free. How many are prepared to do that ???

 

[Beta]

Hey Beta. Nice to meet you. I don't really agree with the idea that it doesn't matter if God's word makes sense to us. If it doesn't make sense, why do we believe it? I mean, what is it about God that makes you believe and follow him? You do need faith. But faith has to be based on something doesn't it? For example, I can't just start believing anything I want because I have faith. What is the foundation of your belief in God if you can't use your own judgement? I would love to hear more about this.

Hi there, (not sure I have not spoken to you on some forum, your handle seems to ring a bell). No matter , nice to talk to you.
Put it this way - when I first read from the Bible nothing made sense to me and I was thoroughly confused. But eventually (over a period of years) I happened on some scriptures that actually opened my eyes and I believed what God said and started to apply it in my life. I was not popular with my family yet they put up with my new belief now for 30 years. It is simply faith and trust in God that his Word is truth and we are to live it. That's it in a nutshell though there is suffering that goes along with it.

 

[DavyCrocket2003]

Hi there, (not sure I have not spoken to you on some forum, your handle seems to ring a bell). No matter , nice to talk to you.
Put it this way - when I first read from the Bible nothing made sense to me and I was thoroughly confused. But eventually (over a period of years) I happened on some scriptures that actually opened my eyes and I believed what God said and started to apply it in my life. I was not popular with my family yet they put up with my new belief now for 30 years. It is simply faith and trust in God that his Word is truth and we are to live it. That's it in a nutshell though there is suffering that goes along with it.

Do you ever play starcraft? I used to play it a lot, and that is my name on there. I suck at it. lol. That's why I played a lot, because I couldn't take being so bad. I kept trying to get better at it, but I never did. Anyway, nice to talk to you too. Seriously.
So, I am curious. Why did you start reading the Bible in the first place? Was it out of curiosity? Also, does the Bible always seem perfectly clear to you? I mean, there are a lot of things in the Bible that I don't totally understand, or that don't totally make sense. I think that applying God's word and living it in our lives requires a great deal of thinking. I think it requires thinking to extract principles from the the scriptures. And I think it requires just as much, if not more, to apply those principles into our modern lives. Basically, I think God gave us our intellect for a reason. And I think he expects it to use it for good. I think one of the best ways we can use it is to try and understand the Gospel better and how we can become more like Jesus Christ.

 

[nrg]

You are throwing up questions that are way down the line of creation and one would have to write a book to answer them.

Could you at least explain the basics?

That is why God wants us to start at the beginning with repentance of erronious past ways and a sincere longing to learn afresh the truth which will set us free. How many are prepared to do that ???

The thing is, the system you tell me he made seems exactly like a system an all powerful and all loving God wouldn't do. It sounds like something half assed, full of flaws and with alot of bad consequences caused by this lack of planning. Yes, the system you tell me about. God hasn't taken the time to physically step down and tell me, I have to trust books and other people that they represent God even though books and people make mistakes all the time.

That's what the thread is all about. If God could've just stepped down and given us all some evidence good reasoning skills, we would all chose the right decision and no one would go to hell, and we would still have the choice to not make the right choice. Why can't you adress these issues? I mean, you've been thinking along these lines too and then used reasoning to solve these questions, right? It's not all blind faith, right? Right?

 

[Beta]

Could you at least explain the basics?

The thing is, the system you tell me he made seems exactly like a system an all powerful and all loving God wouldn't do. It sounds like something half *****, full of flaws and with alot of bad consequences caused by this lack of planning. Yes, the system you tell me about. God hasn't taken the time to physically step down and tell me, I have to trust books and other people that they represent God even though books and people make mistakes all the time.

That's what the thread is all about. If God could've just stepped down and given us all some evidence good reasoning skills, we would all chose the right decision and no one would go to hell, and we would still have the choice to not make the right choice. Why can't you adress these issues? I mean, you've been thinking along these lines too and then used reasoning to solve these questions, right? It's not all blind faith, right? Right?

You certainly seem sincere but really it is not me or any human being who can give you what you want but GOD. People make mistakes, I still make mistakes , books can mislead, errors abound in this evil world. That is why we are all in GOD's hands - at least those who go to him for help but it can take time. The best i can do is to point people in HIS direction and it then becomes a matter between you and God and is known as a personal relationship. When we pray we speak to God when we read his Word he speaks to us. You go to scripture for answers not to people or books, that is my advice. You ask HIM for help no matter how long it takes . It may not have been your time to know God , there is order to his plan and he fits us in when it is the best time for us 1Cor.15v23.
It may start out on the blind side because we are not familiar with spiritual concepts but like learning to talk we eventually come to grips with it.. It does take faith, trust, confidence, loyalty, love and obedience to God and Christ which perhaps for some is too tall an order. However - God gives us help by the power of his Holy Spirit but there are still hard battles in store for us.Mat.7v13,14.
No one will go to hell who is prepared to start at the bottom with a little humility and willing to learn Mat.18v3.
Hope this does not get me into trouble for proselytizing, just giving you my explanation and opinion since you asked.

 

[nrg]

You certainly seem sincere but really it is not me or any human being who can give you what you want but GOD.

But how do you open up a two way dialog between me and God, without needing to trust other people (priests, church goers etc.) or books (the Bible, theology literature, etc.) through blind faith?

When we pray we speak to God when we read his Word he speaks to us. You go to scripture for answers not to people or books, that is my advice.

But, the scriptures were still recorded by people claiming to represent God. I have to trust that;
A) These people actually got the word of God dilevered to them, and for some reason God cannot do the same with me (wich doesn't really make sense at all).
B) They also made zero mistakes when they recorded them down.

And since we don't have any sort of evidence or independent witnesses testifying that they, indeed, fulfill these two particular criteria I have to accept it through blind faith.

You ask HIM for help no matter how long it takes . It may not have been your time to know God , there is order to his plan and he fits us in when it is the best time for us 1Cor.15v23.

This sounds like a cop out. Did he at least have the courtesy to tell what traits he want us to develop before he makes contact?

It may start out on the blind side because we are not familiar with spiritual concepts but like learning to talk we eventually come to grips with it.. It does take faith, trust, confidence, loyalty, love and obedience to God and Christ which perhaps for some is too tall an order.

This really sounds like once I believe in God, I will get confirmation that he does exist. I know a few things about the brain, and one of them is that once humans believe in something, even though it's utter nonsense, that belief can be confirmed for them by playing tricks with their own mind. Placebo medication is a classic example.

No one will go to hell who is prepared to start at the bottom with a little humility and willing to learn Mat.18v3.

We get second chances with God? Never heard that one before.

 

[Beta]

But how do you open up a two way dialog between me and God, without needing to trust other people (priests, church goers etc.) or books (the Bible, theology literature, etc.) through blind faith? But, the scriptures were still recorded by people claiming to represent God. I have to trust that;
A) These people actually got the word of God dilevered to them, and for some reason God cannot do the same with me (wich doesn't really make sense at all).
B) They also made zero mistakes when they recorded them down.

And since we don't have any sort of evidence or independent witnesses testifying that they, indeed, fulfill these two particular criteria I have to accept it through blind faith. This sounds like a cop out. Did he at least have the courtesy to tell what traits he want us to develop before he makes contact?
This really sounds like once I believe in God, I will get confirmation that he does exist. I know a few things about the brain, and one of them is that once humans believe in something, even though it's utter nonsense, that belief can be confirmed for them by playing tricks with their own mind. Placebo medication is a classic example.
We get second chances with God? Never heard that one before.

Friend , I'd love to get into more detail but I have to be careful what I say having already had 2 warnings over the past few months. :sorry1: . However i answer your questions would be read as pros/ing.

 

[emiliano]

Excuse my ignorance but could you explain what you mean by universal salvation ? If you mean that all will be saved regardless I don't see that in the Bible neither. I agree with the scriptures quoted above.
As I understand ' CAN be saved' applies to all people IF they repent of their wrong ways but ' WILL be saved' applies only to those who have repented and accepted Jesus' sacrifice as their Saviour.

Well you can researched (google it).is a movement that has joined forces with Unitarians, they believe that after a time (ion) God will saved everybody, including Satan, I don’t like to debated them because for what I got from debating them I found out that they do it because they love God so much that they can accept that not all will be save and live forever in the kingdom, they greatest argument is that God punishes with the purpose of correcting and been Almighty this would means every body including Satan.

 

[emiliano]

So, God simply didn't like greek people born a couple of hundred years before Christ?

So, God simply didn't like Greek people born a couple of hundred years before Christ?

NO He didn’t, if Jesus would not have descended and ascended nobody would have been saved and this causation could have a base.

Eph 4:9
(Now this, "He ascended"--what does it mean but that He also first [fn] descended into the lower parts of the earth?
Eph 4:8
Therefore He says: "When He ascended on high, He led captivity captive, And gave gifts to men."
​

 

[nrg]

Friend , I'd love to get into more detail but I have to be careful what I say having already had 2 warnings over the past few months. :sorry1: . However i answer your questions would be read as pros/ing.

Uh, what? Why would you get warnings for simply showing how reasoning works?

So, God simply didn't like Greek people born a couple of hundred years before Christ?

NO He didn’t, if Jesus would not have descended and ascended nobody would have been saved and this causation could have a base.

But, what's so special about the ancient greeks that made God judge them as non-worthy of hearing the Gospels?

 

[Agnostic75]

If a God inspired the Bible, there is no doubt that he is able to provide additional evidence that would convince more people to accept him. What else can Christians argue except for might makes right? That is what the author of Romans chapter 9 argues.

 

[Beta]

If a God inspired the Bible, there is no doubt that he is able to provide additional evidence that would convince more people to accept him. What else can Christians argue except for might makes right? That is what the author of Romans chapter 9 argues.

Certainly God could provide additional evidence of his existence . The problem is that people expect God to answer to them instead of them looking into HIS plans.
God has made plans for the human creation from beginning to end from before the foundation of the world. Anyone who is seriously following God will know more about him and his plans for us. Some of them are rigid while others are flexible, all for our benefit. God has set aside a period of time for man to do his own thing and make his own decisions which is only now shortly coming to an end. During that time God had no plan to reveal himself more than what he does in scripture.
More of God WILL BE revealed when Christ returns and a new chapter starts. :yes:

 

[DavyCrocket2003]

During that time God had no plan to reveal himself more than what he does in scripture.

How would that be to our benefit? It doesn't seem fair to me that God would reveal himself to people in Biblical times and not to us. Why can't anyone experience God if they pay the price?