okay ormiston and dave still say that they credit man. i already responded to that earlier, however i'm going to repeat it again. i know what you're trying to say, the fact that right and wrong vary amongst individuals, however like victor said there is universality in morality, most of us do know right from wrong, and no the mentally handicapped are not "unhealtheir" than us! thats not what i was trying to say, even a mentally handicapped person knows right from wrong to a certain degree, i know one in person, and she would throw a temper tantrum whenever she is angry, and she knows that she shouldn't because its "wrong" but she still does, this is exactly my point, we all know right from wrong in some way or another, we all have gut instincts, and these instincts are man made. if she slaps someone and she sees them hurt she knows it was wrong, these are gut instincts, the ability to tell from right or wrong, which are god-given. its a hard concept to grasp, and just as hard to really put it into words, im not sure if im really getting my point across, but this ability to tell from right or wrong is god-given, we don't just have it, do you get it?