Is it possible for you to do anything that God did not already know you would do?

[doppelganger]

it is never foolish to ask a question! Even if the question serves no real purpose other than to allow people to think!

Hear! Hear!

 

[Mister Emu]

If it is not possible for you to do something that God did not already know you would do, then there can be no free will.

As I said, I would phrase it differently... It isn't that we are going to do something and God knows, it is that we have already done it and God has seen it...

 

[methylatedghosts]

it is never foolish to ask a question! Even if the question serves no real purpose other than to allow people to think!

Muchos Frubal..os?

xD

Frubals anyway

 

[Heneni]

The bible says...that we are a new creation. The old things have passed away. So...god started us..then he finished us and then he got us started.

We all know that any good leader is only really good because he has influence over those he leads. And believe it or not, god might not seem to have an influence on some of you right now, but he will. That is what is so great about god, you cannot not like him in the end. Every knee will bow and every tongue will confess! How is god going to do that? By force? No...by influence. And all of creation will sing his praises....because they want to. Is it possible for there to be anything more glorious than gods ultimate restoration of all things to himself? I cant think of something....

Heneni

 

[Beaudreaux]

As I said, I would phrase it differently... It isn't that we are going to do something and God knows, it is that we have already done it and God has seen it...

Interesting. So, when we get to the point that our consciousness is aware of our actions, it is too late to make a "choice" because the action has already been done.

 

[Enoch07]

Huh?

Just using your own logic against you to show you how crazy it is. hehe :bonk:

The concept is simple. Just because God can foresee all your actions does not mean that He made the decisions for you. You are still responsible for the consequences of your actions, because you are the only one in control of your life.

 

[Beaudreaux]

Just using your own logic against you to show you how crazy it is. hehe :bonk:

The concept is simple. Just because God can foresee all your actions does not mean that He made the decisions for you. You are still responsible for the consequences of your actions, because you are the only one in control of your life.

It never ceases to amaze me how people respond to this argument. I lay out a cogent argument that events that are foreknown with certainty must happen and that any sense of "choosing" those events is an illusion and all I get back is stuff like this:

• Just because God knows what you'll do doesn't mean you don't have a choice

Or

• Omniscience does not rule out free will.

These are not arguments. They do nothing other than say "I disagree with you". They do not offer any reasons or rationale. Just saying something does not make it so. Please explain HOW certain foreknowledge does not obviate choice.

 

[Enoch07]

It never ceases to amaze me how people respond to this argument. I lay out a cogent argument that events that are foreknown with certainty must happen and that any sense of "choosing" those events is an illusion and all I get back is stuff like this:

• Just because God knows what you'll do doesn't mean you don't have a choice

Or

• Omniscience does not rule out free will.

These are not arguments. They do nothing other than say "I disagree with you". They do not offer any reasons or rationale. Just saying something does not make it so. Please explain HOW certain foreknowledge does not obviate choice.

Because its common sense Beau. rofl

 

[Beaudreaux]

Because its common sense Beau. rofl

Really. Then do me this one favor. In all our exchanges, you have still never answered the question that is the OP of this thread. Let us hear the common sense answer:

• Is it possible for you to do anything that God did not already know you would do?

 

[Kilgore Trout]

It never ceases to amaze me how people respond to this argument.

That's the one difference between you and I - it ceased amazing me long ago. No part of my brain has any problem accepting the fact that there are multitudes of people out there who cannot grasp the simplest of logical concepts. If I didn't find it so hilarious, I would be constantly depressed.

 

[Beaudreaux]

Because its common sense Beau. rofl

Really. Then do me this one favor. In all our exchanges, you have still never answered the question that is the OP of this thread. Let us hear the common sense answer:

• Is it possible for you to do anything that God did not already know you would do?

Why do you always head for the hills when this question is posed to you? I can see you are online. What's the problem? Either it IS possible or it is NOT possible. There is no other answer. The question is not loaded, leading or unfair. If this is all so simple to you, why won't you give an answer? Do you not know?

 

[Enoch07]

I have told you the answer a hundred times. lol

 

[Beaudreaux]

I have told you the answer a hundred times. lol

Not even once. You always deflect, like just now. Is it yes or no?

 

[Enoch07]

Not deflecting I answered this long ago. But for the sake of argument.

Is it possible for you to do anything that God did not already know you would do? No

 

[Beaudreaux]

Not deflecting I answered this long ago. But for the sake of argument.

Is it possible for you to do anything that God did not already know you would do? No

So, in any given situation, it is impossible for you to do anything other than what God knows you will do?

 

[Enoch07]

In some cases God can force you to make a choice He knows you would not make on your own. But for the most part you have it right...so far.

 

[Beaudreaux]

So, in any given situation, it is impossible for you to do anything other than what God knows you will do?

In some cases God can force you to make a choice he knows you would not make on your own. But for the most part you have it right...so far.

So, given that you agree that in any given situation it is impossible to do anything other than what God knows, then it follows that you can only do one thing in any given situation. That thing is the thing that God knows.

If, in any given situation, you can only do one thing....how is that choice?

 

[Storm]

Beau, maybe you can help me with this. I do. not. get. your argument that omniscience restricts our choices. I can see it as a possibility, but no more than that. Why is it so ironclad for you?

 

[Enoch07]

Because in almost any given situation you always have more than one option to choose from. Unless God purposely limits you to only one option, then its called free will.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Because in almost any given situation you always have more than one option to choose from. Unless God purposely limits you to only one option, then its called free will.

If there's only one thing you can do (that which god knows you will do), then you only have one option = no free will.