Is it true?

[TransmutingSoul]

This makes for an interesting read on the psychology of denying science.

Why the flat-earth movement is the best symbol of the increasingly diminished value of truth and intelligence

'Inflexible' is the word that sticks out.

I do not deny or devalue science. I see it in a difference frame of reference than you have chosen to.

I see every letter of every word that is revealed by God as having a regenerative creative power. Science can not yet show this as true, is it wrong?

You are free to see it how you choose to.

Regards Tony

 

[Vinayaka]

I do not deny or devalue science. I see it in a difference frame of reference than you have chosen to.

No doubt, your 'science' is different from my 'science'. I don't consider 'Flat earth theory' or magical changing of metals, or lots of other conspiracy theories as science at all, but some sort of science fiction, or just plain hoax. Just as many folks consider their scriptures as literal history, it's all, at the very least, rather questionable.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

No doubt, your 'science' is different from my 'science'. I don't consider 'Flat earth theory' or magical changing of metals, or lots of other conspiracy theories as science at all, but some sort of science fiction, or just plain hoax. Just as many folks consider their scriptures as literal history, it's all, at the very least, rather questionable.

Again, you are projecting your thoughts, you are free to impute as much as you wish to.

I am willing to say I know very little, I could also say that, even if I was the most knowledgable man on this planet.

Our potential in mind and science expands when we stop giving limits.

Regards Tony

 

[ManSinha]

God Supported Moses with 9 signs as miracles and they are against Nature

Moses is a fictional character as is his god - so the question of one performing miracles for the other simply does not arise

 

[Baroodi]

Moses is a fictional character as is his god - so the question of one performing miracles for the other simply does not arise

this is undeniable history dear

 

[ManSinha]

this is undeniable history dear

It is myth - not history

 

[Baroodi]

It is myth - not history

Some humans believe in every word in history thousands of years back before Jesus but deny every thing documented pertaining to prophets. Denial sometimes is a psychological reactions dismissing shear frank facts

 

[ManSinha]

Some humans believe in every word in history thousands of years back before Jesus but deny every thing documented pertaining to prophets. Denial sometimes is a psychological reactions dismissing shear frank facts

That may very well be true - but as I did some (internet based) research - it would seem that there is evidence of the Pharaohs that lived in Moses' time but curiously enough - none other than the holy books that actually point to such a being existing. Be that as it may......

 

[IndigoChild5559]

It is myth - not history

It is neither. One can accept the Jewish texts as dubious historical documents (or as valid historical documents) that are simply not yet confirmed by other historical documets. Remember that the absence of proof doesn't not automatically exclude.

For ages, scholars simply assumed that the Iliad was complete and total myth. Then the city of Troy was found. Now they have to try and parse legend from history.

 

[ManSinha]

It is neither. One can accept the Jewish texts as dubious historical documents (or as valid historical documents) that are simply no yet confirmed by other historical documets. Remember that the absence of proof doesn't not automatically exclude.

For ages, scholars simply assumed that the Iliad was complete and total myth. Then the city of Troy was found. Now they have to try and parse legend from history.

Fair enough - I was going by the accounts and records of archeological findings from the time of the Pharaoh that Moses interacted with - there are relics from that time period but no physical evidence of Moses or of an actual exodus of millions of people (itself believed to be an exaggeration) to be found - but I am merely in this to broaden my own knowledge - I shall keep looking

By the way the same was said of Lord Krishna - until recently the submerged city of Dwarka was found off of the coast of India - legend has it that the city submerged once Krishna ended his time on earth. So - does the discovery of the submerged city mean that its most famous denizen existed at one time? Who knows? Food for thought though

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Fair enough - I was going by the accounts and records of archeological findings from the time of the Pharaoh that Moses interacted with - there are relics from that time period but no physical evidence of Moses or of an actual exodus of millions of people (itself believed to be an exaggeration) to be found - but I am merely in this to broaden my own knowledge - I shall keep looking

By the way the same was said of Lord Krishna - until recently the submerged city of Dwarka was found in India - legend has it that the city submerged once Krishna ended his time on earth.

I personally can't see how such an elaborate and detailed account doesn't have some historical basis, although it is probably embellished by history.

For me, though, the historicity is irrelevant. The tale of the Exodus tells me who I am / who Israel is and who is our God. That's what matters.

 

[Baroodi]

That may very well be true - but as I did some (internet based) research - it would seem that there is evidence of the Pharaohs that lived in Moses' time but curiously enough - none other than the holy books that actually point to such a being existing. Be that as it may......

That is right. Of all messengers, the only messenger with relics available now is the prophet of Islam (his grave, his speeches and his book are the most prominent 3 examples). This in itself carries a message to the world. Islam is the eternal religion. Pharaoh body was saved after all his army was drowned in the sea in purpose. This purpose was mentioned in Quran (Today We will save your cadaver so that you will be a sign for those who are after you). Pharaoh body is still available in Cairo museum.

 

[ManSinha]

That is right. Of all messengers, the only messenger with relics available now is the prophet of Islam (his grave, his speeches and his book are the most prominent 3 examples). This in itself carries a message to the world. Islam is the eternal religion. Pharaoh body was saved after all his army was drowned in the sea in purpose. This purpose was mentioned in Quran (Today We will save your cadaver so that you will be a sign for those who are after you). Pharaoh body is still available in Cairo museum.

Actually @Baroodi - both the Sikh and Baha'i faiths got you beat or equalled on that one - the Qu'ran was not written in Muhammad's time - the SGGS was - twice over.

And the final resting place of Guru Gobind Singh is well known -

So - those claims are beaten hollow - next?

 

[paarsurrey]

Is it true?

One may like to read my post #52 in another thread that is also very relevant here:

Vinayaka said:↑
Yes indeed. When you believe things such as copper will change to gold over time, and insist that that is science, yes, Fort Knox we have a problem.

paarsurrey said:
"When you believe things such as copper will change to gold over time, and insist that that is science, yes,"
that points to the fallibility of Bahaullah. Right, please?

Regards

 

[shunyadragon]

Is it true?

One may like to read my post #52 in another thread that is also very relevant here:

Vinayaka said:↑
Yes indeed. When you believe things such as copper will change to gold over time, and insist that that is science, yes, Fort Knox we have a problem.

paarsurrey said:
"When you believe things such as copper will change to gold over time, and insist that that is science, yes,"
that points to the fallibility of Baha'u'llah. Right, please?

Regards

First, the intent of the citation your splitting frog hairs over in the context it is not necessarily a literal statement but may be a possible analogy that anything is possible, but also may refer to transmutation of elements as science knows now. Have you read the posts that explain the whole context and the possible interpretations.

You are well known reputation for trying to find rabbits in Cambrian rocks to disprove the Baha'i Faith, and not trying to understand the religions and their beliefs like your fool's errand thread on where Jesus was born and why he was called Jesus of Nazareth.

 

[shunyadragon]

'We' can debunk your prophet any time 'we' want to. Just because you can't doesn't mean 'we' can't.

It depends on what your agenda. We can debunk your beliefs any time 'we' want to if that is the agenda 'we' choose to take.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Is it true?

One may like to read my post #52 in another thread that is also very relevant here:

Vinayaka said:↑
Yes indeed. When you believe things such as copper will change to gold over time, and insist that that is science, yes, Fort Knox we have a problem.

paarsurrey said:
"When you believe things such as copper will change to gold over time, and insist that that is science, yes,"
that points to the fallibility of Bahaullah. Right, please?

Regards

If you really believe in God then you believe He also can do anything. I think that although this was not the meaning still all Baha’u’llah is saying really is that God’s Hands are not tied which you are trying to infer that God’s Hands are tied so I question whether you really believe in God or not and if you do is not God able to easily perform anything He so desires?

If God is able to do whatever He pleases then Baha’u’llah is correct and His answer infallible.

 

[danieldemol]

Is it true?

One may like to read my post #52 in another thread that is also very relevant here:

Vinayaka said:↑
Yes indeed. When you believe things such as copper will change to gold over time, and insist that that is science, yes, Fort Knox we have a problem.

paarsurrey said:
"When you believe things such as copper will change to gold over time, and insist that that is science, yes,"
that points to the fallibility of Bahaullah. Right, please?

Regards

As a liberal I say Baha’u’llah, Muhammad and Mirza Ghulam Ahmad were all fallible humans to varying degrees.

Speaking of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, did you know that he tried to cure a person with fever by butchering a rooster and tying it to the sick person’s head?1
1 https://www.alislam.org/urdu/pdf/Seerat-ul-Mahdi-Vol-1.pdf quotation 511 pg 522

 

[Audie]

If you really believe in God then you believe He also can do anything. I think that although this was not the meaning still all Baha’u’llah is saying really is that God’s Hands are not tied which you are trying to infer that God’s Hands are tied so I question whether you really believe in God or not and if you do is not God able to easily perform anything He so desires?

If God is able to do whatever He pleases then Baha’u’llah is correct and His answer infallible.

Can do and did do are not the same thing.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Can do and did do are not the same thing.

Yes there’s a world of difference.