Is Satan an Atheist or believes in God?

[Link]

Salam

Everyone assumes he believes in God but is disobeying, and hence his disbelief is due not being submissive, but I find opposite proof to this in Quran. He does not believe in God and I've tried to show the way he talks to God is sarcasm to Ahlulbayt about the God as if talking to God that they believe, he is talking to the veils, in a sarcastic way as if the voice utter through them is not God but definitely a falsehood.

Today, I was rereading tuhuf al-Uqool, and in it I found:

Harun asked the Imam (7th Imam) about the first one who apostatized and became an atheist. The Imam (peace be upon him) answered:

The first one who apostatized and became an atheist in the heavens was Eblis the cursed. He showed arrogance and took pride in himself against Adam (peace be upon him) the choice and confidant of God. The cursed said - as it is mentioned in the Quran-:

I am better than Adam, for You have created me out of fire and Adam out of clay. [309]

Thus, he rejected the Lord’s orders and became atheist. His offspring inherited atheism from him.

Harun wondered whether Eblis has offspring. The Imam (peace be upon him) answered:

Eblis has offspring. Listen to God’s saying:

When We told the angels to prostrate before Adam they all obeyed except Eblis. He was a jinn and he sinned against the command of his Lord. Why do you (people) obey him and his offspring instead of Me, even though they are your enemies? How terrible will be the recompense that the wrong doers will receive! I did not call (the unjust) to witness the creation of the heavens and earth nor to witness their own creation nor did I want to be helped by those who lead people astray. [310]

They mislead the offspring of Adam through their false vanities and lies. Meanwhile, they declare that there is no god but Allah. God describes them in His following saying:

If you ask them, "Who has created the heavens and the earth," they will certainly say, "God has created them." Say, "It is only God who deserves all praise, but most of them do not know." [311]

This means that they declare so only with their tongues because they used to say so as one of their customs. He who does not believe, even if he declares with the tongue, will be suspicious, envious, and resistant.

 

[viole]

Thus, he rejected the Lord’s orders and became atheist. His offspring inherited atheism from him.

Did he know those orders came from God?

ciao

- viole

 

[Link]

Did he know those orders came from God?

ciao

- viole

Deep inside, he knows, but has deceived himself that God as portrayed by the highest signs and light is not real. He hence, is accusing Ahlulbayt (a) power of being derived from themselves, and disbelieves in their position as God's representatives and has denied the sustainer and attributed them power as if they attained it on their own.

 

[Link]

It's actually very important to see how Iblis became an Atheist with respect to God's light and highest signs.

 

[Nakosis]

Salam

Everyone assumes he believes in God but is disobeying, and hence his disbelief is due not being submissive, but I find opposite proof to this in Quran. He does not believe in God and I've tried to show the way he talks to God is sarcasm to Ahlulbayt about the God as if talking to God that they believe, he is talking to the veils, in a sarcastic way as if the voice utter through them is not God but definitely a falsehood.

Today, I was rereading tuhuf al-Uqool, and in it I found:

Harun asked the Imam (7th Imam) about the first one who apostatized and became an atheist. The Imam (peace be upon him) answered:

The first one who apostatized and became an atheist in the heavens was Eblis the cursed. He showed arrogance and took pride in himself against Adam (peace be upon him) the choice and confidant of God. The cursed said - as it is mentioned in the Quran-:

I am better than Adam, for You have created me out of fire and Adam out of clay. [309]

Thus, he rejected the Lord’s orders and became atheist. His offspring inherited atheism from him.

Harun wondered whether Eblis has offspring. The Imam (peace be upon him) answered:

Eblis has offspring. Listen to God’s saying:

When We told the angels to prostrate before Adam they all obeyed except Eblis. He was a jinn and he sinned against the command of his Lord. Why do you (people) obey him and his offspring instead of Me, even though they are your enemies? How terrible will be the recompense that the wrong doers will receive! I did not call (the unjust) to witness the creation of the heavens and earth nor to witness their own creation nor did I want to be helped by those who lead people astray. [310]

They mislead the offspring of Adam through their false vanities and lies. Meanwhile, they declare that there is no god but Allah. God describes them in His following saying:

If you ask them, "Who has created the heavens and the earth," they will certainly say, "God has created them." Say, "It is only God who deserves all praise, but most of them do not know." [311]

This means that they declare so only with their tongues because they used to say so as one of their customs. He who does not believe, even if he declares with the tongue, will be suspicious, envious, and resistant.

Interesting, do you accept the reality of this view?
That an atheist sits in a position of arrogance?

 

[viole]

Deep inside, he knows, but has deceived himself that God as portrayed by the highest signs and light is not real. He hence, is accusing Ahlulbayt (a) power of being derived from themselves, and disbelieves in their position as God's representatives and has denied the sustainer and attributed them power as if they attained it on their own.

If he knows, then he is not an atheist. He is just plain stupid, to believe to win against an almighty being. Or simply in denial.

cio

- viole

 

[an anarchist]

Everyone assumes he believes in God but is disobeying, and hence his disbelief is due not being submissive

My belief is that Satan believes that he can indefinitely prevent the Day of Judgement. As long as he can prevent it from occurring, Satan will masquerade as king of the material universe. Satan believes his power to be on par with God, so I would say in some sense he is an atheist. As He does not believe in God’s power

 

[Link]

If he knows, then he is not an atheist. He is just plain stupid, to believe to win against an almighty being. Or simply in denial.

cio

- viole

Pharaoh deep inside knew Moses miracles were true but still disbelieved. There is something called cognitive dissonance. He deep inside knows but has deceived himself otherwise.

 

[viole]

Pharaoh deep inside knew Moses miracles were true but still disbelieved. There is something called cognitive dissonance. He deep inside knows but has deceived himself otherwise.

Ok, but then he could be called atheist as well as theist. I would simply call them “confused”. Real atheists do not suffer from that cognitive dissonance, usually.

ciao

- viole

 

[Link]

My belief is that Satan believes that he can indefinitely prevent the Day of Judgement. As long as he can prevent it from occurring, Satan will masquerade as king of the material universe. Satan believes his power to be on par with God, so I would say in some sense he is an atheist. As He does not believe in God’s power

He fears the Prophets and Messengers and Guides and Angels, but yes, you are right, he is hoping to overthrow the order of the heavens and earth and wants to get help from humans and get a champion in which he will fuse with him as his companion (Qareen) and together will be able to overthrow the stars and lights of heaven and their power and authority.

He has deceived himself as a champion to free human and Jinn from what he deems to be a false authority and deception on part of Ahlulbayts of the past to the present, and wishes to get help from sorcerers and Jinn to maximize power.

You are correct sir.

 

[Link]

Ok, but then he could be called atheist as well as theist. Real atheists do not suffer from that cognitive dissonance, usually.

ciao

- viole

So you tell yourself....

 

[viole]

So you tell yourself....

Yes. I also tell myself that there is no garden fairy, as you, I expect. Among other things.

ciao

- viole

 

[Link]

Yes. I also tell myself that there is no garden fairy. Among other things.

ciao

- viole

Yet both God and Fairies (Jinn) exist.

 

[viole]

Yet both God and Fairies (Jinn) exist.

So, you tell yourself.

ciao

- viole

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

Pharaoh deep inside knew Moses miracles were true but still disbelieved.

Per the myth, the god of Abraham hardened Pharaoh's heart for him. It was not a matter of disbelief on part of the Pharaoh, but Abraham's god subjecting everyone in Egypt to suffering and plagues to prove a petty point.

To the topic, if your version of Satan is holding conversations with your god then he is not and cannot be an Atheist. Atheists do not believe that any god exists, not that they lack faith in them in the same manner I have faith that my boss will honor my days off.

Yet both God and Fairies (Jinn) exist.

The Fae Courts are not Jinn, or anything like them.

 

[Link]

So, you tell yourself.

ciao

- viole

That was good, I give you that.

 

[Link]

Per the myth, the god of Abraham hardened Pharaoh's heart for him. It was not a matter of disbelief on part of the Pharaoh, but Abraham's god subjecting everyone in Egypt to suffering and plagues to prove a petty point.

To the topic, if your version of Satan is holding conversations with your god then he is not and cannot be an Atheist. Atheists do not believe that any god exists, not that they lack faith in them in the same manner I have faith that my boss will honor my days off.


The Fae Courts are not Jinn, or anything like them.

No one has access to God directly, Ahlulbayt (a) trust the voice of God in them but they and the Prophets and chosen close Angels alone understand how God speaks. We believe in God's signs in ourselves and horizons, but this takes faith in unseen signs of God. Iblis disbelieves in the voice of God, he believes Ahlulbayt make it all up and Angels descending from the highest heaven are either misleading or been deceived. I hope you understand better now.

 

[Mock Turtle]

All very odd isn't it, when the arrogance accusation could be made as to virtually any belief system. Perhaps depends upon whether one is looking out of the window or towards a mirror.

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

No one has access to God directly

Even still, if your "Satan" is speaking to your god, he is not - by definition - an Atheist. Atheist is a human stance, belief, and perception. Not one of spirits and deities.

 

[Link]

Even still, if your "Satan" is speaking to your god, he is not - by definition - an Atheist. Atheist is a human stance, belief, and perception. Not one of spirits and deities.

He is speaking to God, but does not believe that God exists. It's sarcasm. He is mocking the veils of light by which he is spoken to by God in that dialogue.