Is Satan an Atheist or believes in God?

[night912]

Deep inside, he knows, but has deceived himself that God as portrayed by the highest signs and light is not real. He hence, is accusing Ahlulbayt (a) power of being derived from themselves, and disbelieves in their position as God's representatives and has denied the sustainer and attributed them power as if they attained it on their own.

Then you are wrong, he wasn't an atheist. Instead, he was just an arrogant theist who thought that he knew more than everyone else and decided to challenged his own god.

Damn those arrogant theists. They always think they know more than everyone else. It's because of this arrogance that they think they even know all those things that they themselves caimed as being unknown attributes of God.

If any theists thinks that I'm referring to them, then read this:

Spoiler: Read

So you finally admit that you are an arrogant theist and thought that I was talking about you. Well, now you can go tell everyone that you are correct about two things that you thought were true.

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

Haha. Do you even know how pathetic you are my friend?

Not your friend, at all, and certainly nowhere near as such as digging a hole deeper when there is visual evidence contrary to the claim. You should have just stopped digging a day or so ago.

 

[firedragon]

Not your friend, at all,

Oh thank god. Apologies. I made a huge mistake.

and certainly nowhere near as such as digging a hole deeper when there is visual evidence contrary to the claim.

Google again.

You should have just stopped digging a day or so ago.

Mate. this is an Internet forum, so there is no point pretending to be a scholar in everything. You won't get that dollar.

All you have done so far is "make things up", and think everyone else is just like you.

Pali. Tomorrow, you will go somewhere and pretend the same with some other language.

 

[Link]

Iblis swore by God when he didn't even believe in God. It didn't click in Adam's (a) mind someone would use God like that because of Adam's (a) own truthful nature. At the same time, Adam (a), if he didn't eat of the tree (envy their station) - there would be no deviance and evil would be subdued. But when the human leader envied the chosen status of the exalted ones (translated as "gods" in the Bible) and doubted the veils himself - he became ashamed and as well as the consequences of his sin, people witnessing in the unseen realm, began to take sides of Iblis as well (before being born) so God decided to make a world of sufferings, death, and trials whence some of us are enemies to each other and thereby there would be more chance of reforming us and keeping us from following the path Iblis.

While Adam (a) doubted the veils, he believed in God, but thought Iblis worshiped and believed in a different God that wanted Adam (a) to compete and take the highest position. He thought he can attain their rank through competition and when he envied their station, he fell from grace.

Ultimately, it was a confusing matter for him, but if he held on to the love of Ahlulbayt (a), he would be firmly on the right path and this world would not be needed to come.

According to tafsir Hassan Al-Askari (a), when he turned to God through them though, God accepted his repentance and restored him to his chosen status. This means, because Adam (a) in a way forgot God and was not insolent arrogantly and was not stubborn in his sin, his chosen status was not all diminished by Iblis' lies.

Adam (a) was able to realize he left the realm of light and started to cover himself with "leaves" of the garden, but Iblis, when he was kicked out the realm, took on the living form of ignorance and believes he is right.

So while Adam (a) believes in truthfulness, lying and deception is fair game for Iblis.
While Adam (a) wants to have honor and dignity in sexual activity - Iblis believes there is nothing wrong with all sexual acts and nothing to be ashamed of in all these acts.

Iblis understanding of moral light is deviated, but has become so ignorant he believes he is correct.

He witnesses the power of Prophets (a) and chosen Guides (a) but denies the source of their power and accuses it to be just sorcery inherited from one person to another.

The devils witness the sky and power of Angels therein and chosen lights (the visited family), but still disbelieve in all that, and are war with the order of the universe. The devils believe they are guided and are our to be our guardian Angels, but they act to envy of God's chosen, but tell and deceive themselves they are guided and good.

 

[Link]

There is one to one relationship with believing in signs of God and God, the latter belief can't be real without recognition of the signs of God.

 

[Link]

This is the continuation of this thread: What does Iblis believe about miracles, divine books and power in the Prophets? | Religious Forums into branches of follow up potential topics.

 

[KWED]

Everyone assumes he believes in God , but I find opposite proof to this in Quran. He does not believe in God

I am better than Adam, for You have created me out of fire and Adam out of clay. [309]
Thus, he rejected the Lord’s orders and became atheist.

You claim that satan is an atheist, ie. he rejects the existence of gods - but then you quote satan addressing god.
Your argument is internally contradictory.

If you mean "does satan reject god's authority?", then yes, that is clearly true. But it is equally true that he also accepts that god exists.

 

[Link]

You claim that satan is an atheist, ie. he rejects the existence of gods - but then you quote satan addressing god.
Your argument is internally contradictory.

If you mean "does satan reject god's authority?", then yes, that is clearly true. But it is equally true that he also accepts that god exists.

Re-read what I stated.

 

[Link]

Salam

قُلْ يَوْمَ الْفَتْحِ لَا يَنْفَعُ الَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا إِيمَانُهُمْ وَلَا هُمْ يُنْظَرُونَ | Say, ‘On the day of judgement their [newly found] faith will not avail the faithless, nor will they be granted any respite.’ | As-Sajda : 29

This shows faith in God and actions in submission are two different things. Now if we have faith in God like everyone will have on the day of judgment, we will submit to God and act to his commands. In this sense faith and good deeds go together, if you aren't doing good you are probably deceiving yourself about believing in God. Avoiding big sins is a necessary trait of faith.

However, the disbelievers are not earning goodness, they submit on that day, but what I'm trying to say, the faith is not luminous for disbelievers, but they are forced to accept the proofs of God on that day.

But the Quran calls Iblis a disbeliever too so it can't be the case he knows reality like the disbelievers will have faith on day of judgment.

Iblis is a gnostic who disbelieves in the order of the universe. This is the reality, he probably sees Ahlulbayt as deluded or that God is a Jinn like him but with much more power.

Of course, he fears the Lord of the worlds and sees this as as the Creator, but sees the Creator not as being correct. This is only possible if he doesn't believe in God truly as we do.

 

[bobhikes]

Salam

Everyone assumes he believes in God but is disobeying, and hence his disbelief is due not being submissive, but I find opposite proof to this in Quran. He does not believe in God and I've tried to show the way he talks to God is sarcasm to Ahlulbayt about the God as if talking to God that they believe, he is talking to the veils, in a sarcastic way as if the voice utter through them is not God but definitely a falsehood.

Today, I was rereading tuhuf al-Uqool, and in it I found:

Harun asked the Imam (7th Imam) about the first one who apostatized and became an atheist. The Imam (peace be upon him) answered:

The first one who apostatized and became an atheist in the heavens was Eblis the cursed. He showed arrogance and took pride in himself against Adam (peace be upon him) the choice and confidant of God. The cursed said - as it is mentioned in the Quran-:

I am better than Adam, for You have created me out of fire and Adam out of clay. [309]

Thus, he rejected the Lord’s orders and became atheist. His offspring inherited atheism from him.

Harun wondered whether Eblis has offspring. The Imam (peace be upon him) answered:

Eblis has offspring. Listen to God’s saying:

When We told the angels to prostrate before Adam they all obeyed except Eblis. He was a jinn and he sinned against the command of his Lord. Why do you (people) obey him and his offspring instead of Me, even though they are your enemies? How terrible will be the recompense that the wrong doers will receive! I did not call (the unjust) to witness the creation of the heavens and earth nor to witness their own creation nor did I want to be helped by those who lead people astray. [310]

They mislead the offspring of Adam through their false vanities and lies. Meanwhile, they declare that there is no god but Allah. God describes them in His following saying:

If you ask them, "Who has created the heavens and the earth," they will certainly say, "God has created them." Say, "It is only God who deserves all praise, but most of them do not know." [311]

This means that they declare so only with their tongues because they used to say so as one of their customs. He who does not believe, even if he declares with the tongue, will be suspicious, envious, and resistant.

In my opinion you have to believe that there is something to be able to oppose it. Satan has to believe God is something but it's probably a safe bet that Satan doesn't believe that it's an all powerful God.

 

[Link]

In my opinion you have to believe that there is something to be able to oppose it. Satan has to believe God is something but it's probably a safe bet that Satan doesn't believe that it's an all powerful God.

This is what I'm saying is the case. He sees himself as relatively an equal or better than God. He sees himself as a lot less powerful though.