Is Satan capable of good?

[Colt]

But it can certainly be blamed for sitting by during every rape and torture of a child, right? I mean, most people would seek to stop this horror. But apparently our morality is superior to this god.

Humans are supposed to deal with crime and punishment in the material world.

 

[Firenze]

God can't do anything right it seems.
When God judges evil people by killing them that makes God evil.
When God does not judge evil people and give them what they deserve, that makes God evil.
Let's face it, many believe that God is evil because there is evil in the world.
I trust that God is good and is bringing history to an end when all will be revealed and all will be judged fairly and all the evil in this world will be no more except in an ever diminishing memory of the past.
We will learn then just how evil we humans are and that it is just God's grace and mercy that have allowed us to live on and even called us back to Him.
And when I say that humans are evil I mean that even the best of us have things in us that are the same as the things in a child rapist and murderer.

But your god hasn't done squat about 'evil people' in some 3000 years. Is it on vacation? It didn't even save its own chosen people from genocide. What use is a god that only 'appears' to 5000 year old barbarians and then is completely absent from then on?

 

[Firenze]

Humans are supposed to deal with crime and punishment in the material world.

And yet your bible says "Ask anything in my name and it will be given you..." Was Jesus lying, or is this god simply an incompetent buffoon? Some 1000 children die of cancer every single day - their anguished, terrified prayers completely ignored - as have been millions and billions of desperate prayers of parents, families, friends, and parishioners of rape and murder victims. One of the common excuses I hear for ignoring the prayers of children about to be raped and murdered is that - "Well, god is bringing children to his lap" - like its some kind of Michael Jackson needing kids to play with. Sorry, but to worship and fear a god whose morality is inferior to most decent people is a sign of mental illness.

 

[Colt]

And yet your bible says "Ask anything in my name and it will be given you..." Was Jesus lying, or is this god simply an incompetent buffoon? Some 1000 children die of cancer every single day - their anguished, terrified prayers completely ignored - as have been millions and billions of desperate prayers of parents, families, friends, and parishioners of rape and murder victims. One of the common excuses I hear for ignoring the prayers of children about to be raped and murdered is that - "Well, god is bringing children to his lap" - like its some kind of Michael Jackson needing kids to play with. Sorry, but to worship and fear a god whose morality is inferior to most decent people is a sign of mental illness.

Free will comes with personal and group responsibility. If God intervened in every situation to restrict freedom of will then humans would not really be free. What you want is a Santa Clause!

Ask in the name of Jesus doesn't mean that the answer will be yes.

 

[Firenze]

Free will comes with personal and group responsibility. If God intervened in every situation to restrict freedom of will then humans would not really be free. What you want is a Santa Clause!

Ask in the name of Jesus doesn't mean that the answer will be yes

It doesn't need to intervene in even a billionth of 'every situation'. It doesn't need to make sure Hannah in Bogalusa wins $50 on her scratcher ticket - even though Hannah will insist that it did. How about just not letting children be tortured, raped, and murdered?

And the verse doesn't say "Ask anything in my name and I'll think about it." It says "Ask and it WILL BE GIVEN." Again, was that a lie?

 

[Colt]

It doesn't need to intervene in even a billionth of 'every situation'. It doesn't need to make sure Hannah in Bogalusa wins $50 on her scratcher ticket - even though Hannah will insist that it did. How about just not letting children be tortured, raped, and murdered?

And the verse doesn't say "Ask anything in my name and I'll think about it." It says "Ask and it WILL BE GIVEN." Again, was that a lie?

Hannah may think God gave her good luck but that doesn't mean its true.

* Why just some block for rape and torture???
* What about the millions of kids murdered in abortions?
* What about a child who drowns?
* Baseball hits a kid?
* Broken arm?
* Stomach ach?
* Self-inflected gunshot wound?
* Broken leg?
* Toothache?
* Sprained ancle?

 

[Firenze]

Hannah may think God gave her good luck but that doesn't mean its true.

* Why just some block for rape and torture???
* What about the millions of kids murdered in abortions?
* What about a child who drowns?
* Baseball hits a kid?
* Broken arm?
* Stomach ach?
* Self-inflected gunshot wound?
* Broken leg?
* Toothache?
* Sprained ancle?

Um... because a toothache cannot be even remotely compared to the suffering and loss of a child to rape, torture and murder? Are you kidding?? What a pathetic strawman. Try to focus. Why does your god sit back eating popcorn while children are raped and killed? 'Because free will' is a childs answer.

 

[Colt]

Um... because a toothache cannot be even remotely compared to the suffering and loss of a child to rape, torture and murder? Are you kidding?? What a pathetic strawman. Try to focus. Why does your god sit back eating popcorn while children are raped and killed? 'Because free will' is a childs answer.

Because of free will, the same free will that allows you to think that you can run the universe better than God. Yours is a child's excuse for rejecting God! And frankly, if there weren't wimpy Leftist judges and criminal advocates getting sex offenders out of jail then we wouldn't have as many child rapist running lose! I think sex offenders should be shot by firing squad!

 

[Sargonski]

God allowing people to be bad is not the same as God wanting to do bad things. I don't think God can be blamed for the things people do.

I did not say God can be blamed for your decision to do bad things . .. but, yes .. God creating "Bad" what ever bad is .. means that God wishes at least some to do bad things .. not necessarily all.

It is a logical imperative .. if God didn't want bad things to happen .. she could just stop them from happening. It is like the Scientist doing an experiment .. the rule is that you do not intervene in the experiment .. otherwise what is the point of doing the experiment.

So .. every once in awhile God checks in on this Earth experiment to see how things are going .. Sure you can blame God for not intervening .. but it humanities own fault for getting itself into what ever predicament they have .. We are to blame for our lot .. not God .. other than in the act of Creation.

Does this mean God is not 100% Good ... YES .. a resounding YES YES YES .. and your attempt to label and put God into a box .. has failed.

 

[Link]

It's because God must remain hidden to a degree, that evil occurs. The consequences if he fully manifests himself when humans are not ready are huge.

I've discussed this before, but really God has been between a rock and a hard place on guiding his creation.

 

[Firenze]

Because of free will, the same free will that allows you to think that you can run the universe better than God. Yours is a child's excuse for rejecting God! And frankly, if there weren't wimpy Leftist judges and criminal advocates getting sex offenders out of jail then we wouldn't have as many child rapist running lose! I think sex offenders should be shot by firing squad!

So, you have no excuse for why your god sits by while children are raped and murdered. Your retreat is duly noted.

 

[Colt]

So, you have no excuse for why your god sits by while children are raped and murdered. Your retreat is duly noted.

It's not an excuse, God doesn't intervene in your free will and the governing of the affairs of the world. That IS the answer to your excuse! God doesn't even force you to worship him. There isn't even a right to life on this world!

 

[Firenze]

It's not an excuse, God doesn't intervene in your free will and the governing of the affairs of the world. That IS the answer to your excuse! God doesn't even force you to worship him. There isn't even a right to life on this world!

And that's the exact answer someone who invented a god could give. "Yeah, it just won't intervene.... anymore.... (even though it had no problem intervening hundreds of times, thousands of years ago.) But... heh.... that doesn't mean it doesn't exist!" Too funny.

 

[Colt]

And that's the exact answer someone who invented a god could give. "Yeah, it just won't intervene.... anymore.... (even though it had no problem intervening hundreds of times, thousands of years ago.) But... heh.... that doesn't mean it doesn't exist!" Too funny.

The same free will that allowed Holy men to write nationalist religious literature wherein they claimed God said do this and that. Its largely a god created in the image of those who write the scripture books.

Jesus of Nazareth lived the full life of the mortal experience, even submitting to a horrible death all that God might get a little closer to the experience of his own created beings. So, sit at the foot of the cross in self-pity, look up with blood dripping in your eyes and whine about how hard your life is!

 

[Firenze]

The same free will that allowed Holy men to write nationalist religious literature wherein they claimed God said do this and that. Its largely a god created in the image of those who write the scripture books.

Jesus of Nazareth lived the full life of the mortal experience, even submitting to a horrible death all that God might get a little closer to the experience of his own created beings. So, sit at the foot of the cross in self-pity, look up with blood dripping in your eyes and whine about how hard your life is!

Yeah, I'm not likely to heed the preaching of someone who misquotes Jesus, admits that this god was created by ignorant, barbaric men, and thinks his god is so limited that it could only experience his own beings with a blood sacrifice that resulted in a bad 3 day weekend. But yes, I'll let those parents of children dead by rape and cancer know that they should quit whining - and obviously, quit praying.....

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

Is Satan capable of doing something that ends up good, and is God capable of doing something that results in bad?

Yup

 

[viole]

Is Satan capable of doing something that ends up good, and is God capable of doing something that results in bad?

Satan is underrated. I personally think he is morally superior to God.

Can you name me something that he has ever done wrong?

Ciao

- viole

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

According to the bible, God is responsible for all death. So killing = death. No killing by God means no one ever dies. Since not killing is good, the worst of the worst criminals are permitted to live forever. Got it.



This is what you said: "The majority of these murders were not against criminal but against people who did not follow a blood thirsty, jealous god."

That is false. It's not what is written in the story.



This is what you said: "Those figures are taken directly from the bible".

The actual source appears to be here. A blog. Wow, super reliable. Did you check any of the numbes or did you just believe it?

Dwindling In Unbelief

An Unbeliever's thoughts about the Bible, Quran and the Book of Mormon

dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com

​

​

​

Then they give a link to another blog post which supposedly gives the numbers.

Dwindling In Unbelief

An Unbeliever's thoughts about the Bible, Quran and the Book of Mormon

dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com

​

​

Note: Its not the bible, as you said. It includes Apocrypha.

Now, let's pick one from the list and see if it's true what you said: "The majority of these murders were not against criminal but against people who did not follow a blood thirsty, jealous god."

The source counts 100,000 killed in 1 Kings 20:29. Why were they killed? Because they attacked and went after the women and the children.

20:1​

ובן־הדד מלך־ארם קבץ את־כל־חילו ושלשים ושנים מלך אתו וסוס ורכב ויעל ויצר על־שמרון וילחם בה׃​

And Ben-Hadad the king of Aram gathered all his army together; and there were thirty two kings with him, and horses, and chariots; and he went up and besieged Samaria, and fought against it.​

​

20:2​

וישלח מלאכים אל־אחאב מלך־ישראל העירה׃​

And he sent messengers to Ahab king of Israel to the city, and said to him, Thus said Ben-Hadad,​

​

20:3​

ויאמר לו כה אמר בן־הדד כספך וזהבך לי־הוא ונשיך ובניך הטובים לי־הם׃​

Your silver and your gold is mine; your wives also and your children, even the best, are mine.​

​

So, it's like I said. The story is being ignored.

So it’s okay if Israel does it but not pagans?

 

[dybmh]

So it’s okay if Israel does it but not pagans?

Hi! Does what?

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

No, not God. The Jewish nation, if attacked needs to defend itself

Conquest is not self defense.