And where exactly is this world you speak of. It certainly isnt this world.
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Is the Bible Credible?
- Thread starter Abstruse
- Start date
McBell
Unbound
So the number of people who follow a book is indication of much merit said book has?
kai
ragamuffin
and we need the bible to do that?
kai
ragamuffin
why would that be?
I don't mind religion as a set of beliefs, but what I personally find distasteful is when belief becomes dogma, then it's disseminated and disguised as the incontrovertible truth. Because it has a comfort factor I suppose...why would you want to share something with everyone that you think isn't true anyhow?
That is my only real problem with religion or beliefs. If believers or followers of a specific religion can accept that their beliefs may not be completely reasonable or explained by evidence and that it's based on faith, I have nothing more to say. I can accept beliefs driven by faith, that's subjective.
But Buddhism is very interesting, that it's skeptical, like science, you can believe it or not. There is no punishment for having doubts or not accepting something (unless you disregard a scientific-theory like newtons law of gravitation, maybe run under falling objects?
).Buddha declared, "Do not accept anything I say as true simply because I have said it. Instead, test it as you would gold to see if it is genuine or not. If, after examining my teachings, you find that they are true, put them in practice. But do not do so simply out of respect for me." I enjoy things that have me question or to be curious about life.
But where do we draw the line to where belief stops and truth begins? Should truth be constrained for the sake of peoples beliefs? Should beliefs be capable of hindering our best scientific-understanding of reality?
Shouldn't beliefs remain "beliefs", until proven otherwise?
Unity would be nice, but with all these different religions spreading their version of the truth, dividing everyone, how will we every find a middle-ground? If anything religion has created more intolerance than acceptance.
I would like to see a world where truth, reason, and curiosity are praised or exalted, with everyone striving towards advancing, increasing our knowledge of things that exist... contributing to the awareness/consciousness (if you will) of humanity.
Instead of misinformation, fantasy, beliefs, and imagination creating a sea of confusion and taking the role of reality.
TheKnight
Guardian of Life
Because I believe that the solution to the problem that causes not to have world peace is found in the Torah. God made this world imperfect, and then gave us the blueprints (the Torah) to complete the world in order that we would bring it to it's full completion. You cannot finish building the house without the blueprints.
The fact is, those who feel they have a monopoly on truth (whether it be among the religious or the areligious) are a large part of the problem.
ManTimeForgot
Temporally Challenged
Knight: I would counter that since you seem to agree that all faiths contain "potential" truth and that the basis for believing in one over another is a personal one, that the Torah must not be the sole source for creating such a world of peace and unity. I would posit that so long as we were all true to our selves (our own beliefs); while having sufficient humility (both intellectual and emotional) to allow for growth and acceptance of not knowing things & sufficient confidence in ourselves and our ideas that we need not feel threatened by others; that there is where the "world of peace and unity" is to be found.
Kai:
You are very nearly guilty of treading upon the utopian engineer's fallacy. Not everyone is able to fully utilize "advanced" institutions (philosophy, mysticism, science...). Some people need "training wheels." Some people could not care less about the internal consistency of their beliefs, so long as at the end of the day their beliefs make them feel comfortable and secure. To give this an analogy: Were you to take away a young child's (who is prone to night terrors) Teddy bear and not replace it with anything (or something less capable), then you have done wrong by the child. Some people do not "outgrow their Teddy bears," and using this same analogy some people who have "outgrown their Teddy bears" choose to keep them anyway because they recognize that they are better people with their "Teddy bear" than without.
Side Note: I do think Teddy bears are a good thing... (pretty funny comic by the way; some adult language)
MTF
Kai:
You are very nearly guilty of treading upon the utopian engineer's fallacy. Not everyone is able to fully utilize "advanced" institutions (philosophy, mysticism, science...). Some people need "training wheels." Some people could not care less about the internal consistency of their beliefs, so long as at the end of the day their beliefs make them feel comfortable and secure. To give this an analogy: Were you to take away a young child's (who is prone to night terrors) Teddy bear and not replace it with anything (or something less capable), then you have done wrong by the child. Some people do not "outgrow their Teddy bears," and using this same analogy some people who have "outgrown their Teddy bears" choose to keep them anyway because they recognize that they are better people with their "Teddy bear" than without.
Side Note: I do think Teddy bears are a good thing... (pretty funny comic by the way; some adult language)
MTF
TheKnight
Guardian of Life
I think that this too is probably the case. But then, being true to your own beliefs is Torah.
darkendless
Guardian of Asgaard
For a divinely inspired book, most bibles i've seen are pretty barbaric and do not so much as promote equality between everyone.
I thought God would have also mentioned how to deal with those damn evolutionists/scientists as well as that pestilence on the church called homosexuality
I thought God would have also mentioned how to deal with those damn evolutionists/scientists as well as that pestilence on the church called homosexuality
Autodidact
Intentionally Blank
You have credible reason to believe that your religion can give you a world of peace and unity?!? Is that what you're saying?
Autodidact
Intentionally Blank
Wait, I thought your religion had something to offer you in particular. You're saying that you believe that your religion can bring peace to the world? And you have sufficient reason to believe that? Uh, O.K. what is the reason that you believe that your particular religion can bring peace to the world?
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Autodidact
Intentionally Blank
And your sufficient reason to believe this story is...?
Autodidact
Intentionally Blank
You mean if my belief is that the Torah is the ancient Hebrew's best but extremely flawed attempt to record what they believed about their history and the world around them, being true to that belief is Torah? And if someone believes that Torah is a pile of baloney, then being true to that belief is Torah?
btw, what in Torah tells us to be true to our own beliefs. I get a lot of ordering us to believe that G-d is the one and only true God, and to follow His commandments, but not a lot of be-true-to-your-own belief. Often, people who are true to their own beliefs get smitten. That means killed.
LionDog1
Member
Yes, since it does have worth, and it is deserving in many of its teachings. Where do you think merit derives from?
LionDog1
Member
It does not teach a world of Peace and Unity, in fact it teaches the world will wax worse unto the end.
LionDog1
Member
Correct it is Torah! Torah is the way!
LionDog1
Member
te_lanus
Alien Hybrid
Hi LionDog
So Correct me if I'm wrong. If the number of people reading a book gives that book a certain merit. Can we say the same thing about Harry Potter:sarcastic.
For me Merit has more to do with the person reading it. I can read,for example, The Gospel of Thomas or the Gospel of Truth, and to me they have the same merit as any Christian Bible and Jewish Torah.