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It isn't so much about who is worthy but what happens to those who say, "Lord, Lord", are wrong and are sent to the only other existing place. That is why Jesus told us to Go and make disciples. He wants everyone to be saved. But, there is a problem...there are people who lie and convince the innocent and gullible that they are from God, that, somehow- against Jesus' own words, even- they have seen Jesus. And people flock to them. Then, once in its hard to leave. Have any of you seen Leah Rimini expose Scientology on A&E? After 30 years in there she woke up, left and is doing everything she can to show the world what Scientology really is. We were shocked that they do these things. Maybe more shocked that it is legal. But, Scientology is far from the only one that teaches these ... things.We all get things wrong, we are all fallible, and we are all sinners. So who apart from God can decide who is worthy.
Care to provide some proof? Be careful, the Devil does good things, too. But he does them to hurt God's people and keep them from heaven and God's love.IMO, in regards to the OP, yes, LDS is a Christian group.
Pros for Mormon being Christian:
- Professing of Belief in Jesus Christ
- Bible is quite important
Cons for Mormon being Christian:
- Additional scriptures (BoM, D&C, JS bible "translations") might not be accepted as part of the same storyline.
- Temple and its rituals that differ quite much from mainline Christianity, and resemble masonic stuff.
- Blood Atonement is somewhat contradictory to most views about JC's Atonement.
- A Man becoming a god, and by implication that there are countless other gods, might not fit the Monotheistic model.
- Ways of early revelation in Mormon church differ somewhat from what Prophets of old experienced.
- The claim that all other churches are fallen is somewhat dividing.
In the end it depends on what God said in His only word to mankind, the Bible. Feelings are never mentioned as a way to know God's truth in the Bible. But, facts are mentioned in both Testaments and a few times overall (that I've found). Yes, facts are important but living by feelings (without any clear facts) are a sure sign one is not a Christian.In the end it depends completely on one's definition of christianity, and how much "New stuff" can be accepted to be added to "common core" of Christian faith.
It isn't so much about who is worthy but what happens to those who say, "Lord, Lord", are wrong and are sent to the only other existing place. That is why Jesus told us to Go and make disciples. He wants everyone to be saved. But, there is a problem...there are people who lie and convince the innocent and gullible that they are from God, that, somehow- against Jesus' own words, even- they have seen Jesus. And people flock to them. Then, once in its hard to leave. Have any of you seen Leah Rimini expose Scientology on A&E? After 30 years in there she woke up, left and is doing everything she can to show the world what Scientology really is. We were shocked that they do these things. Maybe more shocked that it is legal. But, Scientology is far from the only one that teaches these ... things.
I can show where the LDS church told its members not to go to doctors but pray for healing and God would heal them. On a personal side, since I was falsely arrested, tortured and crippled by a Utah Highway Patrolman (I was innocent! Have blood tests to prove Utah cops are liars and corrupt) and caused to develop the most painful condition the world has ever known, I can say for an absolute fact that prayer does NOT cure or stop medical issues. I wonder how many LDS died back then as a result of 'obeying' that teaching?
That's quite an assumption, so can you provide one piece of evidence for this?In the end it depends on what God said in His only word to mankind, the Bible.
This is a laughably academic discussion anyway since only followers of the One True Church of Erotic Dancing Girls are going to heaven anyway. But carry on with your pathetic delusions, by all means.
Actually, you have judged us. But that's okay. God's not going to take your opinion of us into account anyway.They have a lot of things against them but I am not going to judge them, They will answer to God, not to me.
Mormons believe that Jesus Christ was "God" "in the beginning." He didn't attain Godhood at some point in His existance, like at His birth, His baptism or His resurrection. He was God when He created the earth, He was God when He walked the earth, and He is God today.Here are some teachings I have problem with:
--By obedience and Jesus attained to the pinnacle of intelligence which ranked Him as A God,,,
Yes, we believe that Michael aided Jesus in the Creation. So what?--Jesus was aided in the work of creation by Michael(or Adam), Enoch, Noah...Joseph Smith and others.
God is functionally omnipresent, and that's all the Bible ever speaks of Him as being.--God is not omnipresent.
Yes. We are created in His image.--God has a body of flesh and bones.
Yes, God knew exactly what was going to happen when He put Adam and Eve in the Garden and allowed the Serpent to tempt them. Adam didn't put one over on Him or do something to thwart His plan. God truly had our welfare and happiness in mind when He created this world and allowed us to come here. What an unselfish and loving Father in Heaven we have.--Adam fell that men might be and men are, that they might have joy.
Well, we shouldn't have to provide a Bible reference for the "beliefs" we don't believe (like that Jesus only became God at some point in His existence instead of always being God). And we don't have to provide a Bible reference for the other beliefs since we are not limited in our understanding to just one volume of scriptures.Not one of those beliefs do they proved a Bible reference.
Care to provide some proof? Be careful, the Devil does good things, too. But he does them to hurt God's people and keep them from heaven and God's love.
How about you fix your formatting first.
Actually, you have judged us. But that's okay. God's not going to take your opinion of us into account anyway.
Mormons believe that Jesus Christ was "God" "in the beginning." He didn't attain Godhood at some point in His existance, like at His birth, His baptism or His resurrection. He was God when He created the earth, He was God when He walked the earth, and He is God today.
Yes, we believe that Michael aided Jesus in the Creation. So what?
God is functionally omnipresent, and that's all the Bible ever speaks of Him as being.<<
There is no such thing in the Bible about "functionally omnipresent and God is 100% omnipresent. Jer 23:24 - CAn a man hide himself in hiding places so I do not see him?declares the Lord.. Do I not fill the heavens and the earth, declares the Lord?
Yes. We are created in His image.
My comment was that the "us" and "our" in that verse refers to Jesus and the Holy Spirit.
Yes, God knew exactly what was going to happen when He put Adam and Eve in the Garden and allowed the Serpent to tempt them. Adam didn't put one over on Him or do something to thwart His plan. God truly had our welfare and happiness in mind when He created this world and allowed us to come here. What an unselfish and loving Father in Heaven we have.
That is not what the BOM says, it says "Adam fell,that men might be and men are, that they might have joy.
]Well, we shouldn't have to provide a Bible reference for the "beliefs" we don't believe (like that Jesus only became God at some point in His existence instead of always being God). And we don't have to provide a Bible reference for the other beliefs since we are not limited in our understanding to just one volume of scriptures.
If you can't support what you believe from Scripture, what you belreve is worthless.
Our belief in Jesus Christ as the Son of God and the Savior of all who come to Him, acknowledging His great atoning sacrifice and promise to cleanse us from our sins, is the foundation upon which we live our lives. There is not one thing the Bible has to say about Jesus Christ that we do not accept as valid and true.Pros for Mormon being Christian:
Professing of Belief in Jesus Christ
Yes, Mormons hold the Bible in very high regard, as if clearly evident in the following sermon given on the subject by M. Russell Ballard, an Apostle in the LDS Church: The Miracle of the Holy Bible. In fact, in our adult Sunday School classes, we study it two years for every one year we study The Book of Mormon. It has been described as "foremost among the Standard Works of the Church."Bible is quite important
I'm going to address each of these individually, but I would like to know if you would care to provide any scriptural citations that would indicate that a Christian can not believe any of the following and still be considered a Christian?Cons for Mormon being Christian:
I'm not sure what, exactly, you mean by "storyline." The stories in The Book of Mormon, for instance, take place on an entirely different continent than those in the Bible do, and involve an entirely different group of people. But I wonder why this should really even matter, if, in fact, the book does testify of Jesus Christ. Do you know that in the Book of Mormon, Jesus is referred to by name 188 times. He is named as "Christ" in 398 instances! He is spoken of as our Savior, Messiah, or Redeemer 85 times, and as the Son of God 51 times. He is spoken of as "God" on numerous occasions, including a couple of times in which He and His Father are said to be "one God" (Ex: Mormon 7:7 "And he hath brought to pass the redemption of the world, whereby he that is found guiltless before him at the judgment day hath it given unto him to dwell in the presence of God in his kingdom, to sing ceaseless praises with the choirs above, unto the Father, and unto the Son, and unto the Holy Ghost, which are one God, in a state of happiness which hath no end.") And that's in 531 pages as compared to the Bible which is several times that long. He is testified of starting on page 2 and ending on page 531.Additional scriptures (BoM, D&C, JS bible "translations") might not be accepted as part of the same storyline.
There are some definitely similarities between the LDS temple endowment ceremony and some of the ceremonies in Free Masonry. Joseph Smith was briefly interested in Masonry, although he only attended about a half a dozen meetings. He chose to use some of masonry's symbols but incorporated them into the temple ceremony as learning tools. Symbols, of course, can mean anything those using them determine that they're going to mean. For instance, long before Hitler ever adapted the swastika as a symbol of the Nazi party, the symbol was used to represent a great many other ideologies. Since I am not a mason and have never witnessed a masonic ceremony, I believe it would be out of line and inappropriate to try to second guess the meanings the masons gave to certain symbols. I know what they represent in Mormonism, but other than that they have been used before Joseph Smith used them, I really have no further comment.Temple and its rituals that differ quite much from mainline Christianity, and resemble masonic stuff.
Mormons would whole-heartedly agree with this statement. Brigham Young could be quite a "hellfire and damnation preacher when he wanted to, and he clearly liked to put the fear of God in the hearts of his congregation. Sometimes he got kind of carried away with himself. But, just so that you can see what the actual history behind this principle in Mormon history, I'm going to quote from this article on the subject instead of trying to paraphrase it: (By the way, the underlining is mine.)Blood Atonement is somewhat contradictory to most views about JC's Atonement.
Easy one! Since our critics love to ridicule us, this is one doctrine that they have really outdone themselves in terms of parodying and caricaturing what our actual belief is. We are frequently accused of believing that they can, at some point in the future, become "Gods." Understandably, to many who do not fully understand our doctrine, the mere idea is out-and-out heresy.A Man becoming a god, and by implication that there are countless other gods, might not fit the Monotheistic model.
To be perfectly honest, I'm not sure where you're going with this one, but it seems to me that God should be at liberty to reveal His word to anyone He chooses in whatever way He chooses. Certainly not all of the Old Testament prophets received their revelations in exactly the same way.Ways of early revelation in Mormon church differ somewhat from what Prophets of old experienced.
I believe that the divisions in Christianity today are pretty evident. I don't see Mormonism as contributing to this at all. I am 100% convinced that we more readily accept other denominations as "Christian" than they accept us. To us, if a person genuinely believes in Jesus Christ, looks to Him for salvation, tries to live a Christ-like life and considers himself to be a Christian, that's what he is. While it is true that we believe the ancient Church fell into apostasy rather early in its existence, we recognize that there have always been many true Christians on earth, and that a great deal of truth can be found in all denominations.The claim that all other churches are fallen is somewhat dividing.
What would you personally consider the "core doctrines" of Christianity to be, and why? Do you think Christ's Apostles believed these "core doctrines"? I'd kind of have to agree with Joseph Smith's way of putting answering this question. He said, "The fundamental principles of our religion are the testimony of the Apostles and Prophets, concerning Jesus Christ, that He died, was buried, and rose again the third day, and ascended into heaven; and all other things which pertain to our religion are only appendages to it."In the end it depends completely on one's definition of christianity, and how much "New stuff" can be accepted to be added to "common core" of Christian faith.
I take issue with this.Christians are people who believe in Jesus, and all the rest is just window dressing.
What would you personally consider the "core doctrines" of Christianity to be, and why? Do you think Christ's Apostles believed these "core doctrines"? I'd kind of have to agree with Joseph Smith's way of putting answering this question. He said, "The fundamental principles of our religion are the testimony of the Apostles and Prophets, concerning Jesus Christ, that He died, was buried, and rose again the third day, and ascended into heaven; and all other things which pertain to our religion are only appendages to it."
Seriously? What's wrong with it (i.e. this post) is that it's all one big quote. People can't tell which comments are yours and which are mine. I'm not going to even try to respond to it while it's as messed up as it is right now.