Is the Concept of God Necessary To Explain Anything?

[rojse]

Which humans? I live in Colorado Springs, Logician. Home to Focus on the Family and 400,000 Conservative Christians. They don't seem to be struggling to break free from the god delusion in this town.

Perhaps the opposite - breaking free of the atheist delusion?

 

[rojse]

Interesting that you would say that because atheism no longer has an ally in science. The old God/gods is dead, but new concepts are emerging that are wholly consistent with science and reason. God isn't going away, but getting a makeover.

Whom is doing the making over?

 

[rojse]

You kill me. Here's a reality check: What percentage of the human population are actively atheist? How many of those are like yourself: militantly atheist? Face it, your species struggles harder to make bets on the Super Bowl than to answer some esoteric question about the existence of God. Probably more laugh at your efforts than try to help you in your epic struggle. Don Quixote' has nothin' on you.

What percentage of the population are passively atheist? As in, they might claim the Christian faith, but do not pray, nor attend church except for weddings and funerals?

Certainly, atheists, particularly militant atheists, are numerously quite small in comparison to other religions, but I also believe that any number quoted for members of a religious faith is quite overstated, because there are those that claim the faith as a method of social acceptance and convenience, rather than through any divine inspiration to seek God or religion, or even an attempt to find this inspiration.

To myself personally, answering any question about God is equivalent to answering questions about Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny. It is merely trying to refine the idea of an imaginary concept.

 

[rojse]

No, it's a refute of an appeal to numbers. His premise is that our SPECIES is engaged in some epic struggle to eradicate all aspects of religion. Do YOU see evidence of such a widespread struggle? Of course not as there is no epic struggle to free us from God. I doubt he could show that %5 share his view of this struggle. Sure, HE sees it as a noteworthy struggle. Somehow he has applied that to the entire human species. THAT is kinda funny. Look! There's another windmill! Best go tackle that one too! Damsels are in distress!

Oh, if you are skilled enough, you can make the numbers dance whatever way you wish.

Whatever you say, I think that the atheist religious stance has progressed a great deal over the last few decades. It is now a popular subject of discussion, and there are many books that refute religious ideas, and there are prominent speakers for it too, such as Hitchens or Dawkins.

If you want to be more serious with numbers than "I have x amount of people in my church", why don't you tell me how much Christian church attendance has been falling every year, or how many books like Dawkin's The God Delusion were sold, compared to a prominent book that defends Intelligent Design, or even argued against Dawkin's most recent book, of which there were several?

 

[crystalonyx]

I believe the Bible is true.......based on personal experience.


I believe the Xian Bible is false, based upon scientific and historical evidence.

 

[Scuba Pete]

or how many books like Dawkin's The God Delusion were sold, compared to a prominent book that defends Intelligent Design, or even argued against Dawkin's most recent book, of which there were several?

Hey, why don't we compare how many copies of "The God Delusion" were sold to how many copies of the Bible were sold?

The text has been translated into more than 2,100 languages, and with more than five billion copies sold since 1815, it is the best-selling book of all-time.

Portal:Bible - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

There, I have gotten the stats for the Bible... why don't you trot out the Stats for Dawkin's books. BTW, you can combine ALL of his books together too. I doubt that he will account for 1 tenth of one percent of that total. Oh yeah, he's making a HUGE dent here. That's truly an epic struggle for our species. I want to try whatever hallucinogens you are on. That's some truly potent stuff.

 

[Scuba Pete]

What percentage of the population are passively atheist? As in, they might claim the Christian faith, but do not pray, nor attend church except for weddings and funerals?

You confuse atheism with agnosticism.

Certainly, atheists, particularly militant atheists, are numerously quite small in comparison to other religions,

What happened to the entire species struggling to get rid of their "God Delusion"???

but I also believe that any number quoted for members of a religious faith is quite overstated, because there are those that claim the faith as a method of social acceptance and convenience, rather than through any divine inspiration to seek God or religion, or even an attempt to find this inspiration.

This appears anecdotal. Do you have any real stats on this, or are you just pulling it out of your arse?

To myself personally, answering any question about God is equivalent to answering questions about Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny. It is merely trying to refine the idea of an imaginary concept.

How's that working for you? Does it make you feel superior? Do you do this as some kind of coping mechanism? I mean you like to point out how everyone is delusional, so what do you do when your own delusions are pointed out like I did in the previous post?

 

[Rolling_Stone]

Whom is doing the making over?

We live in fascinating times. It's still in the process so it's hard to tell how it will come out or what concepts will have the most say. I suspect, however, physics, field theory, and the zero point field will have a lot to say. In any case, the old, anthropomorphic gods are dead but unburied; the new god is still being born.

 

[logician]

Hey, why don't we compare how many copies of "The God Delusion" were sold to how many copies of the Bible were sold?

Portal:Bible - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

There, I have gotten the stats for the Bible... why don't you trot out the Stats for Dawkin's books. BTW, you can combine ALL of his books together too. I doubt that he will account for 1 tenth of one percent of that total. Oh yeah, he's making a HUGE dent here. That's truly an epic struggle for our species. I want to try whatever hallucinogens you are on. That's some truly potent stuff.

It's not quantity, but quality that counts.

 

[Scuba Pete]

It's not quantity, but quality that counts.

Either way... I don't think that anything Dawkins wrote compares to I Corinthians 13. But please... trot out those figures or concede that you made MORE illogical assertions.

 

[McBell]

Either way... I don't think that anything Dawkins wrote compares to I Corinthians 13. But please... trot out those figures or concede that you made MORE illogical assertions.

Sounds like opinion to me.

 

[Yerda]

Either way... I don't think that anything Dawkins wrote compares to I Corinthians 13.

In aesthetics, I think you're right.

 

[Scuba Pete]

Sounds like opinion to me.

It should. I didn't present it as anything BUT my opinion. Can you quantify "quality" here? Perhaps we should do a poll to compare the two. You pick out Dawkin's very best quote and put it against I Corinthians 13 and see who comes out ahead. I'm game, are you?

The man made a bodacious claim again. Again, he has underwhelmed us with his aptitude for logic and reality.

So Mestemia, do you also buy into his assertion that as a species we are "struggling to free ourselves from God"???

 

[McBell]

It should. I didn't present it as anything BUT my opinion. Can you quantify "quality" here? Perhaps we should do a poll to compare the two. You pick out Dawkin's very best quote and put it against I Corinthians 13 and see who comes out ahead. I'm game, are you?

No thanks.
Rigged contests and popularity contests are not my thing.
And this proposed poll will be both.

The man made a bodacious claim again. Again, he has underwhelmed us with his aptitude for logic and reality.

LOL
If anyone on RF qualifies for the title "Militant Theist" it is you.

So Mestemia, do you also buy into his assertion that as a species we are "struggling to free ourselves from God"???

I will go with the evidence.
And it seems to me that the evidence I have available indicates that no, we as a species are not "struggling to free ourselves from God".

 

[Scuba Pete]

No thanks.
Rigged contests and popularity contests are not my thing.
And this proposed poll will be both.

A wise man never bets against God. It's always rigged.

LOL
If anyone on RF qualifies for the title "Militant Theist" it is you.

At your behest I accept the title.

I will go with the evidence.
And it seems to me that the evidence I have available indicates that no, we as a species are not "struggling to free ourselves from God".

And so we agree. I knew we did.

I honestly don't have a problem with atheists. If their belief system WORKS for them, then way cool. But when they start pulling these assertions out of their BUTTS with little thought or support and defy LOGIC, then I just have to be a little BLUNT. As my daughter would say: SHENANIGANS!

 

[rojse]

Hey, why don't we compare how many copies of "The God Delusion" were sold to how many copies of the Bible were sold?

Portal:Bible - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

There, I have gotten the stats for the Bible... why don't you trot out the Stats for Dawkin's books. BTW, you can combine ALL of his books together too. I doubt that he will account for 1 tenth of one percent of that total. Oh yeah, he's making a HUGE dent here. That's truly an epic struggle for our species. I want to try whatever hallucinogens you are on. That's some truly potent stuff.

But considering that the Bible has two thousand years head start, I am not surprised at all.

However, we are not really interested in who purchased bibles two hundred, a hundred, fifty, or even ten years ago. We are interested in who purchases them today.

Even though this comparison still works in favour of the Bible (it is the best-selling book in the world, after all) this comparison shows books like "The God Delusion" make more of a dent in religious ideas of people today. We don't often care about the faith of people in general in the past, unless their thoughts and ideas had an influence on us today. We are more concerned with the religious nature of people today, which does have an influence on the future.

 

[logician]

" I don't think that anything Dawkins wrote compares to I Corinthians 13"

That's certainly true, we at least know Dawkins wrote his bools, we don't know who wrote
I Corinthians 13.

 

[Scuba Pete]

That's certainly true, we at least know Dawkins wrote his bools, we don't know who wrote
I Corinthians 13.

So, you aren't man enough to STICK with your initial premise, that somehow Dawkins' book is superior to the Bible in terms of people buying it, thus proving your equally inane premise that somehow humankind is struggling as a species to free themselves from their "God Addiction/Delusion".

You rail about how delusional God is and yet you have created your own set of delusions under which you must operate. How is this an improvement? You have only demonstrated that ALL faiths have their own illogic that they must cling to and still call it logical in order to keep believing in spite all of the inconsistencies. We call this FAITH! You are no better than the witch doctor who claims to control the heavens or the preacher breathing out damnation. For you, my friend, employ FAITH just like the rest of us to make your paradigm work. FAITH, and not truth and logic, are the underpinnings of your belief system. When confronted with reality you INVENT premises to support your beliefs just like you suggest theists do.

There is no superiority here. Mankind has and will continue to twist facts and logic to bolster whatever belief system they are using. In the end, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW, just like everyone else. Don't be smug about it because it's TRUE. All belief systems are equal.

 

[logician]

So, you aren't man enough to STICK with your initial premise, that somehow Dawkins' book is superior to the Bible in terms of people buying it, thus proving your equally inane premise that somehow humankind is struggling as a species to free themselves from their "God Addiction/Delusion".

AS usual, you have me confused with someone else in your run-on rant. IN any case, we as a species are struggling to rid ourselves of the chains of myth and delusion, to be replaced by the truth of science and rationalism. This is a slow and difficult process, as homo sapiens is a very emotional species. As one other poster said, he knew people with doctorates that would look you in the face and say sinners would burn in hell for eternity, so ridding ourselves of delusions has proven not to be an easy process.

The light will eventually expose the darkness, however, we must remain resolute in the face of those who seek to propagate myth as fact.

 

[McBell]

So, you aren't man enough to STICK with your initial premise, that somehow Dawkins' book is superior to the Bible in terms of people buying it, thus proving your equally inane premise that somehow humankind is struggling as a species to free themselves from their "God Addiction/Delusion".

Strawman.

Here is the actual statement:

If you want to be more serious with numbers than "I have x amount of people in my church", why don't you tell me how much Christian church attendance has been falling every year, or how many books like Dawkin's The God Delusion were sold, compared to a prominent book that defends Intelligent Design, or even argued against Dawkin's most recent book, of which there were several?

You rail about how delusional God is and yet you have created your own set of delusions under which you must operate. How is this an improvement? You have only demonstrated that ALL faiths have their own illogic that they must cling to and still call it logical in order to keep believing in spite all of the inconsistencies. We call this FAITH! You are no better than the witch doctor who claims to control the heavens or the preacher breathing out damnation. For you, my friend, employ FAITH just like the rest of us to make your paradigm work. FAITH, and not truth and logic, are the underpinnings of your belief system. When confronted with reality you INVENT premises to support your beliefs just like you suggest theists do.

There is no superiority here. Mankind has and will continue to twist facts and logic to bolster whatever belief system they are using. In the end, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW, just like everyone else. Don't be smug about it because it's TRUE. All belief systems are equal.

Irrelevent to the topic at hand rambllings.