Is Violence Against Women Ever Acceptable?

[Polymath257]

Does that rule out the possibility a man has a short temper? What are you trying to say?

And what about a woman with a short temper?

 

[Polymath257]

How do you not see your situation? You accuse random men for having a short temper, are willing to condemn them and deprive them of their basic human rights? Are you the same people who talk about humanity here, compassion and such?

If their temper leads others to fear violence from them, then there is a problem. When the person fearing such violence is his wife, it is intolerable.

Having a wife and children is not a basic human right. It is a privilege and is based on good behavior. Having a bad temper is not good behavior.

 

[Polymath257]

Unfortunately for you, and kind of for me too, I live in "your culture" and have eyes on my head so.. Nice lies.

Those who cannot control their temper are no better than four year olds. And they should be treated as such.

 

[Polymath257]

Does that rule out the possibility a man has a short temper? What are you trying to say?

That having a short temper is a character flaw.

 

[Polymath257]

Well actually it's more complicated than that because there is many types of hitting and many different situations.

But do tell everyone your 'apologetics' about 4:34.

if you are hitting to the point you cause fear, it is unacceptable unless it is self-defense. Period.

 

[Polymath257]

Looks like partnership to me.

Yes, yes it is.

Good. So a man committing violence against his wife is immoral. Hitting her is then immoral and to be condemned, right?

 

[Piculet]

The site I quoted used the word "tap" which to me is much more of the sense of the force involved.

(...)Since the implied intensity of the strike mentioned in 4:34 has not been qualified(...) "a bundle of thin grass" [ "dighth"] and "strike" therewith [ your wife ], and break not your oath [23] rather, it uses the idiom "jalada" [ to lash, to whip, to flog etc. ] , as in in Surah 24, Ayah 2.(...) "hit your wives" [ wadribuhunna ] in verse 4:34 refers to strikes with something relatively soft(...) clearly stated that a husband in no way can hit/tap his wife in a way that(...) "I asked Ibn `Abbas: 'What is the hitting that is ghayr al-mubarrih?'(...) If this approach fails, it is permissible for him to hit/tap her lightly, avoiding her face and other sensitive areas.(...) Therefor it's clear that this light hit/tap, if resorted to at all, is more symbolic(...) As we said before the Prophet himself defined the "only" permissible form of hitting in the Farewell Pilgrimage as "ghayr mubarrih"

Iyas ibn Abdullah ibn Abu Dhubab reported the Messenger of Allah ﷺ as saying:

Do not beat Allah's handmaidens, but when Umar came to the Messenger of Allah ﷺ and said: Women have become emboldened towards their husbands, he (the Prophet) gave permission to beat them. Then many women came round the family of the Messenger of Allah ﷺ complaining against their husbands. So the Messenger of Allah ﷺ said: Many women have gone round Muhammad's family complaining against their husbands. They are not the best among you.
Classification
Sahih (Authentic)
Sunan Abi Dawood Book of Marriage (Kitab Al-Nikah) Hadith 21

Narrated 'Uqba bin Al-Harith:

When An-Nuaman or his son was brought in a state of drunkenness, Allah's Apostle ordered all those who were present in the house to beat him. I was one of those who beat him. We beat him with shoes and palm-leaf stalks.
Classification
Sahih (Authentic)
Sahih al-Bukhari Book of Business by Proxy Hadith 509 — Mufl

Narrated Anas bin Malik:

The Prophet beat a drunk with palm-leaf stalks and shoes. And Abu Bakr gave (such a sinner) forty lashes.
Classification
Sahih (Authentic)
Sahih al-Bukhari Book of Laws of Punishments Hadith 764 — Mu

Narrated As-Saburah:

The Prophet ﷺ said: Command a boy to pray when he reaches the age of seven years. When he becomes ten years old, then beat him for prayer.
Classification
Hasan Sahih (Authentic)
Sunan Abi Dawood Book of Prayer (Kitab Al-Salat) Hadith 494

Abu Huraira reported Messenger of Allah ﷺ as saying: I have held covenant with Thee which Thou wouldst not break, so for any believer whom I curse or beat, make that an expiation on the Day of Resurrection.
Classification
Sahih (Authentic)
Sahih Muslim Book of Virtue, Enjoining Good Manners and Join

 

[Piculet]

Good. So a man committing violence against his wife is immoral. Hitting her is then immoral and to be condemned, right?

Hitting isn't necessarily violence.

Definition of violence
1a : the use of physical force so as to injure, abuse, damage, or destroy
b : an instance of violent treatment or procedure
2 : injury by or as if by distortion, infringement, or profanation : outrage
3a : intense, turbulent, or furious and often destructive action or force the violence of the storm
b : vehement feeling or expression : fervor also : an instance of such action or feeling
c : a clashing or jarring quality : discordance
4 : undue alteration (as of wording or sense in editing a text)
Definition of VIOLENCE

In other words – no.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

And what about a woman with a short temper?

That's why Taming of the Shrew is my least liked Shakespeare play. Though I'm a huge Bard lover, I really don't like that play.

 

[Piculet]

if you are hitting to the point you cause fear, it is unacceptable unless it is self-defense. Period.

The woman in the article presumably has not been hit at all. I'm not sure how you got to this.

 

[Polymath257]

Hitting isn't necessarily violence.
In other words – no.

If the hitting cases fear, then it is violence and should be condemned.

 

[Piculet]

Unless you're religious and God says it's OK.
Then violence is acceptable.
Tom

And to those who think they're their own God.

 

[Piculet]

If the hitting cases fear, then it is violence and should be condemned.

I could go on about how hitting can trigger fear without the hitting being the cause of it, but it doesn't really matter. You condemn all you like. See if it solves your problems.

 

[SomeRandom]

Does that rule out the possibility a man has a short temper? What are you trying to say?

If a ahem “man” has a short temper he should seek out professional help, in order to properly conduct himself as an adult in the future.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Hitting isn't necessarily violence.
In other words – no.

Hitting is always violence.

 

[Piculet]

And what about a woman with a short temper?

What life lessons do you have to share with her?

If their temper leads others to fear violence from them, then there is a problem.

How do you separate those two groups? What about different people — one fears, another doesn't? Have you heard of psychological trauma? A woman can be terrified if someone raises his voice at her if it triggers certain memories. Someone else might not care or might simply raise their voice as well. We can't condemn people just because someone feels this or that way about their behaviour.

And if there is a problem? There's also a problem with alcoholics, drug addicts, psychopaths, the psychotic.. And then there are the normal people — there's problems with them too.

Those who cannot control their temper are no better than four year olds. And they should be treated as such.

I'm glad you don't believed that.

Having a wife and children is not a basic human right

Being allowed to get married and have children is a basic human right. Don't you call it freedom? Well, you're not so generous with the freedom after all.. This is why nations cannot be led with atheism. There are no principles other than me, myself and I.

 

[Piculet]

If a ahem “man” has a short temper he should seek out professional help, in order to properly conduct himself as an adult in the future.

What is wrong with you people? Calm down.

 

[Polymath257]

I'm glad you don't believed that.

But I do believe that.

Being allowed to get married and have children is a basic human right. Don't you call it freedom? Well, you're not so generous with the freedom after all.. This is why nations cannot be led with atheism. There are no principles other than me, myself and I.

Using violence to enforce your will against a woman is immoral. Period. if someone has a short temper, they should learn to deal with it and keep it under control *before* subjecting another person to it.

 

[Piculet]

Using violence to enforce your will against a woman is immoral

Having a short temper is not using violence to enforce your will. Do you understand what it means to have a short temper?

if someone has a short temper, they should learn to deal with it and keep it under control *before* subjecting another person to it.

Should we lock up the short tempered two-year-olds until they learn on their own to "keep it under control". You people are gross. You don't reason at all. It's almost inhuman.

1. Islam permits a man to lightly hit his wife.
   
2. Op's article has no significant problems when it comes to Islam.
3. domestic abuse is a problem in all societies, including muslim societies, but islam is not to blame for that.

 

[McBell]

The woman in the article presumably has not been hit at all. I'm not sure how you got to this.

The woman in the article was beaten to death by an ex-boyfriend.