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Islam: Why do Muslims think that Jesus was Islamic or Muslim?
- Thread starter SLPCCC
- Start date
From the Qur'an. According to it, Jesus was neither god nor a son of god, but he was a genuine prophet of god, much as Muhammad.
How well the version of Jesus shown in the Qur'an reconciles with that of the Christian texts and traditions can be a matter of significant disagreement, though.
How well the version of Jesus shown in the Qur'an reconciles with that of the Christian texts and traditions can be a matter of significant disagreement, though.
SLPCCC
Active Member
So, their evidence is only in the Quran? That doesn't prove that he was Muslim, does it? There are many people who are not gods or the son of a god and are not Muslim. Jesus did fulfill many prophecies, but Muhammad never prophesied anything. Did He? Unlike Muhammad, Jesus' teachings are about loving your enemies and praying for those who persecute you. I don't see how it shows that he is Muslim.
McBell
Admiral Obvious
Viker
Your beloved eccentric Auntie Cristal
They believe that all the major/important figures in the Bible were Muslims or submitters to God. Abraham, Moses, Joshua, Jesus, etc.
I'm no Muslim, but I get the sense that Muslims do not question the Qur'an, period.
A frequent statement is along the lines that anyone who accepts Allah as the only, one true god and Muhammad as its Prophet is a Muslim and says so sincerely (the Shahada) is a Muslim.
It is not apparently too much of a misunderstanding to say that anyone who believes in the truth of the Qur'an, of the existence of Allah and of the Prophethood of Muhammad is a Muslim - and, conversely, that no Muslim would deny those.
Perhaps unavoidably, Muslim communities also strongly disapprove of giving their own spouses and children the choice not to be Muslims and see questioning whether any given person is a Muslim or a "true" Muslim as a very rude if not all-out offensive action.
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MayPeaceBeUpOnYou
Active Member
Hello
Maybe I can clarify it to you. The definition of a Muslim means someone submitting his will to the one true god Islam means attaining peace when you submit your will to the creator.
As Muslims we believe that Allah is the only one worthy of worship and send the last prophet Mohammed with the Quran to us. So in that sense every prophet who was send by god is by that definition a Muslim, we also can even say that his followers are also Muslims. Obviously we might disagree on who was or is his followers.
So about Jesus. We believe he is a descendent of Abraham and was send to the Israelites. He is a Muslim because we believe he submitted his will to the creator. Even tho we can refer jesus as a Jew, he is both a Muslim and a Jew.
Lets take for example Abraham. He was neither a Jew or a Christian right? But we do know he submitted his will to the creator which means he was a moslim.
MayPeaceBeUpOnYou
Active Member
Obviously this is true to some extent. Until children attain the comprehension of good and bad they are not given a choice. After that they can believe what they want since there is no compulsion in religion. Not saying this always happen but this is what Islam teaches us.
SLPCCC
Active Member
But how can Jesus be a Muslim when everything he says in the scriptures goes against the teachings of Allah in the Quran and Allah's prophet, Mohammad??? Also, since Muslim/Islam means to surrender/submit, where in the scriptures does it say that Jesus surrenders/submit to God? Or are these teachings only found in the Quran?
I have met the Catholic version of this claim in person.
Not the most convincing, I must say. Can't in good faith say that I care for it.
The Muslim perspective, as I understand it, is that the Qur'an exists to a large extent to warn that the Gospels were originally a genuine revelation from Allah, but were incorrectly preserved and explain what presumably truly happened. Same for the Torah, incidentally.
So, yes, it is all in the Qur'an and the Jewish and Christian scriptures are simply disregarded as untrustworthy.
Salam
In computer science, there is a concept of abstract variables. I see this in regards to the truth and the true "religion" in Quran.
In hard instance versions, it changes. The details change. It can be different type of animals in that region that is sacrificed in rituals for example.
The mountains which are holy in that place, will differ depending where the Prophet is.
However somethings in the abstract religion don't change.
One of these is that kinship in some form is establish for the successors to the founders.
Another is that there is always at least one holy lady with the group of men leaders. This lady is on par with them.
Another is that the group ascend together in the spiritual world and are together and to be loved as one unit.
Another is the number is always Twelve in terms of how many successors there are to the founder.
So in this way, the creed is always the same. There is always a chosen family of revelation.
Mohammad (s) and his family (a) is the last one of these units.
One of the arguments Quran makes is that creed of Ibrahim (a) and other Prophets (a) is consistent and the same. But this means the hard instance is all of the one abstract religion.
So Isa (a) was a Muslim Twelver in my view.
In computer science, there is a concept of abstract variables. I see this in regards to the truth and the true "religion" in Quran.
In hard instance versions, it changes. The details change. It can be different type of animals in that region that is sacrificed in rituals for example.
The mountains which are holy in that place, will differ depending where the Prophet is.
However somethings in the abstract religion don't change.
One of these is that kinship in some form is establish for the successors to the founders.
Another is that there is always at least one holy lady with the group of men leaders. This lady is on par with them.
Another is that the group ascend together in the spiritual world and are together and to be loved as one unit.
Another is the number is always Twelve in terms of how many successors there are to the founder.
So in this way, the creed is always the same. There is always a chosen family of revelation.
Mohammad (s) and his family (a) is the last one of these units.
One of the arguments Quran makes is that creed of Ibrahim (a) and other Prophets (a) is consistent and the same. But this means the hard instance is all of the one abstract religion.
So Isa (a) was a Muslim Twelver in my view.
SLPCCC
Active Member
- “Say, ˹O Prophet, ˺ “O People of the Book! [i.e., Jews and Christians] You have nothing to stand on unless you observe the Torah, the Gospel, and what has been revealed to you from your Lord.” And your Lord’s revelation to you ˹O Prophet˺ will only cause many of them to increase in wickedness and disbelief. So do not grieve for the people who disbelieve.” [Quran 5:68]
Muslims believe that God's word cannot be changed, and the Quran also shows that the Jews and Christians had the true scriptures at the time of Mohammed; otherwise, why would Allah say, " You have nothing to stand on unless you observe the Torah, the Gospel, and what has been revealed to you from your Lord"? So, saying that the scriptures have been changed is going against what the Quran teaches.
Clearly Muslims disagree. There is no doubt that the texts as they now exist aren't mutually reconciliable.
Muffled
Jesus in me
I also disagree with their interpretation of the Qu'ran.
Salam
The main thesis of Torah is Welayat of God's chosen ones. The main theme of Gospels is Jesus (a) as such a person who is the means and way to God.
Abraham's (a) family is an example of the chosen religion and means. Before Torah, the religion of God is the same as it after, and same with the Gospels.
To keep up the original Torah and Gospels, is to keep up the Welayat of God and his chosen. Keep in mind 5:67 (the verse before) is about Ghadeer declaration which is about Welayat of Ali (a) and his family (a).
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe He mentions the end times.
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe there are some who think there is orthodoxy but there are two main sects and many schools of thought.
B-psychedelic
Member
So According to Islamic beliefs;
1. Jesus Christ prayed bowing
2. He preached the "One God message" monotheism
amongst others but forgetting the fact that he also referred to God Creator of the universe as his father which goes against the principles of the Islamic faith.
I know some would say its figurative sense but the hundred-million-dollar question is this;
Is Allah a father to anyone in any sense?
Qur'an 5 (Surah Al-Ma'idah) verse 18
1. Jesus Christ prayed bowing
2. He preached the "One God message" monotheism
amongst others but forgetting the fact that he also referred to God Creator of the universe as his father which goes against the principles of the Islamic faith.
I know some would say its figurative sense but the hundred-million-dollar question is this;
Is Allah a father to anyone in any sense?
Qur'an 5 (Surah Al-Ma'idah) verse 18