Islamaphobia, bigotry, hate, and cruelty!

[Epic Beard Man]

Wait....So I was told I'm a defender of pedophilia, antisemitism, racism, bigotry, and blah blah blah but the OP stated:

"love Muslims...and I hope to meet Mohammed (Peace be upon him) some day."

Right after it was said Muhammad was a pedophile, anti-Semitic (hard to believe considering Muhammad was Arab as Arabs are a Semitic people as well), warmonger etc.

Some of you have very strange beliefs on this forum.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

No, you're teaching that we should hate Muslims and love others who commit the same crimes.

backwards II tell ya

 

[Godobeyer]

I wish every Muslim was like you Godobeyer!

You are quite likeable!

Thanks for kind words,
it's my pleasure

 

[SomeRandom]

All I'm teaching is that we should love one another!

Really? Because all I got from your OP is that the Q'aran has hatred and bigotry in it. I'm not disagreeing since that seems to be in at least some Holy books to varying degrees. Even a few Hindu scriptures are cruel towards widows or lower castes. Or that might just be weird old traditions I dunno.
But still that's not love, there's no call to love anywhere in your posts about the Q'aran.
I honestly don't know what the solution is. I mean religion must be tamed, sure. We do not tolerate people who think they can stone homosexuals or adulterers in modern society.
So I get why you're very outspoken and critical of these things. I get the tactic, criticise so they get used to different opinions, perhaps it will work. Muslims born in the West are probably going to become more liberal than their brethren.
But overseas? I mean there are many elements in play that make extremist groups either enticing or even frightening. Poverty, wars, desperation. Even the destruction of the Buddhas wasn't done simply because some extremist group quoted the Q'aran.
I dunno. I agree that the PC nature of today is not the best approach. I also agree that we should at least try to be civil in our debates.

 

[Spiderman]

No, you're teaching that we should hate Muslims and love others who commit the same crimes.

No,
That is absolutely not what I'm teaching!

We should love Muslims, but we should absolutely condemn calls to hate, torture, mass-killings, bigotry, mutilation, and psychopathic behavior! etc. whether it is in the Bible, the Qur'an or anywhere!

 

[Sir Doom]

I'm not trying to make you less accepting towards Muslims.

Then stop comparing them to fascists.

We should love Muslims. That doesn't mean we should be silent about the gruesome, bigoted, psychopathic content in the Qur'an and lifestyle of the violent founder!

Silence and spin are not the only options, friend.

I don't see any evidence that Fascism is as big of a threat...Honestly, if I had to choose one, an Islamic Theocracy, or Fascist Dictatorship, Fascism as it is described in the "Doctrine of Fascism", sounds more reasonable and rational than the Qur'an.

They aren't exclusive for one thing. But honestly, I gave two options. You appear to be doubling down on option one.

However, I don't want you, myself, or anyone, to tolerate any forms of hatred, bigotry, or military Dictatorships! I was simply saying, there are more calls to hate, and more brutal tortures in the Qur'an than the "Doctrine of Fascism" (In fact, the most hateful thing I remember from the Doctrine of Fascism was it's zero tolerance for Communism. I don't remember calls to kill people, and there certainly were not any graphic tortures and mutilations said to be in store for non-fascists.)

Here is that spin I mentioned. Do you honestly think that violence is all that separates good from bad? Because that would have to be true for the above to be rational at all. What you are doing is ignoring every aspect of both fascism and Islam except violence and pretending that's the only part that matters.

 

[Spiderman]

Wait....So I was told I'm a defender of pedophilia, antisemitism, racism, bigotry, and blah blah blah but the OP stated:

"love Muslims...and I hope to meet Mohammed (Peace be upon him) some day."

Right after it was said Muhammad was a pedophile, anti-Semitic (hard to believe considering Muhammad was Arab as Arabs are a Semitic people as well), warmonger etc.

Some of you have very strange beliefs on this forum.

I see you rated a post "Winner" that claims I call people to hate Muslims. Why am I not surprised that you rated an obvious falsehood as such!

I've proven many of your statements to be falsehoods in the past, and rather than admit you are mistaken, you just stopped talking to me for a while.

See, unlike you, I admit my faults. I admit, "Anti-Semitism" wasn't the best choice of words for "hating Jews" as the Qur'an and actions of Muhammad promote. However, it is the right word if you take into the proper context of how I intended it. Usually, anti-Semitism, as I have heard the term used, is describing bigotry towards Jews. I proved the Qur'an does contain that.

In the OP, I said we should love Muslims. But cruel, bigoted, psychopathic behavior in the Qur'an or the Bible should be pointed out! Hundreds of millions of lives are oppressed by Islamic laws and policies. Some things are worse than death. And being a non-Muslim in most Muslim-majority countries would be far worse than death imo. So absolutely, I should be concerned about a behavior I see more prevalent in the Muslim world, than any other Religion.

Yes, I love Muhammad (peace be upon him) and hope to meet him some day. Have you ever heard the command "Love your enemies". Muhammad was a pedophile, a mass-murderer, and I can prove he had psychopathic tendencies. Why can't someone love a pedophile and murderer with psychopathic tendencies? I hate what he did, and hate some of what he taught, but I don't hate him.

Now, I'm the first to admit, I have schizoaffective bipolar. But that doesn't mean I'm wrong here. A person can have mental health issues and still follow the golden rule and be deeply compassionate. I don't hurt people (when sober), neither do I break the law, or tell anyone what they have to believe. However, when a text contains graphic torture, and calls to hate those who believe differently, and even mutilate, torture, disfigure, or kill them, and I see on the news that Muslims are indeed doing just that to non-Muslims, the loving thing to do is inform people where this hate is coming from. It was the practice of Muhammad and in the Qur'an and Hadiths!

 

[Spiderman]

Then stop comparing them to fascists.



Silence and spin are not the only options, friend.



They aren't exclusive for one thing. But honestly, I gave two options. You appear to be doubling down on option one.



Here is that spin I mentioned. Do you honestly think that violence is all that separates good from bad? Because that would have to be true for the above to be rational at all. What you are doing is ignoring every aspect of both fascism and Islam except violence and pretending that's the only part that matters.

I also look at the damage Islam has done. I think of countries in my lifetime where an entire gender couldn't drive, had to dress like nuns, not allowed to get an education etc. That sounds worse than death to me! I consider persecuting an entire gender like that to be as bad as a Fascist Dictatorship, if not worse, which is why I used the comparison.

In the Islamic world, (the amount of violence I have known of, in my lifetime), were that same violence to take place in Europe, we would call it World War 3!

 

[Spiderman]

Really? Because all I got from your OP is that the Q'aran has hatred and bigotry in it. I'm not disagreeing since that seems to be in at least some Holy books to varying degrees. Even a few Hindu scriptures are cruel towards widows or lower castes. Or that might just be weird old traditions I dunno.
But still that's not love, there's no call to love anywhere in your posts about the Q'aran.
I honestly don't know what the solution is. I mean religion must be tamed, sure. We do not tolerate people who think they can stone homosexuals or adulterers in modern society.
So I get why you're very outspoken and critical of these things. I get the tactic, criticise so they get used to different opinions, perhaps it will work. Muslims born in the West are probably going to become more liberal than their brethren.
But overseas? I mean there are many elements in play that make extremist groups either enticing or even frightening. Poverty, wars, desperation. Even the destruction of the Buddhas wasn't done simply because some extremist group quoted the Q'aran.
I dunno. I agree that the PC nature of today is not the best approach. I also agree that we should at least try to be civil in our debates.

Yes, there is in bold letters in the OP a call to love Muslims.

Sometimes, the loving thing to do, is point out a person's errors.

If you had a friend who was involved in a cult like the "Manson-family", the loving thing to do is point out the errors of the cult-leader they are following!

Yes, all I'm asking is for people to love each-other. Part of loving others means pointing out some of the greatest hatred and cruelty that is motivating countless people to bully, oppress, imprison, torture, intimidate, and execute others.

 

[SomeRandom]

Yes, there is in bold letters in the OP a call to love Muslims.

Sometimes, the loving thing to do, is point out a person's errors.

If you had a friend who was involved in a cult like the "Manson-family", the loving thing to do is point out the errors of the cult-leader they are following!

Yes, all I'm asking is for people to love each-other. Part of loving others means pointing out some of the greatest hatred and cruelty that is motivating countless people to bully, oppress, imprison, torture, intimidate, and execute others.

Uhhh! The whole "it's really love to criticize my fellow man" thing. Forgive me my eye roll. But that is the exact same justification used for protests against my gay friends and family, the same justification used to deny my friends and family basic decency and respectful privacy (like someone getting an abortion who is bombarded by placards holding up dead babies as an example.) It's the same justification the WBC use to picket soldier's funerals and cause immense suffering to the bereaved.
Criticism doesn't work like Newton's laws of physics. There's not an equal and opposite reaction. It's just criticism. You can dress it however you please, the Emperor is still nude, as it were.
This is why the Abrahamics get such a bad rap just in general. And why a lot of people (even modern Christians/Catholics what have you) are disgusted by the so called definition of "love" espoused by various Churches.

 

[Sir Doom]

I also look at the damage Islam has done. I think of countries in my lifetime where an entire gender couldn't drive, had to dress like nuns, not allowed to get an education etc. That sounds worse than death to me! I consider persecuting an entire gender like that to be as bad as a Fascist Dictatorship, if not worse, which is why I used the comparison.

But somehow ignore the damage fascism has done... I mean... you understand that Musolini didn't invent the idea, right? He just named it and wrote a book. Fascism has essentially plagued humanity since the Roman Empire. Are you really that ill-informed?

In the Islamic world, the amount of violence I have known of, in my lifetime, were that same violence to take place in Europe, we would call it World War 3!

Wow, dude. Just... WOW. You do remember that 2 comes before 3, right? You do remember that fascism played just a bit of a role in the second world war... right? You do understand that millions died, right? MILLIONS.

 

[Spiderman]

Uhhh! The whole "it's really love to criticize my fellow man" thing. Forgive me my eye roll. But that is the exact same justification used for protests against my gay friends and family, the same justification used to deny my friends and family basic decency and respectful privacy (like someone getting an abortion who is bombarded by placards holding up dead babies as an example.) It's the same justification the WBC use to picket soldier's funerals and cause immense suffering to the bereaved.
Criticism doesn't work like Newton's laws of physics. There's not an equal and opposite reaction. It's just criticism. You can dress it however you please, the Emperor is still nude, as it were.
This is why the Abrahamics get such a bad rap just in general. And why a lot of people (even modern Christians/Catholics what have you) are disgusted by the so called definition of "love" espoused by various Churches.

What I'm talking about is something far different than abortion or homosexuality.

Let me ask you,

Should you not correct a fellow person who is a member of a murderous cult like the Manson family, or who talks about Hitler like he's the greatest hero in history?

 

[Spiderman]

But somehow ignore the damage fascism has done... I mean... you understand that Musolini didn't invent the idea, right? He just named it and wrote a book. Fascism has essentially plagued humanity since the Roman Empire. Are you really that ill-informed?



Wow, dude. Just... WOW. You do remember that 2 comes before 3, right? You do remember that fascism played just a bit of a role in the second world war... right? You do understand that millions died, right? MILLIONS.

Yes...Millions...and Islam has done something worse than kill millions...they have kept hundreds of millions ignorant, oppressed with dark-aged laws, intimidated, brainwashed,and an entire gender in some countries was treated in a way that is FAR WORSE THAN DEATH imo!

Here is how an entire gender was forced to dress in Afghanistan before American intervention.

If you gave me the option to go to a death camp, or live like that, I would choose a death camp where I could grab the electric fence, or go to a gas chamber rather quickly than live like that year after year after year!

Not to mention, they would disfigure them, like this. Some things are worse than death. And torture, disfigurement, and humiliation is found in the Qur'an, so it's no wonder we see it so much in countries with a Muslim-majority:
(Afghanistan woman with a cut off nose)

Spoiler

 

[SomeRandom]

What I'm talking about is something far different than abortion or homosexuality.

Not to the people protesting them, they aren't. Remember, homosexuality is supposedly an abomination, the cause of Sodom and Gommorah, the end of humanity as we know it.
Abortion is often times equated with murder.

Should you not correct a fellow person who is a member of a murderous cult like the Manson family, or who talks about Hitler like he's the greatest hero in history?

I tend not to run in circles of Hitler Youth or cults. But no, not really. Merely criticizing someone begets hostility. I mean, yeah call out these things, I'm not saying you shouldn't. But such criticisms automatically elicits defensiveness. Thus you loose the two way communication that allows you to reach such a person. I mean have you not seen American History X?
Merely "correcting" someone does not do anything except continue a long running argument. Or even start one. Hell this is even used as a writing cliche!

 

[Sir Doom]

Yes...Millions...and Islam has done something worse than kill millions...they have kept hundreds of millions ignorant, oppressed with dark-aged laws, intimidated, brainwashed,and an entire gender in some countries was treated in a way that is FAR WORSE THAN DEATH imo!

Your opinion is based on prejudicial notions. That much is clear. All of those things are fascist ideals. Just because a Muslim is doing it doesn't make it non-fascist. Its still fascism. How are you missing that part?

Here is how an entire gender was forced to dress in Afghanistan before American intervention.

View attachment 22986

If you gave me the option to go to a death camp, or live like that, I would choose a death camp where I could grab the electric fence, or go to a gas chamber rather quickly than live like that year after year after year!

Not to mention, they would disfigure them, like this. Some things are worse than death. And torture, disfigurement, and humiliation is found in the Qur'an, so it's no wonder we see it so much in countries with a Muslim-majority:
(Afghanistan woman with a cut off nose)

Spoiler

View attachment 22987

You can't be serious. This has to be trolling.

 

[Spiderman]

Your opinion is based on prejudicial notions. That much is clear. All of those things are fascist ideals. Just because a Muslim is doing it doesn't make it non-fascist. Its still fascism. How are you missing that part?



You can't be serious. This has to be trolling.

Yes, the behavior is quite fascist, which is why I compared the two.

And yes, i would rather go to a gas chamber or firing squad than be a woman or Religious minority under various Islamic regimes that rose to power in my lifetime.

I would make the decision to die without hesitation over a full lifespan like that!

 

[Spiderman]

I want to see all people treated with love and compassion, so of course I condemn fascism as well!

 

[Spiderman]

Not to the people protesting them, they aren't. Remember, homosexuality is supposedly an abomination, the cause of Sodom and Gommorah, the end of humanity as we know it.
Abortion is often times equated with murder.


I tend not to run in circles of Hitler Youth or cults. But no, not really. Merely criticizing someone begets hostility. I mean, yeah call out these things, I'm not saying you shouldn't. But such criticisms automatically elicits defensiveness. Thus you loose the two way communication that allows you to reach such a person. I mean have you not seen American History X?
Merely "correcting" someone does not do anything except continue a long running argument. Or even start one. Hell this is even used as a writing cliche!

Sometimes calling these things out informs a person.

I was called out about bigotry, hate, and mass-killings in the Bible, and I can't thank people enough for calling it out!

As a result, i no longer defend the Bible!

You can can convert a person from a hateful text by calling it out!

Now I condemn all hatred, psychopathic bigotry, and tyranny, thanks to people pointing it out!

 

[Spiderman]

Love one another! Stop the hate! Stop the torture! Stop the tyranny! The first step is to stop defending it!

Thats all im asking here. Basic consideration for the feelings of others!

However, it is okay to hurt someone's feelings if it is by pointing out an ideology full of bigotry, hate, torture, murder, and cruelty!

 

[Spiderman]

It's really sad when condemning hatred, sexism, homophobia, tyranny, mass-killings, mutilation, torture, and violence is called "trolling". Is this what we've become?

Love one another please! Do unto others as you would have them do to you!