Israel attacks gaza strip

[Caladan]

Both sides believe they have God in their corner, and thus neither will ever yield, ever.

Where do you come up with this? Israel is a secular nation, with more gay rights than the US and many other nations.
and although Hamas is pushing towards Islamist sway on the Gaza strip, its rivals the Fatah, to whom the leader of the Palestinian authority belongs and who were in control of the Palestinian territories for many years, try to emphasize secular nationalism.

 

[Caladan]

ANALYSIS / Key Arab states hope for weakened Hamas - Haaretz - Israel News

 

[Caladan]

It seems to me there can be no moral justification for the disproportionate deaths and injuries suffered by the people of Gaza at the hands of the IDF. It is barbaric to kill hundreds in retaliation for the death of one.

It seems to me there can be no moral justification for the disproportionate deaths and injuries suffered by the people of Gaza at the hands of the IDF. It is barbaric to kill hundreds in retaliation for the death of one.

I guess there is no justification for defending the lives of Israeli citizens.
on the last few days before operation Cast Lead, Israeli towns have been hit by up to 80 rockets on a single day, to any normal sovereign nation it should have been enough justification when there were 15 rockets in a single day, or 20.
It is also a victory for propaganda when people believe that the casualties are somehow vastly and exclusively and purposefully civilians, as in reality, and undeniably by Hamas itself the targets have been exclusively military installations of the Hamas (a terror organization who attempts to sway its Islamist ((as opposed to Islamic)) claws on the Gaza strip and the PA in general)
I believe it speaks volumes when Mahmoud Abbas, (leaving aside the Egyptian foreign minister for a second), the leader of the Palestinian Authority himself blames Hamas.

 

[Luminous]

Millions worldwide are angrily protesting Israel

http://current.com/items/89661908/millions_worldwide_are_angrily_protesting_israel.htm#http://current.com/items/89661908/millions_worldwide_are_angrily_protesting_israel.htm#http://current.com/items/89661908/millions_worldwide_are_angrily_protesting_israel.htm#


http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/artic...



Demonstrators in cities around the world marched in protest against the Israeli air strikes on the Gaza Strip that have killed nearly 300 people in the Palestinian territory.

British police made 10 arrests as a demonstration outside the Israeli embassy in London turned violent. Riot police moved in after people tore down the barriers keeping them back from the embassy.

Earlier Sunday, British Foreign Secretary David Miliband called for an "urgent ceasefire and immediate halt to all violence" in Gaza .

A call to "urgently halt" the military action also came from Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov who spoke to his Israeli counterpart Tzipi Livni.

The top diplomats in Italy and Spain, Franco Frattini and Miguel Angel Moratinos, also spoke by telephone with Livni who said Israel would try "to limit the suffering of the people of Gaza," the Italian foreign ministry said.
-------------more at link, meanwhile, here are other stories relating to protests around the world and below that, are upcoming protests:

USA:
Protesters Rally for Gaza:
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/headline/metro/6184656.html

London UK
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5gHgV-kt8L9ruZ6rM5p1Ljvj2BOBA

Indonesia:
http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2008/12/29/hundreds-students-banten-hold-protest-against-israel.html

Jordan, Syria, Egypt and many Arab nations:
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2008-12/29/content_10572520.htm

Morocco
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5iEW4GLcLDc9ZT6f7XMh_7rrSqKgg

more at google search:
http://news.google.ch/news?q=many%20protest%20against%20israel&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-USfficial&client=firefox-a&um=1&sa=N&tab=wn

Upcoming: (This is not an exhaustive list, thousands more are scheduled from what I am reading in the news:
Lists of Protests Called from Across the Country

12/28: Anaheim, CA
Peace Vigil for Gaza Massacre
Sunday Dec 28 - 2 pm
512 S. Brookhurst Ave., Anaheim
Shura Council extends its most heartfelt prayers for the victims of Israeli massacre in Gaza.
Shura Council calls upon the outgoing and incoming US administrations to demand Israel to cease its violent operations in the interest of peace.
Shura Council calls upon people of all faiths and conscience to hold the perpetrators responsible for the death & destruction in Gaza.
Stand in solidarity for peace and be a witness to injustice.
Silence is not an option!

Tel: (714) 239-6473; Fax: (714) 239-6493
www.shuracouncil.org
email: [email protected]
12/28: Atlanta, GA
Atlanta, GA 2pm-4pm Sunday 12/28/08 Israel Consulate 100 Spring St N W

Contact: mike hearington [email protected]
12/31: Boston, MA
Wednesday, December 31, 2:00PM
Copley Square

Contact: Boston Coalition for Palestinian Rights,

[email protected] , (617) 491-2313
Details to be announced
Contact: 857-334-5084, [email protected]

12/28: Cambridge, MA
Protesting at Coolidge Corner Brookline corner of Harvard and Beacon Streets tomorrow 12/28/08 3-5 PM please bing your own signs
Contact: [email protected]
12/28: Columbus, OH
Sunday December 28th - 5:00 PM

Ohio State University - Committee for Justice in Palestine

15th and High St.
Columbus, Ohio

Continued below or at link here.

More upcoming protests at this link:
http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2008/12/28/18556731.php

 

[kai]

yes, but Palestine would not be an independent country.

.

is it possible for Gaza/palestine to be truly independent?

 

[kai]

Millions worldwide are angrily protesting Israel




http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/artic...



Demonstrators in cities around the world marched in protest against the Israeli air strikes on the Gaza Strip that have killed nearly 300 people in the Palestinian territory.

British police made 10 arrests as a demonstration outside the Israeli embassy in London turned violent. Riot police moved in after people tore down the barriers keeping them back from the embassy.

Earlier Sunday, British Foreign Secretary David Miliband called for an "urgent ceasefire and immediate halt to all violence" in Gaza .

A call to "urgently halt" the military action also came from Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov who spoke to his Israeli counterpart Tzipi Livni.

The top diplomats in Italy and Spain, Franco Frattini and Miguel Angel Moratinos, also spoke by telephone with Livni who said Israel would try "to limit the suffering of the people of Gaza," the Italian foreign ministry said.
-------------more at link, meanwhile, here are other stories relating to protests around the world and below that, are upcoming protests:

USA:
Protesters Rally for Gaza:
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/headline/metro/6184656.html

London UK
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5gHgV-kt8L9ruZ6rM5p1Ljvj2BOBA

Indonesia:
http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2008/12/29/hundreds-students-banten-hold-protest-against-israel.html

Jordan, Syria, Egypt and many Arab nations:
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2008-12/29/content_10572520.htm

Morocco
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5iEW4GLcLDc9ZT6f7XMh_7rrSqKgg

more at google search:
http://news.google.ch/news?q=many%20protest%20against%20israel&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-USfficial&client=firefox-a&um=1&sa=N&tab=wn

Upcoming: (This is not an exhaustive list, thousands more are scheduled from what I am reading in the news:
Lists of Protests Called from Across the Country

12/28: Anaheim, CA
Peace Vigil for Gaza Massacre
Sunday Dec 28 - 2 pm
512 S. Brookhurst Ave., Anaheim
Shura Council extends its most heartfelt prayers for the victims of Israeli massacre in Gaza.
Shura Council calls upon the outgoing and incoming US administrations to demand Israel to cease its violent operations in the interest of peace.
Shura Council calls upon people of all faiths and conscience to hold the perpetrators responsible for the death & destruction in Gaza.
Stand in solidarity for peace and be a witness to injustice.
Silence is not an option!

Tel: (714) 239-6473; Fax: (714) 239-6493
www.shuracouncil.org
email: [email protected]
12/28: Atlanta, GA
Atlanta, GA 2pm-4pm Sunday 12/28/08 Israel Consulate 100 Spring St N W

Contact: mike hearington [email protected]
12/31: Boston, MA
Wednesday, December 31, 2:00PM
Copley Square

Contact: Boston Coalition for Palestinian Rights,

[email protected] , (617) 491-2313
Details to be announced
Contact: 857-334-5084, [email protected]

12/28: Cambridge, MA
Protesting at Coolidge Corner Brookline corner of Harvard and Beacon Streets tomorrow 12/28/08 3-5 PM please bing your own signs
Contact: [email protected]
12/28: Columbus, OH
Sunday December 28th - 5:00 PM

Ohio State University - Committee for Justice in Palestine

15th and High St.
Columbus, Ohio

Continued below or at link here.

More upcoming protests at this link:
http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2008/12/28/18556731.php

are there any calling for Hamas to stop targeting Israel and reinstitute the ceasefire?

 

[.lava]

are there any calling for Hamas to stop targeting Israel and reinstitute the ceasefire?

is it possible to launch 80 rockets and kill just one man? who knows, maybe that one man died accidently. maybe you're right, Hamas is targeting Israel, not Israelis. if not, i don't know how come they did not kill dozens by those rockets.

is it possible for Palestine to be independent? are you independent? if yes, what's the difference between you and any Palestinian?

.

 

[Caladan]

is it possible to launch 80 rockets and kill just one man?

Since the operation in Gaza started rocket hits have declined to a only a few. my apologies though that only one man died as a result of this.

 

[Heneni]

I think people all over the world are fed up with the continual violence.

It’s not clear whether hamas actually has rocket power to launch a full scale attack. Their mediocre rockets are no match for israel. Apparently they can fire two hundred rockets every day or so...but how far they can reach and how much damage they can do....well...they have to launch them from the very north part of gaza..it mean its not hard to find the rocket launchers if the only place they can launch from to have any effect is from the north. So if anything its important that Israel gets these places where the rockets are launched from.

Surely israel knows this. Israel is slowly moving their military forces into position. Of course then there is the media who probably get the wrong message as well. Its always good to say that kids and women were killed...makes whoever sent the rocket look worse. But very often the only news that one knows about is that which the governments want you to hear.

Israel have ordered all journalists out of the area where their artillery is gathering.

Wouldn’t it be better for Israel and Palestine if hamas...which is a bit of a loose cannon is out of the picture?

 

[Caladan]

As for people who are seemingly so concerned about the independence of Palestine, it is frightening that it is not common knowledge for these people that the vast majority of Israelis and the decision makers in Israel have been advocating a two states solution a long time before Hamas rose to power and declared in its charter that their aim is the 'obliteration of Israel'.

 

[Caladan]

Frontier India: Israel has a right, indeed a duty, to defend itself


Israeli aircrafts lobbed more than 80 tons of bombs on terrorist Hamas controlled Gaza killing over 200 people. Howard L. Berman (D-CA), chairman of the US House Foreign Affairs Committee, concerning the security situation in Israel said Israel has a right, indeed a duty, to defend itself in response to the hundreds of rockets and mortars fired from Gaza over the past week. No government in the world would sit by and allow its citizens to be subjected to this kind of indiscriminate bombardment. The loss of innocent life is a terrible tragedy, and the blame for that tragedy lies with Hamas.

The US condemned the repeated rocket and mortar attacks against Israel and held Hamas responsible for breaking the ceasefire and for the renewal of violence in Gaza.

Since Hamas decided to end the calm on 19 December, there has been a marked deterioration of the situation in southern Israel. Palestinian terrorists fired over 20 Kassam rockets and mortars into Israel on Sunday (21 Dec).

60-80 rockets and mortar bombs were fired at southern Israel from the Gaza Strip between Tuesday night and Wednesday (23-24 Dec), including 7 rockets at Ashkelon , among them Grad-type missiles, and 5 at Netivot - one exploding outside a local community center which was full of children enjoying Hanukkah activities.

The 200 plus death in Gaza is ironic as earlier terrorist killed at least 195 people in Mumbai, India.

Since 11:30 Saturday morning, the IDF attacked dozens of targets affiliated with the Hamas terror organization in the Gaza Strip. The targets included command centers, training camps, various Hamas installations, rocket manufacturing facilities and storage warehouses. The vast majority of the casualties are terror operatives, most of whom were wearing uniform and working on behalf of terror organizations.

The Air Force activity came as a result of the continuation of terror activity by Hamas terror organization from the Gaza Strip, and the duration of rocket launching and targeting Israeli civilians.

The targets that were attacked were located by intelligence gathered during the last months and include Hamas terror operatives that operated from the organizations headquarters, training camps and weaponry storage warehouses.

The Hamas government leaders and operatives, which activate terror from within civilian population centers, are the sole bearers of responsibility for Israel s military response.

The IDF Spokesperson emphasized that anyone sponsoring terror, hosting terror in his house, housing terror in his basement and sending his wives and children to serve as human shields- is considered a terrorist.

IAF aircraft struck a number of terrorist targets in the Gaza Strip, including a mosque in the Rimal neighborhood in Gaza city, from which many terrorist operations emanated. The mosque served as a base for terrorist activities. The IDF will continue to strike at any target that serves as a base for the terrorist activity against Israeli citizens. Those who are responsible for the attacks against residents of the south will not find refuge in any facility.

Defense Minister Ehud Barak convened a press conference on Saturday afternoon to formally announce the beginning of the IDFs operation against Hamas in the Gaza Strip. Barak laid out the three objectives of the offensive: dealing Hamas a forceful blow, fundamentally changing the situation in Gaza , and bringing to the cessation of rocket attacks against Israeli citizens.

FM Livni briefing to foreign press said This is the translation of our basic right to self defense. Hamas cynically abuses its own civilian population and their suffering for propaganda purposes. The responsibility for harm to civilians lies with Hamas. Israel expects the support and understanding of the international community, as it confronts terror.

At a noon press conference broadcast on Egyptian television Egyptian FM Gheit harshly censured Hamas, placing responsibility for the current situation on Hamas.

Source: Israel has a right, indeed a duty, to defend itself | Frontier India Strategic and Defence - News, Analysis, Opinion

 

[.lava]

my apologies though that only one man died as a result of this.

nothing i said or i would ever say could be responded with this sentence of yours, Caladan. find a anti-semitic jewish hater fascist psycopath and tell your apologies to him.

.

 

[England my lionheart]

i'm really agree with you, but what can you do in times when your country get bombed because you say no to oppression and occupation? seek for peace ?



now Hamas is the problem? man, Hamas in control in gaza for 2 years, the occupation started 31 years ago, man, hamas is the symptom not the illiness.


right and wrong,
righ because iran uses palestine problem as a playing card in the game,
wrong because since when iran considered an actual threat on israel? for the most of israel life time iran government was one of the big supporters for it, leave out all these political games, what iran wants is the recognation from america that she's a big player and should have a slice of the middle east cake.


guess who recall those daemons from the past? zionists, remember that.


practically, your right, where they will go?
belive me, arabs can accpet jews between them, it happened before (before and after islam) and can happen again.
the problem is the way israel think and act.


man, i understand that in sake of peace one can renounce some of his rights, but not all of them, right?

You can blame Hamas for the latest casualties because they took a leaf out of Sadams book,site your forces amongst civilians that way you get all the good propaganda.
Israel isn't unblemished and we all know that but when you are in a corner do you come out fighting or just say "oh Hamas must be having a Firework party,how quaint" sorry but it takes two to Tango and Hamas are leading the dance.

 

[Caladan]

nothing i said or i would ever say could be responded with this sentence of yours, Caladan. find a anti-semitic jewish hater fascist psycopath and tell your apologies to him.

.

we already know you deny one genocide.

 

[Heneni]

Israel isn't unblemished and we all know that but when you are in a corner do you come out fighting or just say "oh Hamas must be having a Firework party,how quaint" sorry but it takes two to Tango and Hamas are leading the dance.

Does hamas have the same firepower as israel though? Leading the dance with a water gun when your 'enemy' has a machine gun is not very smart.

The fact that so many rockets are fired at israel with so few casualties must indicate that they are pee-shooting the isrealites. What are they thinking? Maybe they have more impressive rockets up their sleeves for future attacks.


Heneni

 

[England my lionheart]

Does hamas have the same firepower as israel though? Leading the dance with a water gun when your 'enemy' has a machine gun is not very smart.

The fact that so many rockets are fired at israel with so few casualties must indicate that they are pee-shooting the isrealites. What are they thinking? Maybe they have more impressive rockets up their sleeves for future attacks.


Heneni

They have ,Iran has made provision for that,so what if one day you are picking up the kids from School but the School isn't there any longer and neither are your Kids,would you wish you had waited longer for something to be hit or wonder why you had'nt done something earlier.
The Germans did something simmilar during WW2 and sent there Rockets in the general direction of Britain and there were plenty of casualties.

 

[.lava]

we already know you deny one genocide.

i really do not wish to lose my respect in certain part of you because of this cheap personal attacks. wanna discuss genocide here, tell me how it is related to this topic.

.

 

[.lava]

one day you are picking up the kids from School but the School isn't there any longer and neither are your Kids.

but this nightmare became true in Gaza.

.

 

[England my lionheart]

but this nightmare became true in Gaza.

.

On both sides

 

[Heneni]

They have ,Iran has made provision for that,so what if one day you are picking up the kids from School but the School isn't there any longer and neither are your Kids,would you wish you had waited longer for something to be hit or wonder why you had'nt done something earlier.
The Germans did something simmilar during WW2 and sent there Rockets in the general direction of Britain and there were plenty of casualties.

Im not saying lets wait and see if hamas has greater firing power. Im saying i dont think they have. If they did wouldnt intelligence know about it?

Anyway...i hope for the sake of all that they dont have bigger fire power, and i hope that israel, for their sake dont kill innocent civilians. Their rockets can pretty much reach everywhere.

A rocket can only go so far. Ashdod and the outskirts of Be'er Sheva in Israel can be evacuated if we assume that hamas only has rockets that can fire that far. Firepower needs to be smuggled in. Israel controlling the sea, the borders etc....it wont be easy to smuggle bigger rockets into gaza.

The rockets of hamas were smuggled into the Gaza Strip via the tunnels in the Sinai Peninsula. Although Egypt says it must have been by sea.

Still...there isnt an endless supply of this stuff, and smuggling bigger rockets into gaza wont be easy. And if intelligence knows about the smuggled rockets of hamas, then surely they would know if they had anything bigger. Lets hope they dont.