Israel Should Be Stopped

[shunyadragon]

Israel is what USA is stopping. We're stopping Israel already. That is (ironically) what we are doing by keeping it from direct attacks (such as from Iran). Look at the big picture. Israel doesn't have enough territory to defend itself effectively, and its presence is religiously offensive to Islamic countries. This means if attacked Israel must take new territory. For example if Iran doesn't stop, Israel must react. Whenever Israel gets attacked it always takes territory, which is intelligent. This is however inconvenient for the USA.

USA wishes we hadn't sponsored Israel in the first place. The unending religious war of Islam against Jews particularly in this zone is very, very likely to force Israel into open war again someday. This will lead to Israel annexing more territory.

USA does undermine Israel in other ways. We support Hamas through the UN. We use the UN as leverage against Israel when there are resolutions against Israel. We support teaching Gazan children to hate Jews. We support (through the UK) anti Israel propaganda. Essentially we are working to neutralize the situation without a large scale war. We work to make Israel less Jewish. We oppose Israel through our college university programs.

I believe this is an odd unrealistic approach.

Israel does not take territory except over time the goal of occupying Palestine as part of Israel. Yhis is the traditional goal od establish the Jewish State for Jews only. Slowly the Jews are ethnically cleansing Palestinians form Israel.

The USA has complete and overwhelming blank check for anything Israel needs to accomplish its goals. For Israel it is just a matter of time.

The support for Hamas by the West is humanitarian and not military. If Trump is elected this will end. The USA objects to Israel's Old Testament military inhuman methods of warfare, but nonetheless it will always support Israel in the end. Old Testament vengeance rules the battlefield to crush Hamas

Both sides are intransigent in their goals, and the bottom line methods of the Muslims is no less inhuman and brutal resorting to inhuman terrorism in recent history, which may continue when the Hamas fails.

 

[Brickjectivity]

I believe this is an odd unrealistic approach.

Israel does not take territory except over time the goal of occupying Palestine as part of Israel. Yhis is the traditional goal od establish the Jewish State for Jews only. Slowly the Jews are ethnically cleansing Palestinians form Israel.

The USA has complete and overwhelming blank check for anything Israel needs to accomplish its goals. For Israel it is just a matter of time.

The support for Hamas by the West is humanitarian and not military. If Trump is elected this will end. The USA objects to Israel's Old Testament military inhuman methods of warfare, but nonetheless it will always support Israel in the end. Old Testament vengeance rules the battlefield to crush Hamas

Both sides are intransigent in their goals, and the bottom line methods of the Muslims is no less inhuman and brutal resorting to inhuman terrorism in recent history, which may continue when the Hamas fails.

The Jordan Valley annexation of 2020 completes Israel’s eastern border with Jordan and allows Israeli forces to encircle the West Bank’s Palestinian population, acting as a spacer between Israel and the Arab states farther to the east.
In the 6 Day War in 1967 Israel captured the Golan Heights which were being used to fire missiles into Israel.

In each case Israel took land after being attacked. This might continue to happen, and if the USA removes military support for Israel it will happen a lot. Israel will, seeing itself in danger, probably gather new allies and take lots of territory as well. I would if it were me and my country, and if I were attacked and under threat I'd do it. I would make enormous buffer zones that gave me warning time in case of an attack against my civilians. You will occasionally see the USA asking Israel to calm down. In the current situation we have asked them not to return fire to Iran. We assure them that we will protect them. If we didn't they would conquer (or try to) Iran probably within the next five years. Did you notice? Iran launched a bevy of missiles on the rumor that Israel was responsible for the problem with its embassy. Based on a rumor. Hell.

Rome was once tiny and disinterested in international politics, but it kept getting attacked. Napoleon was not originally a conqueror, but he kept getting attacked by England & allies. They'd attack, lose, then sue for peace. Then they'd attack him again. That's why he started conquering. They wouldn't leave him be. That is situation for Israel.

That is the situation, and it is because of the choices made by the USA and by the UK in 1947 and before. We thought it would be a fantastic idea to put a lot of Jews over there and recognize them as a country, right near to the Arab nations and in a way that would annoy everyone. Now Israel finds itself like France did long ago just before Napoleon.

 

[Revoltingest]

He’s probably crying for you in intercession. (At least that what The Book says)

A book says so?
Well, that's gotta be true!

 

[Revoltingest]

That is, I really don't see you acknowledge that there are two sides here.

Then you've missed my recognition of the
Hamas attack, & suggestion for Israel's
self defense.

Not saying to move forward, I'd just like you admit that.

Look, you talk about Israel's treatment of Palestinians, but you never mention the endless missiles being shot into Israel year after endless year -- for which they need their Iron Dome.

I've mentioned that Iron Dome
is legit self defense.

And you don't acknowledge....

It's not wise to assume that what you've
not seen, wasn't posted elsewhere.

 

[Revoltingest]

That’s probably because your position is irrational and outrageous.

I don't believe that a sky fairy created
& runs a world where this conflict &
other evils are part of a master plan.
So that's an odd attribution of
irrationality.

 

[Godobeyer]

Bad enuf that Israel has brutalized & oppressed Palestinians
for most of a century. Even more heinous is the genocide
against Palestinians.
Now it's begun attacks in other countries...which will provoke
more attacks...which will provoke ever more attacks...& so on.
This is not about self defense.
It is deadly blind vengeance fueled by religious bigotry.

USA props up Israel with money, weapons, & political
cover at the UN. This gives Israel the unlimited ability
to violate human rights & international law with impunity.
This must change.
Otherwise USA will be waging war on behalf of Israel.
Israel must be de-fanged before it precipitates WW3.

Biden & even some in Congress now seem concerned.
But still, USA leaders takes no steps to curb the carnage.
They have the power to stop it.
Instead, it's all talk & no walk.

What inspired this thread?
Israel indends to strike Iran's nuclear facilities in retaliation
for Iran's likely retaliation for Israel's attack on Iran's embassy.
Iran is prepared to respond on a much larger scale.

Missiles of Iran | Missile Threat

Iran possesses the largest and most diverse missile arsenal in the Middle East, with thousands of ballistic and cruise missiles, some capable of striking as far as Israel and southeast Europe. For the past decade, Iran has invested significantly to improve these weapons’ precision and lethality...

missilethreat.csis.org

Escalation would be inevitable, with USA taking the
wrong side, ie becoming a war criminal state.
This should not happen.

Israel prepared to strike Iranian nuclear facilities if Tehran launches attack – report

* * *

www.timesofisrael.com

Iran nuclear programme: Threat of Israeli strike grows

As Iran's nuclear programme forges ahead, some see Israel running out of options to thwart it.

www.bbc.com

Israel won't stop until Americans make a revolution against zionists regime which control USA, by name of religions.

The government of Israel has made clear they are intransigent of any outside pressure or influence concerning their war against Hamas. It has been stated: "We will stand alone in this conflict regardless."

As far as the USA position it is solidly and 90%+ pro-Israel. The Conservative Christian Right is overwhelmingly anti-Muslim in the extreme with no compromise. and they support Israel's actions to resolve the conflict,

Violence and wars are never justified, but nonetheless both Israel and Hamas and other Islamists in history justify and wage tribal war based on Old Testament morality. No humanitarian human rights are considered, and war is waged no holds barred and no compromise, negotiations or surrender considered to the last man standing. Venganse is a strong motivation of justification in Old Testament morality in warfare.

Yes , the Israel leaders of war quotes many about fighting non-human animals, i think about evil religious motivations,Israel build over Palestinians bloods and suffering.
Different between ISIS and Israel, ISIS is not a country,aslo it's idealogy rejected by Muslim nations and world, the dangerous Israel regime is a country accepted/supported by Western leaders.And radical christians which believe on idealogy of superiority of Jews "chosen people" and Messiah come to them.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Israel won't stop until Americans make a revolution against zionists regime which control USA, by name of religions.

Yes , the Israel leaders of war quotes many about fighting non-human animals, i think about evil religious motivations,Israel build over Palestinians bloods and suffering.
Different between ISIS and Israel, ISIS is not a country,aslo it's idealogy rejected by Muslim nations and world, the dangerous Israel regime is a country accepted/supported by Western leaders.And radical christians which believe on idealogy of superiority of Jews "chosen people" and Messiah come to them.

Well, at best it is a limited part of what is going on.

 

[Kenny]

A book says so?
Well, that's gotta be true!

YUP!

 

[Kenny]

I don't believe that a sky fairy created
& runs a world where this conflict &
other evils are part of a master plan.
So that's an odd attribution of
irrationality.

If you open your eyes, you will see that it is man that is running this world… maybe that is why there is irrational thinking like yours?

 

[Revoltingest]

If you open your eyes....

I'm sure you believe that your eyes are open.
And that your myths, stories, & rules are true.
My open eyes see those as delusions.

 

[Kenny]

I'm sure you believe that your eyes are open.
And that your myths, stories, & rules are true.
My open eyes see those as delusions.

YUP! In our understanding that would be listed as:

"The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel that displays the glory of Christ, who is the image of God."

The remedy, according to my signature of course, is the anointing of God to open blind eyes.

But you can believe differently… I support your right to do so.

 

[Revoltingest]

YUP! In our understanding that would be listed as:

"The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel that displays the glory of Christ, who is the image of God."

The remedy, according to my signature of course, is the anointing of God to open blind eyes.

But you can believe differently… I support your right to do so.

God, Easter Bunny, spirits, leprechauns, sprites, ghosts,
pixies, sky fairies, other fairies, Krampus, ring wraiths,
other wraiths, genies, devils, Santa Clause, angels,
Krakens, griffins, centaurs, witches, goblins, Cerberus,
gremlins, werewolves, Ganesha, vampires, gnomes &
other such inventions aren't going to become real to
me unless really severe mental illness takes hold.
Other symptoms would be....
Opposing vaccination, believing Trump is sent to us
by God, & buying extended warranties.

 

[Kenny]

God, Easter Bunny, spirits, leprechauns, sprites, ghosts,
pixies, sky fairies, other fairies, Krampus, ring wraiths,
other wraiths, genies, devils, Santa Clause, angels,
Krakens, griffins, centaurs, witches, goblins, Cerberus,
gremlins, werewolves, Ganesha, vampires, gnomes &
other such inventions aren't going to become real to
me unless really severe mental illness takes hold.
Other symptoms would be....
Opposing vaccination, believing Trump is sent to us
by God, & buying extended warranties.

And thinking that Revoltingest knows the truth.

 

[Revoltingest]

And thinking that Revoltingest knows the truth.

I've often claimed that I have no truth.
Only opinions & values.
But clear statements that don't fit the
fundie narrative are invisible to so many.

 

[Revoltingest]

Gentlemen, gentlemen.....It's against the
rules (last I knew) to accuse others of lying,
& to characterize their emotions.
Let's avoid it, lest the thread be locked.
You may describe each others' posts though.

 

[danieldemol]

@Revoltingest
I wouldnt be opposed to Biden limiting the supply of weapons to Israel to defensive only (ie iron dome and anything else suitable).

Then if the nutlessyahoo wants to genocide Palestinians he will have to fund it out of his own piggybank.

Though I dont know how Biden would pull it off given the US electorate.

 

[shunyadragon]

@Revoltingest
I wouldnt be opposed to Biden limiting the supply of weapons to Israel to defensive only (ie iron dome and anything else suitable).

Then if the nutlessyahoo wants to genocide Palestinians he will have to fund it out of his own piggybank.

Though I dont know how Biden would pull it off given the US electorate.

Problems (1) The 'Iron Doom' was developed and built by Israel. They presently have a surplus of iron doom equipment (2) In the history of USA;Isreal relationships it is the overwhelming popularity of Israel in the People, Congress and ALL Presidents that have determined the military and other aide to Israel. This ia a fact the Biden has little influence over. (3), "Some" people are justified in their opposition to Israel, but most still support Israel. Bottom line" (3) Both Israel and Hamas have been adamantly intransigent in refusal to negotiate. (4) If Trump is elected he will double the bomb shipments to Israel and stop aide to Palestine. The Conservative Republicans are overwhelmingly anti-Islamic. (Anti-Semitic and anti=Muslim violence has a long history in the USA and is increasing. Considering Israel's overwhelming military superiority it does not need US aide to achieve its goal Considering the universal possible source of weapons and Israel's wealth US aid is not necessary at present, (7) The bold above is meaningless emotional rhetoric. What can Biden actually do in this situation?

This is the longest tribal war in history, and both sides resort to a history of no holds barred Old Testament military morality.

 

[Revoltingest]

@Revoltingest
I wouldnt be opposed to Biden limiting the supply of weapons to Israel to defensive only (ie iron dome and anything else suitable).

Then if the nutlessyahoo wants to genocide Palestinians he will have to fund it out of his own piggybank.

Though I dont know how Biden would pull it off given the US electorate.

If Israel wants genocide, do they even deserve defensive weapons?
USA tax money would still be enabling genocide.

 

[danieldemol]

If Israel wants genocide, do they even deserve defensive weapons?
USA tax money would still be enabling genocide.

In my view your question appears to be sliding into the deep end of a rabit hole.
Israel is a conglomerate of conservatives and liberals, people who want war and people who want peace.

I see it as similar to Palestine in that regard. Perhaps Palestine also needs defensive only weapons like an iron dome.

I appreciate that from your end your interests are reducing your tax burden, however for me innocent human life is worth trying to save. Ultimately it won't be up to me as a non US citizen to decide what an acceptable expenditure is.

 

[Revoltingest]

In my view your question appears to be sliding into the deep end of a rabit hole.
Israel is a conglomerate of conservatives and liberals, people who want war and people who want peace.

I see it as similar to Palestine in that regard. Perhaps Palestine also needs defensive only weapons like an iron dome.

I appreciate that from your end your interests are reducing your tax burden, however for me innocent human life is worth trying to save. Ultimately it won't be up to me as a non US citizen to decide what an acceptable expenditure is.

It's not about reducing my tax burden.
$$$ to Israel is a drop in the bucket.
It's about USA culpability, & the responsibility
to neither be evil nor to enable evil.