Israel Strikes Designated "Safe Zone," Killing at Least 90 People and Injuring About 300

[dybmh]

Your ad hominem is as ludicrous as it is loathsome.

^^^ Hypocrisy Alert ^^^

Jay, you sling more mud on this forum than anyone I know. And you do it like a RAT.

 

[Debater Slayer]

You don't KNOW the IDFs actions. You think you do, but you're fooling yourself.

I know what the results are by the same standard I know anything else that has been widely reported, verified, and documented by various major sources, organizations, and first-hand witnesses (whose testimonies have also been verified by many others).

Do you know the IDF's actions? From where are you getting so much confidence to declare that what they have been doing is not only justifiable but necessary?

 

[dybmh]

Do you know the IDF's actions?

Your claim, your burden.

Is this your first debate?

 

[dybmh]

From where are you getting so much confidence

I see this trash all over this website and all over the internet.

I do opposition research. I'm a pro.

 

[Debater Slayer]

He cares. He cares a lot. That's the problem. Cooler heads prevail. That's why the IDF keeps beating these those thugs.

By the way, what is the struck-through "these" supposed to imply?

And you still haven't answered my question:

Which "thugs"? The civilians who have been killed and maimed, or the people who side with them? Netanyahu said that he wasn't even "certain" whether the Hamas commander was killed in those strikes.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Your judgement is compromised. Your religion is politics.

On the contrary, my religion informs my politics.

You don't KNOW the IDFs actions. You think you do, but you're fooling yourself.

Two excerpts from The Times of Israel:

1. Israel had been monitoring the compound in the Al-Mawasi area, where Salameh’s family owned a villa, for several months, three senior Israeli officials told the Times. Despite receiving confirmation weeks ago that the Khan Younis brigade commander was present, the strike was delayed in the hope that Deif would eventually venture out from the underground tunnels where he was thought to be hiding and join him there.
2. Citing unnamed defense officials, the outlet reported that Hamas officials appeared to erroneously believe Israeli forces would be unlikely to suspect the location due to its relative exposure, and would also be unlikely to strike it due to its proximity to tent camps of displaced Palestinians.

The bottom line is that the Israeli military knew exactly what they they were doing and (again) exhibited a callous and criminal disregard for collateral damage.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

Well, they both despise Israel, so there's that.

The Red Crescent reported significantly lower numbers. But you and the NY Times and many other news outlets pretty consistently prefer Hamas's numbers. Well, you do you, I suppose.

If I read the article right, those number are from a specific field hospital. @Debater Slayer 's article states "Associated Press journalists counted over 40 bodies at overwhelmed Nasser Hospital nearby." So there are likely counts from different sources and different places. I recognize that counting bodies and injured is never an exact thing, especially soon after the fact.

Arguably, any civilian death and injury is horrible. It's important that, while evidence and facts from a war-zone are often difficult to ascertain, discussion and criticism is still ongoing.

 

[Debater Slayer]

Your claim, your burden.

The IDF has bombed multiple refugee camps and killed tens of thousands of civilians throughout the war. That has been verified by various independent and major sources and organizations. As I said:

I know what the results are by the same standard I know anything else that has been widely reported, verified, and documented by various major sources, organizations, and first-hand witnesses (whose testimonies have also been verified by many others).

Is this your first debate?

No, but it is not often that I engage posts that are rife with personal attacks, hotheaded dismissiveness without much substance in the way of argument, and such extreme tribalism as to try to attribute criticism of a government's actions to any of various imagined character or thinking defects instead of engaging with the substance of the criticism.

 

[Debater Slayer]

I see this trash all over this website and all over the internet.

I do opposition research. I'm a pro.

So, on the one hand, we have evidence and statements from some of the world's leading and most-established journalistic, medical, and humanitarian organizations and sources, in addition to numerous testimonies verified by other sources. On the other hand, we have your "opposition research."

I don't think it's exactly hard to make out which is more reliable and trustworthy.

 

[dybmh]

By the way, what is the struck-through "these" supposed to imply?

You're doing the work of Hamas.

ETA: and @Jayhawker Soule is cheering you on.

 

[dybmh]

we have evidence and statements

You have no evidence without the statements of Hamas. Everything you are reading from the region is coming from Hamas but is being reported through the media 2nd hand. The media is reporting it, because, they have no other sources. The public is angry, the public is confused, the public is hurting. The media is doing the best they can. But they're only giving HAMAS data. That's a fact.

 

[dybmh]

I don't think it's exactly hard to make out which is more reliable and trustworthy.

You don't know what you don't know. Just like the rest of us. The difference is, you are blind to your bias, the rest of us aren't.

Goodbye sir.

 

[dybmh]

but it is not often that I engage posts that are rife with personal attacks

Look at you! Waving your Admin badge around. Yes, yes, I know who you are. I know what you do.

Do you actually think that matters to me? I do what's right. And this thread is all kinds of wrong. It's a great example of faulty cognition, and irrational thinking coming from the anti-israel mob.

You cannot intimidate me, DS. It only makes me stronger.

 

[Debater Slayer]

You have no evidence without the statements of Hamas. Everything you are reading from the region is coming from Hamas but is being reported through the media 2nd hand. The media is reporting it, because, they have no other sources. The public is angry, the public is confused, the public is hurting. The media is doing the best they can. But they're only giving HAMAS data. That's a fact.

You make it sound like all of those media outlets and third-party organizations are either amateurish or oblivious in their reporting, without standards of verification before publishing their findings. That might be more believable if it were one or two sources reporting on the IDF's excessss, not so many from different countries, backgrounds, and political leanings. Then there are the numerous accounts from displaced people and independent observers who have reported on the conditions the former are facing.

I don't see the point of trying to have a productive discussion with you about this. It seems to me that you have adopted a particularly extreme and tribalistic stance on the issue and are now unwilling to consider that it could be incorrect. That sort of attitude and ideology is exactly what hinders peace in the region, whether it's in support of the IDF or Hamas.

 

[Debater Slayer]

You don't know what you don't know. Just like the rest of us. The difference is, you are blind to your bias, the rest of us aren't.

You're saying this after months of not criticizing the IDF even once and trying to justify the strikes that have massacred Palestinian civilians. The claim that you're aware of your bias is so at odds with your posts that I'm not sure whether it's a product of lack of awareness or severe selectivity at this point.

Look at you! Waving your Admin badge around. Yes, yes, I know who you are. I know what you do.

Do you actually think that matters to me? I do what's right. And this thread is all kinds of wrong. It's a great example of faulty cognition, and irrational thinking coming from the anti-israel mob.

You cannot intimidate me, DS. It only makes me stronger.

I haven't brought up my being staff in this thread at all; you're the only one who has done so. You're baaically tilting at windmills you've constructed.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

From the NYT:

They Were Told They Were in a Safe Area, Then Came the Missiles.​

It's heartbreaking.

 

[dybmh]

It's heartbreaking.

^^^ EMOTIONAL PLEAS ^^^

The work of the propagandist. The political operative. "Say as little as possible and tug at their heart strings."

Sneaky like a rat.

 

[dybmh]

They Were Told They Were in a Safe Area, Then Came the Missiles.

Nice font, Jay. You just love posting those headlines, don't you. It's good tactic, because most people reading it ( internet junkies ) respond to quantity not quality.

Headlines are sensational. Click-bait. They don't offer facts.

 

[dybmh]

I haven't brought up my being staff

Now you're running scared.

 

[Debater Slayer]

Now you're running scared.

What are you talking about? I stated a fact; I haven't brought up my being staff in this thread, and it has zero relevance to any of the points in question here. You brought it up out of the blue along with some bizarre tangent about "intimidation." That's what I mean when I say you're tilting at windmills you've constructed.