jesus and prophecies .. strange! .. but true

[Conståntine]

Nope .. it's VERY relevant, because when jesus says:

[Mk 13:7][When you hear of wars and rumors of wars, do not be alarmed; this must take place, but the end is still to come.]

then he is talking about the wars which are the opposite of peace as we know it.

You aren't making much sense at all. The reason this discussion was started between us was because I pointed out that Jesus was in fact a prince of peace. I pointed out in essence that the meaning of this title had to do with the fact that he gives others his peace of mind in their hearts. I have no idea what you are going on about with respect of Jesus talking about wars.What is your point? Are you insinuating that him mentioning wars in the aforementioned chapter nullifies my assertion that Jesus gives peace of mind to his followers?


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I already have delineated jesus totally from my whole life, I am just worried for you.

I am even MORE concerned about the usage of vocabulary in your sentence above, at it renders this statement incomprehensible.

 

[Xchristian]

You aren't making much sense at all. The reason this discussion was started between us was because I pointed out that Jesus was in fact a prince of peace. I pointed out in essence that the meaning of this title had to do with the fact that he gives others his peace of mind in their hearts. I have no idea what you are going on about with respect of Jesus talking about wars.What is your point? Are you insinuating that him mentioning wars in the aforementioned chapter nullifies my assertion that Jesus gives peace of mind to his followers?

Well, ok, let's get this one out the way first:

The 'peace' you meant, is not really to do with the NTJ, 'Jesus of the NT' is a person who incited hatred between the person and his family, and ended up being killed in a very gory way .. what peace are you on about?

if you say (as indeed you did) peace of mind, then you are not really following.
I quoted you him being the reason a whole generation was wiped out.
He is the reason by a failed prophecy why his country was annihilated.
He is the reason why most of his friends got killed.

AND .. he wants to put people in a lake of fire! ..

What peace are you on about?

I gave you his own use, peace is the opposite of war, not your own picking.

I am even MORE concerned about the usage of vocabulary in your sentence above, at it renders this statement incomprehensible.

I am sorry, a typo, I wanted to say 'deleted' but because of you having used that verb.
Reminds of Dr Price having used the word: 'denotation' .. only to find him saying 'detonating' ... similar letters.

 

[Conståntine]

Well, ok, let's get this one out the way first:

The 'peace' you meant, is not really to do with the NTJ, 'Jesus of the NT' is a person who incited hatred between the person and his family, and ended up being killed in a very gory way .. what peace are you on about?

Incite <verb> - To encourage, urge, or persuade to act in a violent or unlawful way.

Kindly explain to me how, when, and where Jesus incited anyone.

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if you say (as indeed you did) peace of mind, then you are not really following.
I quoted you him being the reason a whole generation was wiped out.

He is the reason by a failed prophecy why his country was annihilated.
He is the reason why most of his friends got killed.

AND .. he wants to put people in a lake of fire! ..
What peace are you on about?

I, by reason of Jesus, have peace of mind. What do those occurrences have to do with my peace of mind that he has given myself and others, much less the price of tea in China? Not everyone will have peace of mind in this world, because not everyone will serve Jesus, for whatever reason. It's as simple as that.

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I gave you his own use, peace is the opposite of war, not your own picking.

The peace of mind in question is not an antonym of war in the sense of what you're going on about above.

 

[Xchristian]

Incite <verb> - To encourage, urge, or persuade to act in a violent or unlawful way.

Kindly explain to me how, when, and where Jesus incited anyone.

[Lk 14:26][ "Whoever comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, yes, and even life itself, cannot be my disciple.]

I, by reason of Jesus, have peace of mind. What do those occurrences have to do with my peace of mind that he has given myself and others, much less the price of tea in China? Not everyone will have peace of mind in this world, because not everyone will serve Jesus, for whatever reason. It's as simple as that.

Personal experiences don't count, are you aware of this?

The peace of mind in question is not an antonym of war in the sense of what you're going on about above.

yes because it's YOUR own thing, it's not in the scripture, and it's not everybody's experience.

I know a lot of people who worship Satan and they say just about like you.

 

[Conståntine]

[Lk 14:26][ "Whoever comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, yes, and even life itself, cannot be my disciple.]

That has to be one of the most inanely constructed arguments yet. HOW is the above an example of an incitation to hatred, as opposed to a mere disqualification??!

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Personal experiences don't count, are you aware of this?

My question would still not change much - what does your aforementioned verbiage concerning friends being killed and so-called failed prophecies have to do with the promise of Jesus giving peace to his disciples?

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yes because it's YOUR own thing, it's not in the scripture, and it's not everybody's experience.

I know a lot of people who worship Satan and they say just about like you.

I am again not following your train of thought.

 

[Xchristian]

That has to be one of the most inanely constructed arguments yet. HOW is the above an example of an incitation to hatred, as opposed to a mere disqualification??!

If you didn't see the words, then I can't explain it.

[Lk 14:26][ "Whoever comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, yes, and even life itself, cannot be my disciple.]

Professor Ehrman, bless him, he said that jesus was an apocalyptic person who didn't see much left in the world (I know he was disappointed, it didn't end - I mean jesus not professor Ehrman) .. Those values didn't make sense to him.

My question would still not change much - what does your aforementioned verbiage concerning friends being killed and so-called failed prophecies have to do with the promise of Jesus giving peace to his disciples?

I believe it takes a lot of convincing to tell a person that killing, blood and violence is against peace ..

seeing you have a good dictionary, can you please revive your knowledge about peace?

I am again not following your train of thought.

Same as above, peace means ... well, it would be shameful to teach you but there you go:

peace (p

s)n.1. The absence of war or other hostilities.
2. An agreement or a treaty to end hostilities.
3. Freedom from quarrels and disagreement; harmonious relations: roommates living in peace with each other.
4. Public security and order: was arrested for disturbing the peace.
5. Inner contentment; serenity: peace of mind.

peace - definition of peace by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

the very first definition say: peace = no war ..

jesus = war, hate, blood, violence, innocent children being killed, cities destroyed .. etc

I hope that makes it clear.

 

[Conståntine]

If you didn't see the words, then I can't explain it.

[Lk 14:26][ "Whoever comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, yes, and even life itself, cannot be my disciple.]

Professor Ehrman, bless him, he said that jesus was an apocalyptic person who didn't see much left in the world (I know he was disappointed, it didn't end - I mean jesus not professor Ehrman) .. Those values didn't make sense to him.

Just before I answer that, the bible says a couple of things:

Mark 4:11: And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:
Mark 4:12: That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them.

If that incites you or anyone else to hatred, then the bible prescribes this remedy:

James 1:5: If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

Having stated thus, it behooves a saint to know that if they do not put Jesus first in their lives, then they can't be his disciples. A saint also knows that Jesus said to love your neighbour as yourself. Thus, a true saint would not be so naïve as to be led to hatred by virtue of such a verse, because he/she would've understood the context of this saying.

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I believe it takes a lot of convincing to tell a person that killing, blood and violence is against peace ..

seeing you have a good dictionary, can you please revive your knowledge about peace?

It just takes you answering my questions with transparent and cogent answers.

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Same as above, peace means ... well, it would be shameful to teach you but there you go:

peace (p

s)n.1. The absence of war or other hostilities.
2. An agreement or a treaty to end hostilities.
3. Freedom from quarrels and disagreement; harmonious relations: roommates living in peace with each other.
4. Public security and order: was arrested for disturbing the peace.
5. Inner contentment; serenity: peace of mind.

peace - definition of peace by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

the very first definition say: peace = no war ..

jesus = war, hate, blood, violence, innocent children being killed, cities destroyed .. etc

I hope that makes it clear.

That's nice, but it doesn't add or diminish anything from my statement that Jesus offers us peace of mind, and that he has given me peace of mind.

 

[Xchristian]

Just before I answer that, the bible says a couple of things:

Mark 4:11: And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:
Mark 4:12: That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them.

Even though jesus wasn't saying a parable at the time, ... but that contradicts John actually ..

[Jn 18:20][ Jesus answered, "I have spoken openly to the world; I have always taught in synagogues and in the temple, where all the Jews come together. I have said nothing in secret.]

What parables? ... that's accusing jesus of misleading people!

Having stated thus, it behooves a saint to know that ..

I thank you my Lord that I never believed in Santa ..

That's nice, but it doesn't add or diminish anything from my statement that Jesus offers us peace of mind, and that he has given me peace of mind.

Having you any supporting evidence that when whoever said; "prince of peace" he actually meant " .. of mind"?

 

[Pegg]

Pegg,

I beg you to please be objective.

Answer my own question, what you see me writing, not what you want to say irrespective of what I wrote, I will repeat again.

Moses said:


"And in case you should say in your heart: "How shall we know the word that Jehovah has not spoken?" When the prophet speaks in the name of Jehovah and the word does not occur or come true, that is the word that Jehovah did not speak..." Deuteronomy 18:20-22


PLEASE .. I BEG IT OF YOU

read the underlined bit.

Tell me about the jesus prophecies that haven't come true.

How long do I have to wait before I say, game's over, this is not a prophet.

just answer my question, don't give me your answers which are irrelevant.

THANK YOU

Jesus prophecies that have not come true are only a few....but that doesnt mean that they will not come true.

He said that in the future, God would resurrect all who had died. That hasnt happened yet.
He said that he would destroy Satan and take over rulership of mankind. That hasnt happened yet in full. Currently he rules only over the lives of true christians who willingly submit to his rule by bringing their lives into harmony with him.

Armageddon has not happened yet.... he said it would happen after a 'great tribulation' broke out upon the earth. That tribulation has not yet occured.


So yes, there are a few things that are yet to take place, but it doesnt mean they wont happen. What you should focus on is what is happening right now! He didnt give his apostles a day or hour, but he did give them a 'sign' to tell them when he was ruling in the kingdom. And that sign is everywhere, in every nation on earth.

 

[Xchristian]

Jesus prophecies that have not come true are only a few....but that doesnt mean that they will not come true.
.

good good

Moses said judge this kind of person whose prophecies don't come true.

How long do you think we should give him before obeying the OT and judging him?

please answer in as short number of words as possible.

 

[Pegg]

good good

Moses said judge this kind of person whose prophecies don't come true.

How long do you think we should give him before obeying the OT and judging him?

please answer in as short number of words as possible.

I think you should look at the prophecies that are holding true right now because some of his prophecies relate to the time AFTER certain things have occured.

They were not all going to occur at the same time. There is a due process and that process comes in stages.

 

[Xchristian]

Pegg, please don't stop now..

how long do we have to wait?

it's a very simple question.

 

[Conståntine]

Even though jesus wasn't saying a parable at the time, ... but that contradicts John actually ..

[Jn 18:20][ Jesus answered, "I have spoken openly to the world; I have always taught in synagogues and in the temple, where all the Jews come together. I have said nothing in secret.]

What parables? ... that's accusing jesus of misleading people!

Jesus speaking openly in this sense means that he spoke publicly. It has nothing to do with speaking in parables. Again, that is a weak argument.

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I thank you my Lord that I never believed in Santa ..

Of no concern to myself.

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Having you any supporting evidence that when whoever said; "prince of peace" he actually meant " .. of mind"?

Philippians 4:7: And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.

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Moses said judge this kind of person whose prophecies don't come true.

????

I would like to see where this was stated.

 

[Wherenextcolumbus]

thats the difference between reading a prophecy in the bible and trying to understand it, and creating your own prophecies as if you are a prophet claiming to speak Gods message.

the WT are the former, they try to understand the bibles prophecies....they dont create new ones.

Just wanted to be sure you understood the difference.

The bible says we won't know when the end of the world will come, so by trying to predict a date that is making a false prophesy. Jehovah witness sold their houses and other belongings because they thought their organisation was inspired by God and that these predictions will come true. Do you believe sometimes the governing body is inspired of God and sometimes they are not?

 

[Xchristian]

Jesus speaking openly in this sense means that he spoke publicly. It has nothing to do with speaking in parables. Again, that is a weak argument.

Your view, can't help you.

Philippians 4:7: And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.

I am not talking about Paul who never saw jesus Constantine, try to concentrate.

This is an irrelevant passage that has nothing to do with an OT statement,

jesus is not god, jesus is a jewish peasant that paid for his mistakes.

I would like to see where this was stated.

Read my posts please

 

[Conståntine]

Your view, can't help you.

I didn't require your assistance in any event, but thank you.

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I am not talking about Paul who never saw jesus Constantine, try to concentrate.

Try to concentrate more on reading up on pertinent subjects in the bible before presenting your arguments, lest they be torn to shreds.

(Paul speaking)
I Corinthians 9:1: Am I not an apostle? am I not free? have I not seen Jesus Christ our Lord? are not ye my work in the Lord?

Acts 9:1: And Saul, yet breathing out threatenings and slaughter against the disciples of the Lord, went unto the high priest,
Acts 9:2: And desired of him letters to Damascus to the synagogues, that if he found any of this way, whether they were men or women, he might bring them bound unto Jerusalem.
Acts 9:3: And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven:
Acts 9:4: And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?
Acts 9:5: And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.

So much for your argument there. Now moving on.....

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This is an irrelevant passage that has nothing to do with an OT statement,

So....? Was it supposed to have something to do with the old testament writings? And if so, why?

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jesus is not god, jesus is a jewish peasant that paid for his mistakes.

Jesus is a God to all those whom are subject to him, which includes myself. He may not be your God, but don't presume to speak on my behalf.

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Read my posts please

I did, which prompted me to ask you for clarification in the first place. And I am still lacking scriptural clarification. Where does it say that Moses required prophets to be judged on the basis of whether or not their prophecies came to pass?

 

[Xchristian]

(Paul speaking)
I Corinthians 9:1: Am I not an apostle? am I not free? have I not seen Jesus Christ our Lord? are not ye my work in the Lord?

No you haven't, simples ....


This is attested in Acts ... check below ..

That verse is Polycarbus stuff, exrapolated to oppose the Lukan Passage below ..

check here:

Acts 9:1: And Saul, yet breathing out threatenings and slaughter against the disciples of the Lord, went unto the high priest,
Acts 9:2: And desired of him letters to Damascus to the synagogues, that if he found any of this way, whether they were men or women, he might bring them bound unto Jerusalem.
Acts 9:3: And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven:
Acts 9:4: And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?
Acts 9:5: And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.


See? he fell to the earth ... only a voice ... pretty good hallucination stuff ...

So....? Was it supposed to have something to do with the old testament writings? And if so, why?

I know you lose logic a lot ...

if you remember, this prince of peace allegation is from Isaiah 9:6, I told you it has nothing to do with jesus of nazareth, I told you the reasons too.

You can't simply use a Marcionite character, namely Paul to change what is written in the 4 gospels.

check here:

[Is 9:6][ For a child has been born for us, a son given to us; authority rests upon his shoulders; and he is named Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.]

the child has ALREADY been born ...
Authority on his shoulders ... jesus was a poor peasant
Name wonderful counselor ... highly unlikely

all nothing to do with the poor executed man

Jesus is a God ...

back to irrational thinking ...

I did, which prompted me to ask you for clarification in the first place. And I am still lacking scriptural clarification. Where does it say that Moses required prophets to be judged on the basis of whether or not their prophecies came to pass?

I will not help you, I am sorry, I have done enough of that, read well, and you will find it, respect.

 

[Conståntine]

No you haven't, simples ....


This is attested in Acts ... check below ..

That verse is Polycarbus stuff, exrapolated to oppose the Lukan Passage below ..

check here:

Acts 9:1: And Saul, yet breathing out threatenings and slaughter against the disciples of the Lord, went unto the high priest,
Acts 9:2: And desired of him letters to Damascus to the synagogues, that if he found any of this way, whether they were men or women, he might bring them bound unto Jerusalem.
Acts 9:3: And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven:
Acts 9:4: And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?
Acts 9:5: And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.


See? he fell to the earth ... only a voice ... pretty good hallucination stuff ...

Your rambling makes no sense here. Be more specific with regards to what you are speaking of concerning a voice. Try to frame your arguments clearly. And if you are asserting that Paul didn't see Jesus in this instance, then that does not automatically mean that he never saw Jesus at any other point in time, and I would love to see you prove otherwise.

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if you remember, this prince of peace allegation is from Isaiah 9:6, I told you it has nothing to do with jesus of nazareth, I told you the reasons too.

Yes, I am aware of the fact that you have cited reasons. Evidenced by your claim that Paul never saw Jesus is the fact that your statements do not necessarily reflect reality and/or credibility.

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You can't simply use a Marcionite character, namely Paul to change what is written in the 4 gospels.

check here:

[Is 9:6][ For a child has been born for us, a son given to us; authority rests upon his shoulders; and he is named Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.]

the child has ALREADY been born ...

????

It pays to put things in their proper context. If you are going to lecture me on grammar, then read carefully:

Isaiah 9:6: For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
Isaiah 9:7: Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.

This is a prophecy, pertaining to an event that God planned to have occurred in a time subsequent to the recording of those two scriptures.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Authority on his shoulders ... jesus was a poor peasant
Name wonderful counselor ... highly unlikely

all nothing to do with the poor executed man



back to irrational thinking ...

If you say so.

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I will not help you, I am sorry, I have done enough of that, read well, and you will find it, respect.

Fine with me. I am quite familiar with what Moses said on the matter in any event. I assume your silence on the matter is somewhat akin to pleading the Fifth.

 

[Xchristian]

Your rambling makes no sense here. Be more specific with regards to what you are speaking of concerning a voice. Try to frame your arguments clearly. And if you are asserting that Paul didn't see Jesus in this instance, then that does not automatically mean that he never saw Jesus at any other point in time, and I would love to see you prove otherwise.

ok here's a question that will help you ..

can you tell me exactly what paul/saul saw? {with supporting scripture evidence}

Please don't tell me he saw god, ... you know god can't be seen .. he's like white smoke or something.

thanks in advance for wasting a few years

Yes, I am aware of the fact that you have cited reasons. Evidenced by your claim that Paul never saw Jesus is the fact that your statements do not necessarily reflect reality and/or credibility.

Have a look here:

Location: Acts 9 [RSV]
Narrator: Luke
Audience: general
(3) Now as he journeyed he approached Damascus, and suddenly a light from heaven flashed about him.
(4) And he fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to him, "Saul, Saul, why do you persecute me?"
(5) And he said, "Who are you, Lord?" And he said, "I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting;
(6) but rise and enter the city, and you will be told what you are to do."
(7) The men who were traveling with him stood speechless, hearing the voice but seeing no one

Location Acts 22 [RSV]
Narrator: Paul
Audience: an angry crowd
(6) "As I made my journey and drew near to Damascus, about noon a great light from heaven suddenly shone about me.
(7) And I fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to me, `Saul, Saul, why do you persecute me?'
(8) And I answered, `Who are you, Lord?' And he said to me, `I am Jesus of Nazareth whom you are persecuting.'
(9) Now those who were with me saw the light but did not hear the voice of the one who was speaking to me.

Location Acts 26 [RSV]
Narrator: Paul
Audience: King Agrippa
(13) At midday, O king, I saw on the way a light from heaven, brighter than the sun, shining round me and those who journeyed with me.
(14) And when we had all fallen to the ground, I heard a voice saying to me in the Hebrew language, `Saul, Saul, why do you persecute me? It hurts you to kick against the goads.'
(15) And I said, `Who are you, Lord?' And the Lord said, `I am Jesus whom you are persecuting.
(16) But rise and stand upon your feet; for I have appeared to you for this purpose, to appoint you to serve and bear witness to the things in which you have seen me and to those in which I will appear to you,


Other than the irreconcilable problem of the people around him ..
every time they talk of it, the author is keen to show us that paul/saul fell on his face, there's a lightening light ...

Sunstroke anybody? .. hallucination stuff , wonderful

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????

It pays to put things in their proper context. If you are going to lecture me on grammar, then read carefully:

Isaiah 9:6: For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
Isaiah 9:7: Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.

This is a prophecy, pertaining to an event that God planned to have occurred in a time subsequent to the recording of those two scriptures.

Pity you are using a very dodgy translation .. the correct tenses are in the copy I gave you.

I know you can't trust that book anyway, but you have to this time.

Fine with me. I am quite familiar with what Moses said on the matter in any event. I assume your silence on the matter is somewhat akin to pleading the Fifth.

good that you know, how long time is enough for you to say, that's it, I had it, that bloke was a fake as Moses commanded?

I put this question to another person before, now it's your turn, waste a few years.

cheers and respect.

 

[Pegg]

The bible says we won't know when the end of the world will come, so by trying to predict a date that is making a false prophesy. Jehovah witness sold their houses and other belongings because they thought their organisation was inspired by God and that these predictions will come true. Do you believe sometimes the governing body is inspired of God and sometimes they are not?

I've been over this subject and discussed it with JW's who went through it, and what happened in 1975 was not due to information printed by the governing body... it wasnt the watchtower or any of our literature promoting the idea that 1975 would mark the end. Unfortunately, it was speculation among indiviudals within the organization that caused it.

The information coming from the Governing body by means of the WT articles did not promote the idea but spoke of using caution with regard to putting dates on things.....

In 1968 an article was published about bible chronology...by then, there was already talk of 1975 as being a special year, but the article stated this:

Why Are You Looking Forward to 1975? WT 1968

WHAT about all this talk concerning the year 1975? Lively discussions, some based on speculation, have burst into flame during recent months among serious students of the Bible. Their interest has been kindled by the belief that 1975 will mark the end of 6,000 years of human history since Adam’s creation. The nearness of such an important date indeed fires the imagination and presents unlimited possibilities for discussion.
2 But wait! How do we know their calculations are correct? What basis is there for saying Adam was created nearly 5,993 years ago?
by the end of the article, the brothers state this: Our chronology, however, which is reasonably accurate (but admittedly not infallible), at the best only points to the autumn of 1975 as the end of 6,000 years of man’s existence on earth. It does not necessarily mean that 1975 marks the end of the first 6,000 years of Jehovah’s seventh creative “day.” Why not? Because after his creation Adam lived some time during the “sixth day,” which unknown amount of time


I believe that the Governing Body is most certainly inspired by God...they are christs followers, they adhere to the scriptures and to Christs directions and for that reason they are blessed by Jehovah with his holy spirit. That doesnt mean that God gives them 100% complete knowledge of all things, and they admit that openly.