jesus helped how??

[waitasec]

Possibly, but I don't think Jesus was actually looking for war. He was hoping that God himself would intervene.

Many Jews, I believe, were not actually looking for war with the Romans, simply because they were aware of what would occur. The same thing had happened various times already. But for the Kingdom of God to take place on the Earth, Rome would have to be defeated.

Over time though, there is evidence that the idea changed because it was forced to. Jesus' prophecies didn't come to pass, so they had to be reinterpreted. Again, the prophecies failed, and more reinterpretation.

it's just hard to discern what this person called jesus actually intended...
the revolt did happen after his death. so perhaps there was a growing tension between the romans and the jews when jesus was around because of what you said (highlighted).

 

[Muffled]

I like how Christians assume that since Christianity didn't work for someone, then they didn't do it right, or they weren't Christians in the first place. I can give you details about my conversion experience, and the life I lived as a Christian. I can give you details about the prayers I prayed to help me change. I can give you details about everything I did as a Christian, in the spirit of Christianity. And none of it worked. With Buddhism, it was almost instantaneous. Well, for some of the bigger things. I still have work to go, but I now have the tools to do it. As far as AA goes, that's not a religious organization, at least not Christian, so it would be pointless to try to say that would be Jesus helping, when I could just as easily say it was Krishna, Mohammed, or any other religious figure.

Since you can give the details please do so because I don't assume anything. I know that it works for me. Therefore I wish to explore what you may have done differently since you have different results. On the other hand you may not have done anything differently and God had a different plan for you to become a Buddhist. He does strange things sometimes so I wouldn't be surprised.

AA is quasi-religious in that it recognises a higher power. It has varying degrees of success but anyone that I have ever met from the program has the highest regard for the 10 steps program.

 

[Muffled]

That's incorrect. We attacked Iraq first. They did nothing to us. As for Afghanistan, they were terrorists. Labeling them Muslims does nothing to help, as it wasn't Islam that caused them to attack us.

Iraq was a terrorist nation. Although we were not attacked directly by Iraq, we were indirectly attacked when Iraq attacked Kuwait which is a source for oil for the US.

I don't believe that Islam is responsible for wars any more than I believe that Christianity is responsible for wars. All I am saying is that the problems today do not arise from Christian nations. Of course it is always possible that a Christian nation could raise up a leader like Hitler having been deceived by that person but that is not symptomatic of the Christian religion but is symptomatic of Satan who does his best to deceive people.

 

[Muffled]

and I will say, murder/rape/and robbery still go on EVERYWHERE...and that doesn't include the jealousy/hate/anger that STILL go on....sure seems like nothing has changed, does it??

Nothing has changed for those who are not Christian and those people are still in the world. It is like Bush and terrorist attacks. The terrorists are still there but Bush made sure we didn't suffer attacks. However no-one takes notice when there isn't an atack but only when there is one. It is the same with christianity. People who have become Christians sin less but you do not see that because all you notice are those who do sin.

For instance: There are thousands of Roman Catholic priests who have no problem with sexual sin but you don't hear about them, you only hear about the ones with a problem.

 

[dyanaprajna2011]

Since you can give the details please do so because I don't assume anything. I know that it works for me. Therefore I wish to explore what you may have done differently since you have different results. On the other hand you may not have done anything differently and God had a different plan for you to become a Buddhist. He does strange things sometimes so I wouldn't be surprised.

AA is quasi-religious in that it recognises a higher power. It has varying degrees of success but anyone that I have ever met from the program has the highest regard for the 10 steps program.

I was "saved" at 14 years of age at a Free Will Baptist youth camp during spring vacation. I stayed with the Free Will Baptist church until i was 17, when I joined the Assemblies of God. I stayed with them for 3 years. After that, I toyed with the occult for a few years, eventually going back to the Assemblies of God. I stayed with them for another year and a half, before joining the Southern Baptist church. I was Southern Baptist for about 6 months, before I decided there had to be something else to Christianity. After studying everything I could for a little over a year, I joined the Greek Orthodox church. This is the church I stayed with, even though I was an IFB for a little while, and the last church I was a part of was the United Methodist. One thing that I struggled with, that seemed to be the main vice in my life, was lust and sexual immorality (in the form of masturbation). I prayed, daily, that God would take this vice away from me. I studied and memorized Bible verses that deal with this issue. I constantly repeated them to myself throughout the day. After becoming Greek Orthodox, I had it in mind to become a monk. But I still struggled with my vice, and now even moreso. After about a year, I ended up getting married. This eased the struggle some, but it still was there. After my divorce earlier this year, I went back and forth between Christianity and Islam. While as a Christian, my prayers were devoted mostly to getting over the pain of the separation (it was unwanted on my end, she says it was on hers, but I don't know). And my pain got worse. I prayed that God would show me His will in what I was going through. I prayed that if it was HIs will, that me and my ex get back together. I prayed for the pain to go away, and to learn what God was trying to teach me in it. I never got any answers, and I never received any help. After converting to Buddhism, I began to have less problems with my lust. I began to get over my ex-wife, realizing that whether or not we did or do end up getting back together, it doesn't really matter either way. And even my intense anger against my step-father has nearly subsided. And I wasn't even focusing on that. Buddhism has helped me understand not only the world in general, but my own place in it, and my experiences, and the things I go through, why I go through them, and how to deal with them.

 

[fallingblood]

Iraq was a terrorist nation. Although we were not attacked directly by Iraq, we were indirectly attacked when Iraq attacked Kuwait which is a source for oil for the US.

Iraq was not a terrorist nation. Yes, they had a dictator, who went to war with various nations. That does not make them terrorists, or even a threat to us.

As for Kuwait being a source of oil for the U.S., so was Iraq. The problem was not that Kuwait was being attacked, but it was that Saddam would then control more. He would have more power, as well as control of the sea border. And even then, it doesn't make Iraq terrorists for going to war with another country. It makes them expansionists, just like the United States was.

I don't believe that Islam is responsible for wars any more than I believe that Christianity is responsible for wars. All I am saying is that the problems today do not arise from Christian nations. Of course it is always possible that a Christian nation could raise up a leader like Hitler having been deceived by that person but that is not symptomatic of the Christian religion but is symptomatic of Satan who does his best to deceive people.

There are no completely Christian nations, so your point is moot. Of course something that doesn't exist can't cause wars. However, there are many Christian motivated attacks and the such.

 

[Blackdog22]

I would say that Jesus did claim to bring peace on earth, but indirectly. If your a Bible believing Christian then you likely believe that Jesus was God. If God, "really" spoke to the prophets then God/Jesus exclaimed he would bring peace and called himself the Messiah in the Old Testament, of course Jesus never fulfilled his own word.

Their are really only a few ways to understand this. Either Jesus/God never spoke to any prophets and thus the basis for a messiah is dead, or Jesus/God did speak to the prophets and proved himself invalid by way of not fulfilling his own word to himself.

Either way, it just makes God look rediculous.

 

[israelite32]

are false MESSIAHs supposed to change the world? theres plenty of proof that jesus was not the MESSIAH so you shouldnt xpect so much from a guy who fell so short of his promises.do christians and muslims even know what the MESSIAH is supposed to accomplish when he comes? jesus was no different than any other false MESSIAH! SHALOM

 

[fallingblood]

are false MESSIAHs supposed to change the world? theres plenty of proof that jesus was not the MESSIAH so you shouldnt xpect so much from a guy who fell so short of his promises.do christians and muslims even know what the MESSIAH is supposed to accomplish when he comes? jesus was no different than any other false MESSIAH! SHALOM

Muslims don't think of Jesus as the Messiah. They find him to be a prophet, and it is quite likely that if there were any prophets, he is just as likely to be one.

More so, he didn't claim to be the Messiah. And he didn't fall very short of his promises. Because he wasn't trying to fulfill the Messianic promises.

 

[fallingblood]

I would say that Jesus did claim to bring peace on earth, but indirectly. If your a Bible believing Christian then you likely believe that Jesus was God. If God, "really" spoke to the prophets then God/Jesus exclaimed he would bring peace and called himself the Messiah in the Old Testament, of course Jesus never fulfilled his own word.

Their are really only a few ways to understand this. Either Jesus/God never spoke to any prophets and thus the basis for a messiah is dead, or Jesus/God did speak to the prophets and proved himself invalid by way of not fulfilling his own word to himself.

Either way, it just makes God look rediculous.

That only works though if one assumes that Jesus is God. It would be hard to prove that Jesus ever claimed such. Actually, as far as I am aware, there is no credible evidence that Jesus ever claimed such a thing. If he had, the Jews would have had a case against him, as in calling himself God would have been blasphemous. Yet, we see no sign of that in the Gospel accounts. A charge of blasphemy is brought up against Jesus, but it is basically dropped, and it did not revolve around the idea of Jesus being God.

So without a convincing argument that Jesus is God, one can not assume that what he (Jesus) said or did reflects on the ideas of God, or vice versa.

 

[Blackdog22]

I agree Failing Blood, if Jesus isn't God then my statement makes no sense, however if Jesus isn't God or part of God then he can't be the messiah.

On whether Jesus exclaimed to be God, he actually does claim to be God, something that surprises a lot of people. I will post the verses below:

"Your father Abraham rejoiced as he looked forward to my coming. He saw it and was glad." The people said, "You aren't even fifty years old. How can you say you have seen Abraham?" Jesus answered, "I tell you the truth, before Abraham was even born, I Am!" At that point they picked up stones to throw at him. But Jesus was hidden from them and left the Temple.4

The Father and I are one." Once again the people picked up stones to kill him. Jesus said, "At my Father's direction I have done many good works. For which one are you going to stone me?" They replied, "We're stoning you not for any good work, but for blasphemy! You, a mere man, claim to be God."5

Jesus shouted to the crowds, "If you trust me, you are trusting not only me, but also God who sent me. For when you see me, you are seeing the one who sent me.

Jesus told him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one can come to the Father except through me. If you had really known me, you would know who my Father is. From now on, you do know him and have seen him!" Philip said, "Lord, show us the Father, and we will be satisfied." Jesus replied, "Have I been with you all this time, Philip, and yet you still don't know who I am? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father! So why are you asking me to show him to you?"8

 

[BIG D]

Nothing has changed for those who are not Christian and those people are still in the world. It is like Bush and terrorist attacks. The terrorists are still there but Bush made sure we didn't suffer attacks. However no-one takes notice when there isn't an atack but only when there is one. It is the same with christianity. People who have become Christians sin less but you do not see that because all you notice are those who do sin.

For instance: There are thousands of Roman Catholic priests who have no problem with sexual sin but you don't hear about them, you only hear about the ones with a problem.

so there are no wars/muder/rape of christians???60 million killed AFTER christ came??there are no wars???

 

[fallingblood]

so there are no wars/muder/rape of christians???60 million killed AFTER christ came??there are no wars???

Was that all caused by Christians? Did they commit those atrocities because of Christ? No. Again, you whole point fails as it is supporting nothing logical.

 

[BIG D]

Was that all caused by Christians? Did they commit those atrocities because of Christ? No. Again, you whole point fails as it is supporting nothing logical.

we still have murder/rape/robbery/natural disasters/wars/etc....obviously, christ did not change any of these things...so, I'll give him a big 3 out of 10 for greatness

 

[Civil Shephard]

we still have murder/rape/robbery/natural disasters/wars/etc....obviously, christ did not change any of these things...so, I'll give him a big 3 out of 10 for greatness

One things for sure... Christ didn't change free will in thoughts or actions. But then I think thats what I like most about him.

 

[fallingblood]

we still have murder/rape/robbery/natural disasters/wars/etc....obviously, christ did not change any of these things...so, I'll give him a big 3 out of 10 for greatness

And again, why should he have? Where does he state he was going to do so? Did he not in fact state the opposite?

Your argument is based on ignorance. You are assuming that "Christ" was meant to bring an end to all of the evil in the world. There is no suggestion of this though. Jesus never even implies such a thing, and actually states the exact opposite. That being so, any point you are trying to make is completely moot.

 

[BIG D]

And again, why should he have? Where does he state he was going to do so? Did he not in fact state the opposite?

Your argument is based on ignorance. You are assuming that "Christ" was meant to bring an end to all of the evil in the world. There is no suggestion of this though. Jesus never even implies such a thing, and actually states the exact opposite. That being so, any point you are trying to make is completely moot.

what 'GREAT' things did he do??..we hear so much of his greatness and how he will save people

 

[BIG D]

One things for sure... Christ didn't change free will in thoughts or actions. But then I think thats what I like most about him.

free will is a whole other topic....which I've posted on...

 

[fallingblood]

what 'GREAT' things did he do??..we hear so much of his greatness and how he will save people

And this just shows you haven't actually read what I've posted in the past, which I already suspected.

 

[bhaktajan]

Originally Posted by BIG D
we still have murder/rape/robbery/natural disasters/wars/etc....obviously, christ did not change any of these things...so, I'll give him a big 3 out of 10 for greatness

Wait!

The panty-waisted nerd-lords have declared that such miscrents should not be "executed" because they have a soul that survives after death [as occurred and demonstrated by Christ's Pastimes on earth 2,000 years ago].

Thanks to Christ, its harder and harder to lower our taxes because every victim that lived through criminal exchanges is responsible to maintain those criminal in prison, or, such victim, by threat of law be made accountable and fined for neglect.

So many new varieties of victims that must grow up and acquire well-paying jobs to subsidise the killers of the parents! ---don't you know?