Jesus - Son of Adam?

[paarsurrey]

The same way He created animals out of nothing.

The Arch-Angel Gabriel understood this when he said
Luke 1:37 [Full Chapter]
"For with God nothing shall be impossible."

Luke was not there when Jesus was born to Mary. What was his source of information, please?
Animals are created by G-d, that doesn't make G-d the father of animals. Right, please?

Regards

 

[nPeace]

i think that bible is multi spiritual level teaching book, but it structured in a way of evolution of consciousness which outlined in 1Cor 13. From looking like through dark dim glass to perfect understanding though knowledge ( Gnosis).

I think we can agree on this.
I like how Jesus put it, again, in Matthew 13
Verse 12 - For whoever has, more will be given him, and he will be made to abound; but whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken from him.

This said, right after he says this...
"To you it is granted to understand the sacred secrets of the Kingdom of the heavens, but to them it is not granted."

So. Well done. Good observation.
I can see you do a lot of studying, and thinking.

 

[nPeace]

Jesus - Son of Adam?

Yes, Jesus was son of Mary from the progeny of Adam.

How do we know if this is true?

Jesus was not god or son of god in literal and physical terms.

How do we know if this is true?

And it demonstrates Paul's-Pagan-Christianity wrong.

How do we know if this is true?

Right, please?

Regards

No please.

___________
[6:101]وَ جَعَلُوۡا لِلّٰہِ شُرَکَآءَ الۡجِنَّ وَ خَلَقَہُمۡ وَ خَرَقُوۡا لَہٗ بَنِیۡنَ وَ بَنٰتٍۭ بِغَیۡرِ عِلۡمٍ ؕ سُبۡحٰنَہٗ وَ تَعٰلٰی عَمَّا یَصِفُوۡنَ ﴿۱۰۱﴾٪
And they hold the Jinn to be partners with Allah, although He created them; and they falsely ascribe to Him sons and daughters without any knowledge. Holy is He and exalted far above what they attribute to Him!
[6:102]بَدِیۡعُ السَّمٰوٰتِ وَ الۡاَرۡضِ ؕ اَنّٰی یَکُوۡنُ لَہٗ وَلَدٌ وَّ لَمۡ تَکُنۡ لَّہٗ صَاحِبَۃٌ ؕ وَ خَلَقَ کُلَّ شَیۡءٍ ۚ وَ ہُوَ بِکُلِّ شَیۡءٍ عَلِیۡمٌ ﴿۱۰۲﴾
The Originator of the heavens and the earth! How can He have a son when He has no consort, and when He has created everything and has knowledge of all things?
[6:103]ذٰلِکُمُ اللّٰہُ رَبُّکُمۡ ۚ لَاۤ اِلٰہَ اِلَّا ہُوَ ۚ خَالِقُ کُلِّ شَیۡءٍ فَاعۡبُدُوۡہُ ۚ وَ ہُوَ عَلٰی کُلِّ شَیۡءٍ وَّکِیۡلٌ ﴿۱۰۳﴾
Such is Allah, your Lord. There is no God but He, the Creator of all things, so worship Him. And He is Guardian over everything.
The Holy Quran - Chapter: 6: Al-An`am

How do we know if this is true?

The Quran is not older than the Bible, and points to the Bible. So why would one believe the Quran when it contradicts the Bible? The Bible is by far older than it.

 

[nPeace]

In our method of numbering it is correct to call Christ the second adam. But God is not interested in our method. He is calling Christ the Last Adam because, as you say, there will never be another representing the human race. If we call Him the second adam, we imply that there will be more. And God is being clear that there won't be.

If you want to use the term 'second' then you rightfully use it on Christ Who is the 'Second Man'. Now explain that math to me. Because Christ was not the second man in the normal method of counting. Cain was. So, how is Christ the Second Man? It has nothing to do with Him being the Last Adam. That is already established.

I do hold to the Trinity, God The Father, God The Son, and God The Holy Spirit.

Good-Ole-Rebel

If God is not interested in our methods, then why would you think he is interested in the methods used to arrive at your view of the Trinity?
He never said anything even close to Trinity - God The Father, God The Son, and God The Holy Spirit.

 

[Desert Snake]

When Mary received the spoken word of God through Gabriel.

That is an interpretation.

 

[nPeace]

Jesus was the son of Joseph or some other human guy that Mary had it off with before she married. Adam, if he had existed, would have been long dead.

How do you know this?
I have never read this. Where did you read it?

You have no evidence to substantiate that statement.

Yes please, we do. You have read it.
Where is your evidence?

There is no evidence any god exists.

Yes there is.

The Bible is a very human creation, the writers stretches their imaginations to the limit, imo.

You know this?
Interesting. How is it, you know, and we don't?
Oh. In your opinion. That makes sense.

We have every reason to believe that your opinion is wrong, and evidence that the Bible, though put together by humans, into one book, is really a collection of writings, that were, in truth and in fact, "inspired by the divine creator", as stated in 2 Timothy 3:16, and 1 Peter 1:21, 22

Would you like to see that evidence, and learn how we know it is truth?

 

[JJ50]

How do you know this?
I have never read this. Where did you read it?


Yes please, we do. You have read it.
Where is your evidence?


Yes there is.


You know this?
Interesting. How is it, you know, and we don't?
Oh. In your opinion. That makes sense.

We have every reason to believe that your opinion is wrong, and evidence that the Bible, though put together by humans, into one book, is really a collection of writings, that were, in truth and in fact, "inspired by the divine creator", as stated in 2 Timothy 3:16, and 1 Peter 1:21, 22

Would you like to see that evidence, and learn how we know it is truth?

It is no more credible than the Harry Potter books, which are a more interesting read.

 

[nPeace]

Luke was not there when Jesus was born to Mary. What was his source of information, please?

We don't know of any early historians that ever challenged Luke's account. There is no valid reason for us to doubt his account.
Actually, Luke was a companion of the apostle Paul just two decades after the Messiah.
This makes his information more reliable than later historians, including Josephus.

Animals are created by G-d, that doesn't make G-d the father of animals. Right, please?

Regards

Why not, please?

The Bible says of God... (James 1:17) . . .Every good gift and every perfect present is from above, coming down from the Father of the celestial lights, who does not vary or change like the shifting shadows.
What does that mean?

 

[nPeace]

It is no more credible than the Harry Potter books, which are a more interesting read.

Perhaps you forgot to add... imo.
Certainly, I would accept that that is how you feel about it, and from your response, you are not open to seeing anything that would make you uncomfortable with that feeling.
That doesn't seem very agnostic to me. It seem to be more Atheistic.
Have you already made up your mind against God, and anything related to a supreme being?

 

[Desert Snake]

No.

Ben Adam means 'man' all around. 'son of god', what Jesus calls Himself, doesn't mean 'ben adam'.
•
'Son of Man', the title, means contextually, "like the son of man". It literally doesn't mean, what it reads like. The meaning there is 'like a son of man, (a ben adam, yet isn't a literal son of man.'

 

[Desert Snake]

'Our father' means 'our god', it isn't like there is a literal father then son thing going on, its all in a description context.


Is a description of 'one god'.

 

[Kenny]

Luke was not there when Jesus was born to Mary. What was his source of information, please?
Animals are created by G-d, that doesn't make G-d the father of animals. Right, please?

Regards

Luke 1:2 Even as they delivered them unto us, which from the beginning were eyewitnesses, and ministers of the word; Luke wrote down what the eyewitnesses told him. Much the same as the Quran - men who wrote down what Mohammad said.

My point is that God can create. It isn't "impossible" for God to create a body even as He created Adam.

As far as son... The Apostle John said

John 1:12
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

I also am a son of God. And God didn't need a woman to create a new spirit inside of me. Jesus said, "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

When I accepted Jesus as my Lord, I am born again of God and became His child and part of His family. My sins were washed away and I became a new creature (one created again in His image and in His likeness--like unto Adam).

So God does not need to cohabitant with a woman to create a new spiritual being even as "nothing is impossible for God" when He created a body that was going to be called Jesus without the need of a sperm for Adam was not created from a sperm.

 

[JJ50]

Luke 1:2 Even as they delivered them unto us, which from the beginning were eyewitnesses, and ministers of the word; Luke wrote down what the eyewitnesses told him. Much the same as the Quran - men who wrote down what Mohammad said.

My point is that God can create. It isn't "impossible" for God to create a body even as He created Adam.

As far as son... The Apostle John said

John 1:12
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

I also am a son of God. And God didn't need a woman to create a new spirit inside of me. Jesus said, "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

When I accepted Jesus as my Lord, I am born again of God and became His child and part of His family. My sins were washed away and I became a new creature (one created again in His image and in His likeness--like unto Adam).

So God does not need to cohabitant with a woman to create a new spiritual being even as "nothing is impossible for God" when He created a body that was going to be called Jesus without the need of a sperm for Adam was not created from a sperm.

NOT CREDIBLE!

 

[Kenny]

That is an interpretation.

I don't think so. But there is room for you to have your interpretation.

 

[Kenny]

NOT CREDIBLE!

Well, it is credible for me.

 

[Good-Ole-Rebel]

If God is not interested in our methods, then why would you think he is interested in the methods used to arrive at your view of the Trinity?
He never said anything even close to Trinity - God The Father, God The Son, and God The Holy Spirit.

You're a follower of Christ, you say. But your name is nowhere to be found in the Bible. But you can deduce from the words such as 'any' or 'whosoever' etc. etc. that you are truly a follower of Christ.

There is no verse that says 'God is a Trinity'. But I understand the Truth of the Trinity through the use of various verses in the Bible.

So, tell me how is Christ the Second Man?

Good-Ole-Rebel

 

[JJ50]

I don't think so. But there is room for you to have your interpretation.

The god of the Bible is a human creation and does not exist outside the human mind, you cannot prove otherwise.

 

[Desert Snake]

I don't think so. But there is room for you to have your interpretation.

Ben adam doesn't mean the same thing as 'son of man'. Son of man, doesn't mean son of man, in this context, "the Bible", it means 'like the son of man', god incarnation, 'the Lord', incarnation.

That isn't fully human my friend. It's a 'god', we just call Him god.

 

[Kenny]

Ben adam doesn't mean the same thing as 'son of man'. Son of man, doesn't mean son of man, in this context, "the Bible", it means 'like the son of man', god incarnation, 'the Lord', incarnation.

That isn't fully human my friend. It's a 'god', we just call Him god.

I don't agree...

I prefer the understanding of a Jewish interpreter, who was schooled in scriptures, of what was written when he said, "Who, although being essentially one with God and in the form of God [possessing the fullness of the attributes which make God God], did not think this equality with God was a thing to be eagerly grasped or retained,7 But stripped Himself [of all privileges and rightful dignity], so as to assume the guise of a servant (slave), in that He became like men and was born a human being. AMPC - emphasis mine.

In essence, he became man to operate legally in the earth and take back the authority that the first Adam gave away.

Addendum: Yes, I know that Adam and son of man does not mean the same. There are many titles for Jesus. Second Adam, Lamb of God, Son of Man, Lord, Master, God, and more... all expressing who He is.

Just as there is YHWY Shalom, Rapha, Rohi, Jireh, Tsidkenu, etc from the Tannakh that express who God is (which incidentally are also part of the expressions of Jesus too).

 

[Desert Snake]

In essence, he became man to operate legally in the earth and take back the authority that the first Adam gave away.

Genesis 3:12-13

It was Eve's 'sin'. Adam was there, yet the context informs, it was Eve who sinned. Otherwise, why is Eve questioned about it specifically.

So, your interpretation concerning redemption, is already a problem, aside from other things.