jesus was a magician!

[Bishka]

its quite clear that jesus was a magician, nothing more, nothing less, many other magicians has proven this by doing exactly as jesus did, they just dont claim to be the son of god, thus they dont get crucified!

Actually it's not clear at all the Jesus was a 'magician' as you put it.

What if He was the Son of God (which I believe)?

Why is He a 'magician'?

 

[Super Universe]

[FONT=&quot]Just like to point out one thing (in case you didn't catch it), if we are the children of god, then therefore, the children of ours is also children of god, and if he allows us to abandon them, he in turn abandons as well..... (Hopefully I wrote that right! )

Ok, enough said, - I will spend the next few days 'remembering' how to walk on water by making my body less dense!

- CappA[/FONT]

You are really stuck on this place aren't you? You think the whole gigantic universe is supposed to make humans happy? It's not about you, and it's not about human children.

What human lives forever? None. What human takes riches and glory with them to the afterlife? None.

Souls choose to incarnate into beings. Sometimes they choose specific challenges to learn from them. That is the purpose of the third dimension, we are a life experience school ground for developing ascending beings.

No one can truly do harm to you. The only lasting harm is what you do to yourself.

 

[Peace]

Sadly, as hard as I try to believe what you so whole-heartedly express, I fail to answer the question; If GOD is capable of everything, then, why, do young innocent children around this majestic world suffer and face hunger on a daily basis, why is it that hatred between the worlds religions result in such death and destruction?

Perhaps, my friend, we need to change the way we view GOD and examine humans instead.

I still repeat and believe that God is capable of everything, but we human beings should do something. God created the universe and the earth and what it contains. He created all the provisions for us, so it is we that should help each other. If the rich help the poor and the needy there wouldn't be children dying of hunger. It's our responsability not God's. This earth is not paradise, we are to be tested, we are here to work and tire and do our best to accomplish the best in this life and the life to come.

Concerning the Topic, and what was posted, I have but this to say; walking on water was great, but in the long run, what did it actually accomplish?
-CappA

It's not the Prophet's fault that people go astray and change the message. All the Prophets of God come with a message of peace and tolerance, for God is peace and love, but some people are always tend to distort the beautiful message.

Peace

 

[Smoke]

I couldn't answer the poll, because I didn't like the question or the answers. "Was Jesus anything more than a magician?" implies that he was a magician, and I'm not convinced that he was.

I see Jesus primarily as a Jewish teacher of religion and ethics. As a Galilean and as a follower of John the Baptist he emphasized different aspects of the Jewish tradition than many other Jewish teachers, including his contemporaries who are the spiritual ancestors of modern Judaism, but I think he fits comfortably within the Jewish tradition, if not the Orthodox Jewish tradition. His teachings are also interesting and significant for being subversive of the political and social expectations of his day.

Was he a magician? I doubt it.

Of the miracles recounted in the canonical gospels, about two-thirds are healings or exorcisms. That kind of miracle isn't unheard of across a wide range of cultures and religious traditions, and doesn't seem so strange to me. That kind of spiritual healing is usually the resolution of something that could well be psychosomatic, and as Kathryn Kuhlman used to say, if people receive psychosomatic healings from psychosomatic illnesses, that's a good thing, isn't it? But I've never seen a documented case where anybody re-grew a severed limb or anything dramatic like that. Even the less dramatic miracles are relatively rare. According to Wikipedia, over 200 million people have visited Lourdes since 1860, of that number, the Roman Catholic Church has certified 67 miracles. Not the greatest odds; your chances of being healed at Lourdes are about the same as your chances of being killed by a mountain lion. Most of the pilgrims to Lourdes feel that they bring something worthwhile away from the experience, though, and far be it from me to say they don't. No doubt the number of people healed by Jesus was a relatively insignificant number compared to those who weren't healed, but his hearers nevertheless found something worthwhile in his teaching.

The more fantastic miracles seem likely to be legendary accretions, like the story of George Washington and the cherry tree, or the story of St. Nicholas resurrecting the three boys in a barrel. The miracles recounted in John are probably best understood in a metaphorical sense. Regardless, I don't miracles are the important thing about Jesus.

But on the subject of miracles, is there anybody else who's always thought the story of Elijah and the widow's son sounds a little like CPR?

 

[darkpenguin]

After spending time reading the bible and praying , I am now convinced that Jesus was a real historical person who performed genuine miracles. To say that Jesus was a magician is merely an assumption, unless darkpenguin can actually demonstrate how he rose from the dead after being buried for 3 days, turning water into wine, walking on water, raising the dead, replacing a severed ear, healing lepers, making the blind see, etc.. I would love for him to show me how these were actually done, because if he can, than he would easily put copperfield, blaine, and criss angel to shame.

ok here we go, first of all can you explain to me how we know jesus was actually dead in the cave without blind faith and believing in a book? assuming he wasnt dead its quite possible to survive for that long, david blaine has done it 2 times, been burried alive and being susspended in a see through box, crazy stunts they may have been but he proved it can be done, the human body is quite capable of doind so! heck he and chriss angel can also levitate now i dont know the bible through and through but i dont think i remember jesus doing that one! as long as the space and time around the body can be manipulated which i believe it can, then we can do almost anthing, thus the walking on water, as for the water/wine, david blaine and many other magicians can also turn inanimate objects into other things they were not, david made money appear out of a tramps cup from nowhere! the blind seeing, how can we simply assume on gods word (or whoever wrote the bible) and blind faith that these 'ill' people wernt just like the actors sometimes placed around magicians? i dont think i am convinced by any arguments on here that are pro christ, and you can say im wrong however may times you want, but what makes you right? peace people!:rainbow1:

 

[Quoth The Raven]

ok here we go, first of all can you explain to me how we know jesus was actually dead in the cave without blind faith and believing in a book? assuming he wasnt dead its quite possible to survive for that long, david blaine has done it 2 times, been burried alive and being susspended in a see through box, crazy stunts they may have been but he proved it can be done, the human body is quite capable of doind so! heck he and chriss angel can also levitate now i dont know the bible through and through but i dont think i remember jesus doing that one! as long as the space and time around the body can be manipulated which i believe it can, then we can do almost anthing, thus the walking on water, as for the water/wine, david blaine and many other magicians can also turn inanimate objects into other things they were not, david made money appear out of a tramps cup from nowhere! the blind seeing, how can we simply assume on gods word (or whoever wrote the bible) and blind faith that these 'ill' people wernt just like the actors sometimes placed around magicians? i dont think i am convinced by any arguments on here that are pro christ, and you can say im wrong however may times you want, but what makes you right? peace people!:rainbow1:

I believe you forgot the 'Nya nanee nana.'

 

[darkpenguin]

lol that made me smile raven, i think after that post i could have had every right to but alas im just too modest, although it does seem to be my most thought out argument since posting on here, usually words tend not to agree with me but when they do thats when the magic happens!
thanks for your words of encouragement!
p.s i like your pick im guessing its a take on the llama song?

 

[Yerda]

After spending time reading the bible and praying , I am now convinced that Jesus was a real historical person who performed genuine miracles.

While I can not say your conclusions are wrong, I think perhaps you've reached them too early Genna, or I've overlooked something big. In my perusal I've encountered meager evidence for a historical Jesus, let alone the one depicted by the biblical authors.

To say that Jesus was a magician is merely an assumption, unless darkpenguin can actually demonstrate how he rose from the dead after being buried for 3 days, turning water into wine, walking on water, raising the dead, replacing a severed ear, healing lepers, making the blind see, etc.. I would love for him to show me how these were actually done...

The simplest answer is that they weren't...

 

[angellous_evangellous]

its quite clear that jesus was a magician, nothing more, nothing less, many other magicians has proven this by doing exactly as jesus did, they just dont claim to be the son of god, thus they dont get crucified!

Doesn't it make more sense that Jesus was a teacher of the Old Testament who didn't do anything special aside from disturbing the peace - he didn't need to claim to be the Son of God to be crucified - all the Romans cared about was the pax Romana. If Jesus caused commotion in Jerusalem, which was known for its religious rioting and rebellion, by including Gentiles and marginalized Jews into Judaism, he could be done away with quite easily.

The crucifixion story is actually more believable than the miracles. We know that the Romans actually practiced this and they had no qualms about doing it to Jews who caused trouble. The miracle stories, having no historical basis, may well have been an after-thought.

 

[Yerda]

usually words tend not to agree with me but when they do thats when the magic happens!

Once you discover the secrets of punctuation, and can apply the mysteries of grammar we'll be really onto a song!

 

[MaddLlama]

although it does seem to be my most thought out argument since posting on here,

Wow.....that really isn't saying much to you skills of presenting an argument.

usually words tend not to agree with me but when they do thats when the magic happens!

Good, let's work on punctuation, capital letters and grammar first. Then we can move on to vocabulary.

thanks for your words of encouragement!

Apparently sarcasm also eludes you. Raven was not trying to encourage you at all.

 

[Yerda]

Wow.....that really isn't saying much to you skills of presenting an argument.

Dude, that is a cheap shot.

 

[MaddLlama]

Dude, that is a cheap shot.

Sometimes, it pays to be cheap.

 

[Real Sorceror]

ok here we go, first of all can you explain to me how we know jesus was actually dead in the cave without blind faith and believing in a book? assuming he wasnt dead its quite possible to survive for that long, david blaine has done it 2 times, been burried alive and being susspended in a see through box, crazy stunts they may have been but he proved it can be done, the human body is quite capable of doind so! heck he and chriss angel can also levitate now i dont know the bible through and through but i dont think i remember jesus doing that one! as long as the space and time around the body can be manipulated which i believe it can, then we can do almost anthing, thus the walking on water, as for the water/wine, david blaine and many other magicians can also turn inanimate objects into other things they were not, david made money appear out of a tramps cup from nowhere! the blind seeing, how can we simply assume on gods word (or whoever wrote the bible) and blind faith that these 'ill' people wernt just like the actors sometimes placed around magicians? i dont think i am convinced by any arguments on here that are pro christ, and you can say im wrong however may times you want, but what makes you right? peace people!:rainbow1:

Wait, wait, wait........you believe its possible for people to levitate and perform real magik....yet you can't believe that Jesus was able to perform any miracles or magik?
How is it such a big jump?

 

[cardero]

Though I do not know if I would refer to Jesus as a magician, I do know a that I appreciate his showmanship.

 

[MaddLlama]

Wait, wait, wait........you believe its possible for people to levitate and perform real magik....yet you can't believe that Jesus was able to perform any miracles or magik?
How is it such a big jump?

We're not talking about "magik" like pagan magic. Magicians like Criss Angel and David Blaine is all smoke and mirrors. It's stage magic, not "magik" or "majik" or however the heck you want to spell it.

 

[Real Sorceror]

We're not talking about "magik" like pagan magic. Magicians like Criss Angel and David Blaine is all smoke and mirrors. It's stage magic, not "magik" or "majik" or however the heck you want to spell it.

I know, but read Darkpenguin's post agian:

ok here we go, first of all can you explain to me how we know jesus was actually dead in the cave without blind faith and believing in a book? assuming he wasnt dead its quite possible to survive for that long, david blaine has done it 2 times, been burried alive and being susspended in a see through box, crazy stunts they may have been but he proved it can be done, the human body is quite capable of doind so! heck he and chriss angel can also levitate now i dont know the bible through and through but i dont think i remember jesus doing that one! as long as the space and time around the body can be manipulated which i believe it can, then we can do almost anthing, thus the walking on water, as for the water/wine, david blaine and many other magicians can also turn inanimate objects into other things they were not, david made money appear out of a tramps cup from nowhere! the blind seeing, how can we simply assume on gods word (or whoever wrote the bible) and blind faith that these 'ill' people wernt just like the actors sometimes placed around magicians? i dont think i am convinced by any arguments on here that are pro christ, and you can say im wrong however may times you want, but what makes you right? peace people!

Ok, unless he is being sarcastic, then he believes in real magik.(you just switch the "c" for a "k", its' easy )

 

[MaddLlama]

Well, then you're both wrong, because Criss Angel's levitation trick is just that....a trick. He's not actually flying, nor is he "manipulating the fabric of time and space around him". Criss is a showman, and a good one if he's convinced anyone that he can actually fly. And, making things appear and disappear is no more impressive, once you actually know how all these things are done.

 

[Real Sorceror]

Doesn't it make more sense that Jesus was a teacher of the Old Testament who didn't do anything special aside from disturbing the peace - he didn't need to claim to be the Son of God to be crucified - all the Romans cared about was the pax Romana. If Jesus caused commotion in Jerusalem, which was known for its religious rioting and rebellion, by including Gentiles and marginalized Jews into Judaism, he could be done away with quite easily.

The crucifixion story is actually more believable than the miracles. We know that the Romans actually practiced this and they had no qualms about doing it to Jews who caused trouble. The miracle stories, having no historical basis, may well have been an after-thought.

Thats one of the reasons that its so easy for me to believe that Jesus was a real historical person. I mean, its incredibly common for legendary people to have crazy things attributed to them during their lives and after their death. Jesus just happens to have more than most.
Just think of the whole business with the battle of Troy. Its now believed to have really happened, yet most of the things we "know" about it are mythology and legend.

 

[Real Sorceror]

Well, then you're both wrong, because Criss Angel's levitation trick is just that....a trick. He's not actually flying, nor is he "manipulating the fabric of time and space around him". Criss is a showman, and a good one if he's convinced anyone that he can actually fly. And, making things appear and disappear is no more impressive, once you actually know how all these things are done.

No, I agree with you. Those people are just performing tricks of the eye. I was just pointing out that DP seems to believe that they are real. It just seemed ironic to me that DP would believe in real magik but dismiss Jesus as a fake.